Any thoughts or advice on the older surplus cz83 380acp ? Im considering a purchase in the near future but have never had the chance to shoot one . Seems like a solid little gun & I have been impressed with all other CZ pistols I've had the chance to shoot . One can be had for about $230.00 . Anybody that has personal experience with these have some words of wisdom for me ?
Thoughts on Surplus CZ 83 ?
- Thread starter alman
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armarsh
Member
Never owned an '83, but I dearly love the several '82's I have. Well made and very accurate.
This is something to consider. The CZ82 is identical in all practical respects but shoots a more powerful 9mm Mak. The 380 is much easier to purchase, however.
Either way I'm sure you will be pleased.
This is something to consider. The CZ82 is identical in all practical respects but shoots a more powerful 9mm Mak. The 380 is much easier to purchase, however.
Either way I'm sure you will be pleased.
Walt Sherrill
Member
If it's surplus, its more likely a CZ-82. Almost the same gun' the differences are trivial..
If it's a CZ-82, it is one of the most shootable 9x18mms that money can buy. Some like the Makarov better, but the 82/83 is a slightly larger, more sophisticated weapon -- with a double-stack mag that holds more rounds. Anything you might find about the 82 will also apply to the 83.
The CZ-83 is available in a number of calibers, but the 9x18 version is no longer imported. (Some can be found in .32 acp and .380, with .380 the most common.)
In near-new condition, you can find CZ-82s in the the sub-$200 range, while CZ-83s in the same shape will go for up to $100-$125 more. CZ-82s with some finish wear can be found in the $150 - $175 range; most of them are quite nice.
If the gun is local, and an 83, the price is good. If it's an 82, you can probably offer a bit less.
If it's a CZ-82, it is one of the most shootable 9x18mms that money can buy. Some like the Makarov better, but the 82/83 is a slightly larger, more sophisticated weapon -- with a double-stack mag that holds more rounds. Anything you might find about the 82 will also apply to the 83.
The CZ-83 is available in a number of calibers, but the 9x18 version is no longer imported. (Some can be found in .32 acp and .380, with .380 the most common.)
In near-new condition, you can find CZ-82s in the the sub-$200 range, while CZ-83s in the same shape will go for up to $100-$125 more. CZ-82s with some finish wear can be found in the $150 - $175 range; most of them are quite nice.
If the gun is local, and an 83, the price is good. If it's an 82, you can probably offer a bit less.
towboat_er
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CZ82 or 83 are great. I prefer the 82, and order my ammo online.
Words of wisdom.........Buy it
Words of wisdom.........Buy it
Having owned and loved (and sold 
) a Russian import Makarov pistol, I would suggest a 9X18mm CZ rather than .380ACP, especially now that you can get non-surplus ammunition. As much as I liked that Makarov, if I were to purchase a gun of that sort again it would be a CZ-82/83 in 9mm Makarov. But first, I need a CZ-75B.
And a CZ-97. And a CZ Kadet.
) a Russian import Makarov pistol, I would suggest a 9X18mm CZ rather than .380ACP, especially now that you can get non-surplus ammunition. As much as I liked that Makarov, if I were to purchase a gun of that sort again it would be a CZ-82/83 in 9mm Makarov. But first, I need a CZ-75B. And a CZ-97. And a CZ Kadet.
mgmorden
Member
I have the CZ-82 in 9mm Mak, which is the same gun except for the chambering.
My opinions: overall, the gun is very well built and is reasonably accurate. I like the double-stack mags as most guns in this range were single-stacks with smaller capacities. As far as negatives go, I do find the grips a bit wide even for a what it is, and the magazine release isn't easy to push. Overall, definately worth the money.
I will say that owning both this and two .380's, I kinda prefer the .380. Reloading components for .380 can be shared with 9mm Luger, and while 9mm Mak might be cheaper, I can find .380 in more retail stores. I also wouldn't ignore the fact that .380 guns are experiencing a bit of a renaissance and are being churned out like hotcakes right now, whereas 9mm Mak has basically run its course and is mostly a surplus pistol round now. Over time I'd expect - respective to each other at least - .380 prices to creep down and 9mm Mak to creep up.
