Taurus Judge owners

[Patriotme]

I have to admit the Taurus Judge is a cool concept and interesting gun. I don't know what I would do with one but it's just one of those things that's pretty cool. I suppose it would be a great gun to put in my airplane as I fly over the Alaskan wilderness but I don't live in Alaska or have an airplane. Bummer.
Anyway.... I was wondering what kind of spread you get with buckshot at 10, 15 and 25 yards. What is the accuracy like with slugs and .45 Long Colt? I've heard the rifling is kind of light....any keyholing?
Why would you pick this gun over a nice 4" .357?
Finally, if a manufacturer somehow brought out a modern version of a LeMat in a double action revolver and .410 or 20 ga as the lower barrel would anyone buy it?

 

[rhinoh]

Holy cow this topic has been beat to death but here goes-
My main reason- excellent snake gun that is, believe it or not, much easier to tote while wandering around my property than a full size shotgun!
That is my main reason- all your other questions, except maybe the LeMat one, have been answered ad nauseum, search 'em out.
BTW no point in slugs in a Judge IMHO, just use boolits.

 

[Patriotme]

Every question has been answered before somewhere. That doesn't mean that there aren't new forum members or new Judge owners that can offer new insight. If every thread was answered by some fool saying, "Look it up somewhere else" this would be a very boring site.

 

[Knotthead]

Taurus Judge versus The Box O' Truth

 

[Patriotme]

Thanks for the post. I've got a friend that's been talking about buying the Judge for defense. I'll pass along the link.

 

[ganymede]

I don't personaly own a judge, but i would want one. However, every review i have ever read about the gun suggests that the .410 shot shell from the guns 3-6 inch barrel is fairly ineffective agianst a human size target. It makes some nasty looking patters on shoot n' see targets, but the wounds are supperficial. probobly 95% of attackers are going to rethink their actions after being shot in the face with number 7 1/2 birdshot, but it isn't going to physicaly impare the person. If someone is too angry and/or drugged up to feel the pain, you might have just pissed them off off even worse. Whats worse is after about 10 feet or so the shot patern becomes so wide, most of the pellets are going to miss the target. I was very dissapointed to read so many negative reviews about the guns defensive capabilities, but sometimes the truth sucks. the newer 3" chambered version might work beter though.

perhaps they could come out with a 28 gauge 3" chamber version of the judge? that would likely suffer less problems. Is that even possable to do legally?

to answer you question, at 10 yards i think you get something like a 6 foot spreed for buckshot with the judge. pretty crappy.

 

[rhinoh]

Every question has been answered before somewhere. That doesn't mean that there aren't new forum members or new Judge owners that can offer new insight. If every thread was answered by some fool saying, "Look it up somewhere else" this would be a very boring site.

Thanks for calling me a fool, thats real "HighRoad".
BTW there are 22 PAGES of threads about the "Taurus Judge" on THIS site.
So who is the fool?

 

[ganymede]

I cant help but point out the fact that RH implied calling someone a fool on THR is unacceptable, and then implied that person was a fool. But i agree, while patriotme might have a good point, we can do this without name calling

 

[Patriotme]

Hmmm....there seems to be page after page on M1911's and at least dozens of pages on the AR. I guess these topics are closed forever. Oh yeah, the first gun purchase topic has been done and home defense handguns threads are repeated over and over.
No more repeats on any topic at any time.
So sayeth Rhinoh.

 

[ganymede]

Up this early on christmas morning on THR arguing at each other? my god don't we have families? where's the love?

 

[weregunner]

Let's get back on topic, shall we?:banghead:
For the scoop on the Taurus Judge there is this.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=468543
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=466092

 

[mgkdrgn]

Thanks for the post. I've got a friend that's been talking about buying the Judge for defense. I'll pass along the link.

Also pass along that these guys couldn't even be bothered to purchase the correct ammo for the gun, and did their "testing" at 10 yards ... which is 3X the distance of 95%+ of all self defense shootings.

It didn't make a decent corn beef on rye either, but I guess they ran out of time to report that.

 

[mgkdrgn]

I don't personaly own a judge, but i would want one. However, every review i have ever read about the gun suggests that the .410 shot shell from the guns 3-6 inch barrel is fairly ineffective agianst a human size target. It makes some nasty looking patters on shoot n' see targets, but the wounds are supperficial. probobly 95% of attackers are going to rethink their actions after being shot in the face with number 7 1/2 birdshot, but it isn't going to physicaly impare the person. If someone is too angry and/or drugged up to feel the pain, you might have just pissed them off off even worse. Whats worse is after about 10 feet or so the shot patern becomes so wide, most of the pellets are going to miss the target. I was very dissapointed to read so many negative reviews about the guns defensive capabilities, but sometimes the truth sucks. the newer 3" chambered version might work beter though.

perhaps they could come out with a 28 gauge 3" chamber version of the judge? that would likely suffer less problems. Is that even possable to do legally?

to answer you question, at 10 yards i think you get something like a 6 foot spreed for buckshot with the judge. pretty crappy.

