smitty03
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What mods are acceptable(recommended) for production class? I am very interested in competing and have a Glock G38 that I will be using...
USPSA Production class
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A Glock 38 would be a poor choice for USPSA shooting. Nothing the matter with the gun itself, it's just handicapped by how USPSA breaks down. You might find it a better fit in IDPA. If you must shoot in USPSA you'll find it is a VERY short list of allowable Mods to stay in Production. You can find the details HERE under rules.
smitty03
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3 gun
Thanks for the tip... I will be looking to add a trigger kit for obvious reasons; but how will changing the ejector springs/guide rod affect performance?
Thanks for the tip... I will be looking to add a trigger kit for obvious reasons; but how will changing the ejector springs/guide rod affect performance?
A G17, do the 25 cent trigger job, add a decent set of steel sights, some grip tape, a kydex holster and 5 mags with carriers. That is the ideal Production rig in my mind, and the one I use. If I wasn't partial to the 17 I would shoot a 34 for Production with the exact same mods and accessory list.
Leave the springs alone, leave the guide rod alone, leave the trigger alone aside from the light polishing. A Glock is accurate enough to win the nationals right out of the box, and stone reliable until someone starts tinkering with it. Reliable beats 'tricked out' by leaps and bounds in USPSA competition, ONE jam can cost you a match where all the gadgets and tricks in the world won't win one. Reliability should be your number one concern.
Leave the springs alone, leave the guide rod alone, leave the trigger alone aside from the light polishing. A Glock is accurate enough to win the nationals right out of the box, and stone reliable until someone starts tinkering with it. Reliable beats 'tricked out' by leaps and bounds in USPSA competition, ONE jam can cost you a match where all the gadgets and tricks in the world won't win one. Reliability should be your number one concern.
Scott, I use mainly factory for club matches, whatever is on sale when I am getting low.
Reloaded ammo is Zero JHP 147's with Tite-Group or Universal Clays most of the time. SR4756 is also a good choice, 231 will do a good job too if that is what you have on hand. Honestly, I have never worked very hard on 9mm ammo. I use whatever I have on hand instead of trying to find the best load and I usually have at least 8 pounds each of Tite-Group, Universal, Unique, Bullseye, Clays, etc.
With the consumption of handloaded 38, 40 and 45 here it is easier to buy 9mm than to handload it a lot of times. Factory 9mm is reliable, easily makes Minor PF, and is plenty accurate for action shooting. I do like the reloaded 147's a lot better, but finding the time to load them at a low savings rate is hard and especially hard when I cannot buy the 40 ammo I need for my Limited/L10 gun, 45 ammo for L10/SS, etc.
Reloaded ammo is Zero JHP 147's with Tite-Group or Universal Clays most of the time. SR4756 is also a good choice, 231 will do a good job too if that is what you have on hand. Honestly, I have never worked very hard on 9mm ammo. I use whatever I have on hand instead of trying to find the best load and I usually have at least 8 pounds each of Tite-Group, Universal, Unique, Bullseye, Clays, etc.
With the consumption of handloaded 38, 40 and 45 here it is easier to buy 9mm than to handload it a lot of times. Factory 9mm is reliable, easily makes Minor PF, and is plenty accurate for action shooting. I do like the reloaded 147's a lot better, but finding the time to load them at a low savings rate is hard and especially hard when I cannot buy the 40 ammo I need for my Limited/L10 gun, 45 ammo for L10/SS, etc.
i like 124s with WW320 or Tightgroup..the 147s are a close second..
otherwise..Winchester WhiteBox..
get a gun that runs..sights you can see, add some grip tape and you'll be good to go..
if you want action work after that..thats about it..
I used to shoota G34...and liked it a lot..I recently have been playing with CZs and really having some success with that setup..
otherwise..Winchester WhiteBox..
get a gun that runs..sights you can see, add some grip tape and you'll be good to go..
if you want action work after that..thats about it..
I used to shoota G34...and liked it a lot..I recently have been playing with CZs and really having some success with that setup..
I have not heard much about anyone using HK's? Is there a reason? Are there many other autoloader calibers in Producton class outside of 9mm (I'm showing my ignorance)? If not, I assume it is due to the kick a higher caliber gives vs. a 9mm.
Thanks
Thanks
Scott, you don't see many H&K's in USPSA around here regardless of class. Cost is part of it, ease of shooting is part, simplicity is part, aftermarket parts like sights is part, magazines are part. Glocks, XD's and CZ's are most popular here, and in that order. They have a lot going for them.
I am seeing more and more 40's in Production, with handloaded Minor power ammo. Minor 40 feels better to some guys than 9. To me it is definately softer recoiling, but almost makes the slide feel sluggish. Factory 40 or 45 in Production is a handicap that few will accept, the recoil is significantly more than a 9mm or minor handload.
I am seeing more and more 40's in Production, with handloaded Minor power ammo. Minor 40 feels better to some guys than 9. To me it is definately softer recoiling, but almost makes the slide feel sluggish. Factory 40 or 45 in Production is a handicap that few will accept, the recoil is significantly more than a 9mm or minor handload.
we have a couple of shooters in our section have and are shooting HKs..you just don't see many of them otherwise..
Like HSMITH said..Glocks and XDs..you will begin to see more CZs around too..other guns you may see one or two of are Smith 5906, Sig226, Beretta E2.
I have heard minor 40 is pretty soft...but buying low price 9mm or reloading works for me..
Like HSMITH said..Glocks and XDs..you will begin to see more CZs around too..other guns you may see one or two of are Smith 5906, Sig226, Beretta E2.