My opinions: overall, the gun is very well built and is reasonably accurate. I like the double-stack mags as most guns in this range were single-stacks with smaller capacities. As far as negatives go, I do find the grips a bit wide even for a what it is, and the magazine release isn't easy to push. Overall, definately worth the money.
I will say that owning both this and two .380's, I kinda prefer the .380. Reloading components for .380 can be shared with 9mm Luger, and while 9mm Mak might be cheaper, I can find .380 in more retail stores. I also wouldn't ignore the fact that .380 guns are experiencing a bit of a renaissance and are being churned out like hotcakes right now, whereas 9mm Mak has basically run its course and is mostly a surplus pistol round now. Over time I'd expect - respective to each other at least - .380 prices to creep down and 9mm Mak to creep up.
I find this an interesting point of view, since when I owned my Makarov the only ammunition available was surplus Russian hardball with corrosive primers, and now at least two manufacturers make factory loads with modern defensive bullets, and I know reloading dies are available as well. It seems to me that 9mm Makarov is a more viable round than ever for a small, blowback-type defensive pistol. I don't know what the OP intends to use the gun for, but as a defensive round I would choose the 9mm Makarov over the .380ACP any day. Range use is a different situation.
mgmorden
Member
316SS: I wasn't referring to the ammo as surplus, but rather than the guns that shoot it are mostly all surplus guns that aren't being made anymore. They will eventually dry up and at that point I don't see a whole lot of new 9mm Mak guns being made, whereas there are still plenty of new .380's being made.
Given that the supply hasn't been exhausted yet, I don't think we've seen any side effects, but once those pistols are gone I'd expect the round overall to become a little less popular as time goes on.
I don't think it'll ever get to a point where you won't be able to feed one - I'm just saying that in 15 years I'd expect 9mm Mak won't be as common as it is now, and I'd expect .380 to still be on the shelves at Wally-World.
Given that the supply hasn't been exhausted yet, I don't think we've seen any side effects, but once those pistols are gone I'd expect the round overall to become a little less popular as time goes on.
I don't think it'll ever get to a point where you won't be able to feed one - I'm just saying that in 15 years I'd expect 9mm Mak won't be as common as it is now, and I'd expect .380 to still be on the shelves at Wally-World.
Walt Sherrill
Member
If you have a 9mm Mak CZ-82 or CZ-83 and ammo becomes scarce, you can swap to a .380 barrel. That's all that's needed - just the barrel. They use the same mags, but you get an extra round when loading .380. A gunsmith can do the swap, but it takes a special barrel press. (They're not real expensive.)
Shadow 7D
Member
Surplus ~$240ish (distributor/online)to 300+ (local gun shop) traditionally rifled barrel
New $450-500
82 about 200
it's a hell of a gun, just DON'T take it apart (detailed strip)
the slide release and hammer safety/sear spring are two KNOWN bitches, if you don't know how to install them, you will spend hours, if you DO know how to install them, you might spend hours....
New $450-500
82 about 200
it's a hell of a gun, just DON'T take it apart (detailed strip)
the slide release and hammer safety/sear spring are two KNOWN bitches, if you don't know how to install them, you will spend hours, if you DO know how to install them, you might spend hours....
It's hard to beat for that price and it is still made so spare parts are available. That it is superior to the Makarov is hardly surprising. One came out in late forties the other dates from early 80s. Comparing them would be like putting "long is the tooth" 1911 to SIG 220!
woad_yurt
Member
There are a lot of 9X18 guns out there already and probably a lot more that will surface. I suspect that people will still want to shoot them when the supply of guns does eventually dry up and they're going to be buying ammo. Presently, you can buy new ammo for .32 S&W, .32 S&W Long, .38 S&W, 7.62X25, etc, and some of those calibers have been out of fashion for 75 years.
OP: Go for the CZ 82. It's the same gun but with a little more horsepower. Also, don't forget that the ammo costs 1/2 as much as .380.
