This nails it shut - Norinco

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romulus said:
For anyone like me who over the years has either purchased or considered purchasing a Chinese knockoff, this latest action from the US govt. should at least give pause for reflection.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4563214.stm

China North Industries is better known to us as Norinco.

Just something to think about.
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I'd been disgusted at them back when they started making knockoffs of American-as-apple-pie shotguns, especially.

Something wrong about buying an implement of freedom from a communist-controlled repressive regime that silences (literally, and often fatally) any form of dissent. :scrutiny:
 
The two Indian companies are Sabero Organics Chemical and Sandhya Organics Chemical and the Austrian firm is Steyr-Mannlicher, which makes assault weapons.
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I find the mention of Steyr-Mannlicher to be more interesting then Norinco, which is barred from the U.S. firearms market anyway. If they are supplying AUG's to Iran we may start seeing them in Iraq - being used by the other side.

As to the question, "can they make (anything) under license in the U.S.?" The answer is probably no, because it's unlikely BATF&E would issue any license, and they couldn't import parts anyway. For the time being, Steyr-Mannlicher won't be able to do any business in the United States. Truly sad... But they apparently ask for this. :banghead:
 
Will this effect the guns China makes that are of interest to Cowboy Action Shooters?

I've often been tempted to buy one of the Chinese copies of the Winchester 1887 lever action shotgun, but my insides wouldn't let me.
China also makes copies of the 1897 Winchester, and the 1878 Colt double barrel shotgun (TNT?), that I know of.
 
Will this effect the guns China makes that are of interest to Cowboy Action Shooters?
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Very likely - because they won't be able to get a license to export them to the United States, and U.S. importers won't be able to get the necessay permits to import them. I suspect that in a very short time the supply will be limited to whatever is in-country.
 
Old Fuff said:
Very likely - because they won't be able to get a license to export them to the United States, and U.S. importers won't be able to get the necessay permits to import them. I suspect that in a very short time the supply will be limited to whatever is in-country.
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I doubt it. There was an import ban on Norinco arms just recently (2003?), and the supply of 1897's, 870-clones, etc, never even paused. They are able to shell-game around the import ban with different company names (Interstar, etc). Same gun, different markings = OK for import, I guess.
 
It's amazing how only certain items are banned .:fire: Hell, 70% of Consumer Goods in the U.S. is marked some how, some where " Made In China". For instance, I've had an interest in purchasing a new Norinco M14S. (http://www.marstar.ca/gf-norinco/M-14S.shtm) I'm told there not available in the U.S. due to a Government Ban of its Import. To me, you Ban All or Ban Nothing!Discrimination? Hypocrisy?... ABSOLUTELY! And what excuse has our so-called pro-gun President GW given for not lifting the Norinco M14A Ban?
 

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ScottS:

The basis for banning certain Norinco models in the past, was that they were "not suitable for sporting purposes," in other words SKS models that took detachable large-cap magazines, semi-automatic AK-47 clones, copies of our 1911 .45 pistol, and firearms of that nature. This new ban is based on they're sending weapons to Iran, and is likely to be all-inclusive. You may turn out to be right, but I doubt it.

Other (U.S.) companies could try an end-run like you suggested, but if they get caught the management could end up looking at the world through barred windows... :scrutiny:
 
Manedwolf is right.

If a country does not allow their populace to "Keep and Bear arms" then screw them. They shouldn't be allowed to sell their wears in the U.S. It would also have the pleasant effect of helping the American Gun Industry.

That is my two cents anyway.
 
mbt2001 said:
Manedwolf is right.

If a country does not allow their populace to "Keep and Bear arms" then screw them. They shouldn't be allowed to sell their wears in the U.S. It would also have the pleasant effect of helping the American Gun Industry.

That is my two cents anyway.
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You know, there's really a lot to be said for that idea.

Look at how many countries make guns that their own citizens cannot own.

True, all guns would be a lot more expensive, but we'd have the satisfaction of knowing we were helping our neighbors instead of some repressive foreign gov't.
 
I personally wont buy anything chinese if I can avoid it at all.