If you are "defensivly" shooting someone at 10 yards, you are more than 3X further away than 95%+ of self defense shootings. You had better have a =very= good lawyer.

Also, 7.5 shot is far from the ideal for HD use even out of a full size shotgun. If you are going to use shot as a "diswader", go #4 or bigger. A face full of #4 =might= not kill someone, but if they decide to press the attack blind and with no nose, I don't think they will be much of a threat.

Other than that, stick with the 000 buck loads with maybe a 45 colt chaser. They are more than capable of getting the job done. From my personal experience, the spread at 8 paces keeps 3 x 000 buckshot balls all well on a human size target with the Winchester loads. The newer federal loads are even tighter.

 

[denster]

With some of the standard .410 ammo on the market many of the problems reported with the Judge are right on. With the new Federal Premium .410 handgun loads in #4 and 000 buck it is a whole new ball game. With 45 Colt ammo it will never be a target gun but it will put all of them center mass out to 25yds. I make holsters so I have one of each 2&1/2, 3in mag, and Public Defender. Try the Federal it will make you see the Judges in a different light as a defensive weapon and trail gun.

 

[gbran]

Dad has the Judge. He's in NV. I'm in CA and can't have one, but would if I could. I've really tested his. Here's what I found. The BoxOTruth folks I think tested it at 10 yds. I found this too far to trust it to SD. My guess is that at 3-5 yds it might be a man stopper. I think a better way to look at it would be to ask yourself whether you'd rather have a Judge or pepper spray. The Judge would win hands down.

Another observation has to do with pain. Without regard to it's lack of manstopping ability, I'd guess it would be really painfull to take a #4 shot to the face or torso. Probably more painful than many common pistol calibers. It would take a really determined zombie to continue his aggression taking shot from the Judge.

While I'd like to have one, it would not replace my SD guns, but it sure would go to the woods with me.

 

[Pyzon]

I have owned one for year or more, a 3" chamber "magnum" model, 4" stainless.

With 600 rounds of all kinds of ammo here is my report:

1.) For home or vehicle defense, the buckshot loads work. And just to agree with the others, consider that by far most encounters are likely to be at less than 7 yards. My personal favorite are home rolled 3" hulls with 40 pellets of lead BB. No over penetration fears for somebody down the hall, decent penetration except through really heavy winter apparel.
2.) Slugs suck. Just like they do in a .410 long barrel.
3.) .45 Colt works just fine. 5 rounds inside a 4" circle. Nothing to complain about here.

The box of truth "study" was flawed from the beginning due to a lack of 2.5 " ammo, and lots of improved ammo has been invented strictly for the Judge since then.

 

[230therapy]

I am not impressed with the Taurus Judge.

1) The gun jammed twice with the 410 shells. The gun locked up and the cylinder would not move. We had to work it a bit in order to get the cylinder open again.

2) 410 Buckshot...yuck! It had too much spread at only 7 yards...24" or so on average when aiming at the center of an IDPA target.

3) The gun worked fine with 45 Colt. It fired very tight groups at 5 and 7 yards with all 5 rounds touching. These were standard 255 grain lead flatpoints.

If I were going to get a gun in 45 Colt, it wouldn't be a Judge...I'd get a gun made for the cartridge.

 

[Palehorseman]

Wife got her 3" cylinder Judge about a year ago, and she really likes it.

1) Anything smaller than #4 shot found to be a bad go, unless stuck in someone's face. #4 shot, nasty at close range, less so further out. But, was surprised when chucked a pop can out around 10' and started popping away. each shot kicked it on down range until about 30' for 5th shot. I told the wife no way could it now be hit, POW, pop can leaped into the air with authority. More testing convinced me that with the 3" #4 shot loads, the pistol went from close range snake work, to a bunny gun out to around 7-10 yds with consistancey.

2) 000 buck, the 5 pellets in the 3" versus 3 of same in the 2.5" was quite revealing. A man sized paper target on 1/2" plywood at 15' or under with the 3" 000 load, convinced me a person would be smarting and leaking severely. With 3" load of 000 at 5', a plastic gallon milk jug full of water literally exploded. I understand that the Federal 2.5" personal defense load for the Judge and etc is four 000 hardened copper coated buckshot. Hoping they come out with 3" PDL with six 000.