Shadow 7D
Member
What supply is exhausted?
they are still making the 83, I just bought parts from CZ-USA (and got the free sticker)
us makers are starting to make 9 Mak, and you can buy it by the 1000 round or what ever size tin can or case straight from Russia or Eastern Europe.
they are still making the 83, I just bought parts from CZ-USA (and got the free sticker)
us makers are starting to make 9 Mak, and you can buy it by the 1000 round or what ever size tin can or case straight from Russia or Eastern Europe.
The CZ 83 is fine choice. I have seen second hand commercial guns in mint condition for about $300. Always go with 9x17 instead of 9x18. The quality and selection of ammo will only improve and 50fps to 100fps of extra speed in 9x18 if available isn't worth a fart after bowl of pea soup. The only advantage to original cz82 is polygon rifled barrel with is easier to clean (TRUE) and am told longer lasting (not sure about that one but explanations made sense to me).
rellascout
member
Don't forget the cost... Nice CZ82s can be had for less than $180.
bigfatdave
Member
I disagree, Silver Bear JHP is cheap and expands fairly well, it is in fact cheap enough that one could only buy silver bear and practice with what they carry for defense.
Of course, alman doesn't give an intended purpose, if the intent is just as a range blasting toy, then the CZ82 (or 83) in 9x18 is better because ammo is cheap, and if it is intended as a carry gun or other defensive use, the CZ82 (or 83) in 9x18 is better because ammo is more effective and cheap.
Another thought, remember the nonsense after the last presidential election? It will probably re-occur after the next one, and 9x17 will be off the shelves again, so diversification and stocking up now are the smart moves.
If the OP (alman) reloads, then go with whatever is easier to work into your reloading setup, if you reload for neither, the reports of the CZ82 being designed for a hot sintered iron round might open up some interesting reloading possibilities with fast&light loads that wouldn't be practical with 9x17 ... I'm not a reloader, but my CZ82 is one of the many guns that tempt me to start, custom loads for it would be interesting.
mgmorden
Member
The conversation on exhausted supply was regarding 9mm Makarov pistols, not this particular model. The fact that the CZ-83 (.380) is still in production whilst the CZ-82 (9mm Mak) is not, only serves to further prove the point.
rellascout
member
Aren't all the part interchangeable even the barrel if you have the correct barrel tool so parts are not an issue and I am pretty sure that there are more CZ82s in current circulation than the # of CZ-83 in current circulation + the number being built today. It is not a big seller in the CZ lineup.
I certainly see more CZ82s for sale than I see CZ83s. YMMV
I personally got out of the 380 auto market because I am not into pocket pistols and the cost to feed them is almost as high as 45 ACP. Higher in some areas.
mgmorden
Member
Indeed, but we weren't discussing parts availability, but rather the long term availability of 9mm Mak ammo after all the surplused guns run out. Basically, I think the with .380 seeing an INCREASE in popularity, and 9mm Mak guns being mostly liquidated surplus that is quickly drying up, you'll see the price and availability situation of those two rounds flip flop in the coming years (and even today at most big-box retail stores you're still far more likely to find .380 than 9mm Mak).
Nothing against the Mak round - I own a CZ-82 myself in addition to 2 .380's (ironically a Makarov and a Ruger LCP). I just personally would bet on the .380 if I was only going to buy one or the other.
rellascout
member
IMHO the 380 auto mini gun fad has just about run its course. I personally think 2010 & 2011 will represent the height of the 380 auto sales so I don't see it as a growing market. With the 9mm mini poly guns coming out people will move to them and once again abondon the 380 auto.
On the other hand some of the biggest ammo factories in the world Tula and Brown/Sliver bear are cranking out Mak ammo cheaper than any 380 auto today. Its not just surplus ammo that is cheap. These cheap steel cased ammo was what these commie guns where designed around. As long as people are still shooting them these Russian ammo companies will keep making it.
So I see the them very much on equal footing.
Sorry , should have stated my intentions for the gun . It will be a carry gun first , range toy second . Economics do come into play here because I do like to play with all of my toys & that can be costly at times . Seems like a CZ-82 and 500 rounds out the door for under $300.00 is a pretty good deal . Thanks for all the input here. Makes a difference with a purchase when you"re not quite sure ...............
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