But I think the beef here was why ban just firearms. Wal-mart's shelves should be awfully bare if a ban on chinese wares is in effect
 
Luchtaine said:
I personally wont buy anything chinese if I can avoid it at all.
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I have 2 SKS's but have never been able to convince myself to buy a Chinese one because of what we're talking about.:rolleyes:
 
getting around a chinese SKS is easy enough. :neener:

those come from a lot of places where I wouldn't feel my money was going toward nukes to point at us.
 
Old Fuff said:
ScottS:

The basis for banning certain Norinco models in the past, was that they were "not suitable for sporting purposes," in other words SKS models that took detachable large-cap magazines, semi-automatic AK-47 clones, copies of our 1911 .45 pistol, and firearms of that nature. This new ban is based on they're sending weapons to Iran, and is likely to be all-inclusive. You may turn out to be right, but I doubt it.

Other (U.S.) companies could try an end-run like you suggested, but if they get caught the management could end up looking at the world through barred windows... :scrutiny:
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I'm not talking about the "sporting purposes" ban. In May, 2003, Pres Bush instituted a ban on importing Norinco weapons because of missile technology sales. The ban amounted to nothing, as the supply of Norinco-produced shotguns didn't even slow down. That ban ran until May 2005. You notice any shortage of '97's or 870-clones in that time? Like I said, they just changed the name on the side, and pressed right on.

Here's an article describing what I'm talking about.

Bush Ban on Chinese Imports
Charles R. Smith
Wednesday, May 28, 2003
Chinese Arms Maker Gets Cut


The Bush administration has just imposed a two-year ban on imports from Chinese arms maker NORINCO (China North Industries). According to U.S. defense intelligence sources, President Bush imposed the restrictions personally.
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And another:

Of Red Parakeets and Dragon Fire: The Nonproliferation Case for Maintaining the EU Arms Embargo on China
by Matthew Schroeder

NORINCO has come under fire for other transfers, including the sale of missile technology to Iran. In May 2003 the Bush administration slapped a two-year ban on NORINCO imports as punishment for engaging in "missile technology proliferation activities."
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Hmmm...

It is my understanding that NORINCO is one of (if not) the largest manufacturing companies in the world.

I find it hard to belive that none of their other products are sold in America, does this ban apply to those products as well?
 
Steyr informed the US gov't that they would suspend the sales of their .50 anti-material rifles to Iran if they were permitted to sell semi-auto weapons in the US.The number of them sold to Iran would have been eclipsed within an hour if legal AUG's were available but there's no way they'd change to import ban to allow it.Austria has good relations with Iran and no defense ties to the US so it was and is entirely legal business.I'd much rather be able to buy a new semi-auto AUG than see the Revolutionary Guard have a few dozen .50's to pass out to Hizbollah et al.
 
Interesting, we'll have to see, and only time will tell. I think that the Administration/U.S. Government is getting more concerned about Iran and North Korea, and those who are supplying them. The slap at Steyr is a hint of this, as Austria is thought of as a “friendly to U.S. interests” country. The last thing they’ll worry about is the cowboy action shooters’ vote.

Edited to add: Norinco might try to set up manufacturing operations in certain South American countries though...
 
Steyr's CEO made a comment that it was necessary to move production of small arms out of Austria as ,to paraphrase, " I'm sick of being compared to a drug dealer or pimp" so it isn't even as though Austria is too happy with any arms sales.I guess cutting off the supply of Glocks to the US would be a snarky reply,but there would go something like 2/3 of their sales!
 
Hm, well, if Norinco can't import any more guns here, then it really can't help them any to own or purchase one secondhand, can it?

I might have an ideological objection to Ruger's stance on selling standard-capacity rifle magazines to peasants, but since I've already got a Mini-14, it doesn't really do them any good if I keep it or sell it, and it doesn't hurt them in the slightest if I throw it in the trash or give it to a friend. So if you see some dude at a Gun Show selling a Norinco SKS or a Norinco Shottie, why not buy it? It's not like any more money's going to get back to the commies.

Or have I totally misread whatever import bans/restrictions apply to Norinco stuff?

~GnSx
 
The other side of the coin is S&W has been anti 2nd Amendment in the past. Ruger has also not always been "pro" friendly. Kahr is owned by the son of the Moonies founder. Where do we stop????????????????

Kevin
 
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