3) As to the factory loaded slug, I agree it is rather a weak sister compared to .45 LC with a 255 grn. boolit. But, the standard factory lightweight slug load is not the end all of it for a 410. When we lived in Alaska 40 yesars ago, the youngest daughter did a lot of spruce hen hunting aroung the home place with a Stevens Little Pet break open 410 single. As there was other unfriendly critters about, I got a Lyman 350 grn. 410 slug mould (discontinued now) and the old Lyman reloading manual listed hotter loads well above 1,000 fps. Wish I still had the mould, but it and gun both got legs and disappeared somehow.

But, there is a company that makes hot 410 slug loads today, and they are no pikers indeed, about on par with with a 45-70 and lighter loads are supposed to be within S.A.A.M.I. specs (13,500 psi) for 3" 410 shot shell pressures. I know of bow hunters in Wyoming who use the judge for urinated griz back up with .45 LC heavy boolits and hot loads running up to 21,000 psi, which is about on par with a standard .45 acp load.

Check it out: http://www.hoeningbigboresouth.com/Big410Ballistics.html

 

[ganymede]

cool i didnt know they had come out with ammo that works better for the judge. I think that gun just moved up a few spots on my list of guns i need What's the spread like at 10 feet with the new number 4 and 00 loads?

 

[MCgunner]

I still think I'd rather just have a .45 Cotl snubby. I got no use for .410 out of the judge, though it's no doubt effective at home defense ranges. I don't find my .38 lacking in the home defense roll, don't need to fix anything there. And, I've killed a lot of snakes with a .22LR. They ain't hard to hit. I've side stepped a lot more snakes that I really saw no need to kill. Rattlers are pretty tasty, though. If you can't hit a snake with standard .45 colt, it's a big case for stuffing full of number 7.5 and capping with a gas check. For playing with a shotgun in the field, I find my full choked 10" TC Contender barrel much more useful.

People seem to like the things, just not on my list of wants or needs.

 

[MCgunner]

BTW, as for the gun tying up with .410 loads, much of that is the fault of cheap steel head ammo. The new Federal buckshot loads uses BRASS for the brass and has no such problems, no stiff extraction.

 

[Dimis]

the box o truth link has been beaten to death for anyone doubting the judges effectivness in SD just ask yourself "do you want to get shot with one?" as my sig states no one wants to stand in front of a judge ive had mine since the very first magnum 3" models hit shelves ive only had one problem with it and that was with ammo not the gun

as for what i bought it for... just the heck of it honestly its a fun gun for me if i had to use it to defend myself would i feel undergunned?
heck no 45colt or 410buck at normal defencive ranges is going to suck for whoever gets hit with it and if one shot doesnt do it i have four more lined up leave the one shot one kill mantra for snipers in the handgun world nearly 80% of handgun wounds are survivable and if i remember correctly its not killing power its stopping power and those terms are not interchangable we as upstanding gun owners are given the right to STOP a threat not just out and out kill them if the threat is deterred your done... if the threat is killed as a consiquence of them pursuing to do you imminent harm thats a different matter

i have found as others have stated that the judge makes a great snake gun i can throw it on my hip while outside and leave my hands free to move firewood or whatever i want unlike a slung shotgun or even worse laying it out of reach because it became too heavy or slides around too much

the judge having no room on the gunmarket is rediculous just look at how many of them taurus has sold (enough to make SEVERAL model types including the new public defender) and just like i tell people when they say that .22 or .25ACP isnt good enough for SD "would you take a shot without worry?" the answer is allways a resounding NO

i have a feeling that the judge will be debated as long as 9mm vs .45ACP has been

 

[redneckrepairs]

I got the wife one last year and we love it . IMHO it is a " niche " gun that works well for us . We Farm/Ranch and it stoked with .410 is just the thing to hang on your belt building fence or when working around prairie dog towns and other areas prone to having rattlers . I have never seen anything as portable and effective on snakes ( 12 over the summer ) Loaded with the .45 Long Colt it has worked fine to put down an injured bull with plenty of accuracy for an immediate humane kill from about 15 yards . The pistol would not be my " first " choice as a self defense weapon , but i would by no means call it inadequate if loaded with .45 . Blackhawk is now making a sherpa holster for the judge and i got one for the bride for Christmas due to the easy on/off of the paddle setup when fixing fence , running to town , wadeing weeds to equipment , running to town , ect.. lifestyle we have .