I have heard minor 40 is pretty soft...but buying low price 9mm or reloading works for me..
Minor .40 is soft, but gee the gun feels sluggish. I used to shoot a CZ 75B with 147 grain Zero HP over TG and I liked it a lot. I switched to the 125 grainers for a snappier feeling. According to the timer and my score, there is no difference between my ultra soft handloads and white box. Find the impulse you like and go for it.
JSM - I use an HK USP, but in L10 class, not production. I've made B class with it.
HSMITH is correct that aftermarket support for the HK is scarce. I've had to customize my own sights, as none of the good competition sights are made for HK. I've also installed a Match trigger, and added 3m grip tape. My sights are Trijicon (hey, it's my duty gun too!) with the front narrowed to .120" and the rear opened to .155".
I had a similar experince as Ankeny with heavy bullets (though in .45). The 230gr just making major made the gun feel sluggish in recoil to me. 200gr are a bit snappier, and I like them much better.
HSMITH is correct that aftermarket support for the HK is scarce. I've had to customize my own sights, as none of the good competition sights are made for HK. I've also installed a Match trigger, and added 3m grip tape. My sights are Trijicon (hey, it's my duty gun too!) with the front narrowed to .120" and the rear opened to .155".
I had a similar experince as Ankeny with heavy bullets (though in .45). The 230gr just making major made the gun feel sluggish in recoil to me. 200gr are a bit snappier, and I like them much better.
I've had this .40 S&W USPC for several years and never any problems. It's reliable and shoots tight groups. I now want to shoot competitively, but don't want to invest in another production pistol. Especailly since I've gotten accostomed to carrying this one. I've noticed that mods are scarce, and forum discussions about HK's in this application just as rare. I've been looking for sights, but have not settled on one (not that there is a wide selection). I will experiment with several of the lighter projectiles while staying above minor loads and see how it goes. Thanks for the info, and don't hesitate to pipe up with more suggestions.
Scott
Scott
Scott - if you're shooting production, you'll certainly want the Match trigger group. It makes a good difference in the single action pull, and a HUGE diffrence in the DA pull. It's about $105, and worth every penny.
You'd do better with a full size USP than the compact. Of course, one would probably do better with an STI than with a USP, but where's the challenge in that, eh?
One other caveat about shooting Production - personally, I can't keep a proper high thumbs grip on an HK with the decocker installed - I keep depressing the safety into decock. My HK's are all set up variant 9 (like a 1911 - safety, but no decock), which would require manually decocking for Production class. Also, my gorilla thumbs bump the slide lock in a high thumbs grip, so I've had the slide lock cut back a bit.
For sights, keep the stock ones. I only have Trijicons on mine as it's a working gun. Have a smith narrow the front and perhaps open the rear until you have good light bars on either side of the front sight - whatever looks right and works well for you (my current measurements are above). Check Brian Enos' forum for details on sight picture and all sorts of other hints.
I think we've sucessfully hijacked this thread - e-mail me (or start another thread) if you have more IPSC/HK questions.
You'd do better with a full size USP than the compact. Of course, one would probably do better with an STI than with a USP, but where's the challenge in that, eh?
One other caveat about shooting Production - personally, I can't keep a proper high thumbs grip on an HK with the decocker installed - I keep depressing the safety into decock. My HK's are all set up variant 9 (like a 1911 - safety, but no decock), which would require manually decocking for Production class. Also, my gorilla thumbs bump the slide lock in a high thumbs grip, so I've had the slide lock cut back a bit.
For sights, keep the stock ones. I only have Trijicons on mine as it's a working gun. Have a smith narrow the front and perhaps open the rear until you have good light bars on either side of the front sight - whatever looks right and works well for you (my current measurements are above). Check Brian Enos' forum for details on sight picture and all sorts of other hints.
I think we've sucessfully hijacked this thread - e-mail me (or start another thread) if you have more IPSC/HK questions.
Ankeny brings up a good point, the feel of the impulse is a personal thing. Try different ammo/loads until you find one that feels good to you and makes you feel more confident than the others. Once you do that part of your brain is working for you, and any doubts are removed.
I like sharp fast feeling ammo, I want the gun to snap up and back. It really doesn't make a difference in my scores, but it feels better to me. It also influences my gun decisions, I prefer a G17 to a G34. Not much difference but enough to feel it.
The feel of the impulse on the HK USP series guns to me is two-stage, and that is one of my major complaints with them. Some guys like that feel. You just have to find out what works for you.
I like sharp fast feeling ammo, I want the gun to snap up and back. It really doesn't make a difference in my scores, but it feels better to me. It also influences my gun decisions, I prefer a G17 to a G34. Not much difference but enough to feel it.
The feel of the impulse on the HK USP series guns to me is two-stage, and that is one of my major complaints with them. Some guys like that feel. You just have to find out what works for you.
IMO the "best" gun for IPSC and IDPA is a G35. You can shoot Production, Limited and Limited 10 or SSP and ESP. My G35 shoots softer than my wife's G34. I never see an HK, Sig or Beretta at any of the matches I go to. The Glock is just easier to shoot fast and accurately.
I have started playing with a G21 in SSP. It is even softer than my G35. I find it to be a great CDP gun also. It has less muzzle flip than my Kimbers. One could shoot it in Production and Limited 10 or SSP, ESP and CDP. The large grip is really not an issue if you have even average size hands.
I have started playing with a G21 in SSP. It is even softer than my G35. I find it to be a great CDP gun also. It has less muzzle flip than my Kimbers. One could shoot it in Production and Limited 10 or SSP, ESP and CDP. The large grip is really not an issue if you have even average size hands.
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