VT Chrono from NY Times: What can we learn from this?

Status
Not open for further replies.

jfh

Member.
Joined
Aug 28, 2003
Messages
4,898
Location
Maiden Rock, WI
Here's the link to the report: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/22/us/22norris.html?th&emc=th

here's a link to the building graphic: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/17/us/20070417_SHOOTING_GRAPHIC.html

And here's the report text, edited only to clean up on-line formatting.

Students Recount Desperate Minutes Inside Norris Hall
SERGE F. KOVALESKI and KATIE ZEZIMA
Published: April 22, 2007
BLACKSBURG, Va., April 21 —

The Elementary German class was under way in Room 207, reviewing German translations of computer parlance. A young man peeked in, saying nothing, and withdrew. Students who noticed him thought that either he was searching for someone or trying to locate his class. He did the same thing across the hall in Room 206, and again in Room 204.

Sometime just past 9:30 a.m., Mr. Cho reentered Room 206, Advanced Hydrology, a graduate level class taught by Prof. G. V. Loganathan. He shot the teacher and then turned and fired at everyone else in the class.

Guillermo Colman, 38, dove to the floor and huddled against the radiator; another student fell on top of him. At first, he thought this might be a stunt of some sort, something with ketchup substituted for blood, until a bullet hit behind his left ear.

The gunman left, and the students who were still conscious heard gunfire in nearby classrooms. It was not long before the killer returned and pumped more bullets into the students sprawled on the floor. Mr. Colman’s head was bleeding, and for that reason he might not have been shot again, and he lived.

In Room 204, the students in Solid Mechanics were learning about strain displacements when they heard what they took to be construction noise, what to them sounded like an enormous hammer pounding.

“It was like someone would hit a nail, pull back, hit a nail, pull back,” said Alec Calhoun, a junior in the class. “Then, after about three hits, we started hearing screams.”

Prof. Liviu Librescu, the teacher, said, “That’s not what I think it is, is it?”

The big hammer was a gun.

One student shouted, “That’s gunfire, I’m getting out of here.” He grabbed his belongings and dashed into the hallway, trailed by one other student. But the killer was in the hallway. The first student was shot twice, but managed with assistance from his classmate to hobble downstairs. They tried the doors, but they had been chained shut and they could not get them open, so they ducked into a ground-floor classroom to hide.

Professor Librescu said, “Someone call 911.”

From the back of the room, Mr. Calhoun waved his cellphone in the air. He had already called.

Desks were hurriedly flipped on their sides as protective shields, and the students crouched behind them. Four students had skipped class, because they had a homework assignment for third period that they had not completed. Another happened to just then be in the bathroom down the hall, and a professor wounded in the hallway ran in and locked both of them inside.

Others, hearing the gunfire, had locked themselves in the lounge and the offices on the floor. The classrooms alone were without locks.

Fearing the door led to death and recognizing that it could not be locked, the Solid Mechanics students chose the windows and whatever fate they would bring. “It was the most helpless feeling I had known,” said Caroline Merrey, a senior. Soon after class was to end, she had a telephone interview scheduled for her first job as a graduate.

One of the students opened a window, leapt onto the windowsill and kicked out the screen. The teacher was yelling at the students to get out as quickly as possible. Students clambered through and began dropping the two stories toward grass that had been drenched by a Sunday rain. Ms. Merrey tossed her knapsack and windbreaker out the window and climbed onto the sill: “I hung from the window from my fingertips and I just closed my eyes and said to myself, ‘Here we go.’ ”

She landed next to a friend moaning that he had broken an ankle.

Nine or 10 jumped, and Mr. Calhoun said he was the last to go. As he stood on the sill, he wavered. He saw students ahead of him fall and get injured, screaming in pain. One would break a leg.

Jump? Don’t jump? A gunman controlled the hall. He spied a shrub and aimed for it. He successfully landed in it, bounced off and finished on his back on the grass. Picking himself up, he sped for the nearest building.

Matt Webster had not yet jumped. Professor Librescu, a Holocaust survivor who was 76, had his weight against the door, but the gunman bulled his way in and shot the professor and then fired at the remaining students.

“He walked over to everyone individually and stood over us and shot down on us,” Mr. Webster said. A bullet grazed Mr. Webster’s head and penetrated his bicep.

A woman near him was moaning from her wounds, and another student was hit in the leg.

Oddly, in all the mayhem, there were no screams. “There was no time for it,” Mr. Webster said. “It all happened so quickly.”

The gunfire had roused the attention of others on the floors above and below, and most of them sought refuge in their rooms. Kevin P. Granata, a professor with an office on the third floor, ventured downstairs to investigate. Mr. Cho killed him in the hallway.

Gene Cole, 52, a custodian, was talking to his supervisor on the first floor when a secretary came downstairs and alerted them to sounds of gunfire. Mr. Cole took the elevator to the second floor. He came upon a wounded woman on the floor, writhing in pain, unable to speak. Before he could get to her, the gunman charged out of a classroom, raised his gun and fired five shots at Mr. Cole. All missed.

“I felt the bullets whiz by my head,” he said.

He darted down the stairs, yelling at his boss to get out. Mr. Cole fled through the auditorium exits. His supervisor, Mr. Cole said, hid in the bathroom.

The Issues in Scientific Computing class in Room 205 had heard the gunfire. Zachary Petkewicz had shoved a table against the door and held it shut. Mr. Cho managed to get the door open six inches, but no further. He fired two shots into the door, splintering wood but hitting no one, and emptying his clip. One bullet struck the podium, and the other hit a window. The students could hear him reloading as he retreated.

In Elementary German, Room 207, students had heard noise outside, but dismissed it as construction racket. The door was closed. Mr. Cho opened it, and before it hit the doorstop, he was firing.

“There was emptiness in his eyes,” said Derek O’Dell, a sophomore. “He was like a stone.”

He shot Christopher J. Bishop, the teacher, then turned on the class. Students dropped to the floor, jostling for cover. The gunfire continued — 10, 20, maybe 30 shots. The volley covered little more than a minute, but it felt like much longer.

Mr. O’Dell was hit in the right arm. “I was under my desk,” he said. “Then I started belly crawling military-style to the back of the room, while he was firing, and hid under another desk.”

Kevin Sterne, 21, a senior, was shot twice in the thigh, his femur artery ruptured. Drawing on his knowledge as an Eagle Scout, he snatched an electrical cord and wrapped it fast around his leg, stanching the bleeding and saving his life.

Five were dead and most of the others wounded. The four or five who had not been hit lay still on the floor, feigning death to live. There was no hope of escaping through windows here, not on this side of the hallway. Only the bottoms of the windows opened, with a crank, and the opening was too slim. There was no lawn below, just concrete. One student cranked open a window and began screaming for help.

The survivors heard gunfire ringing in another classroom. Trey Perkins feared the killer would return and finish them off: “I told people that were still up and conscious, ‘Just be quiet because we don’t want him to think there are people in here because he’ll come back in.’ ”

Using his belt as a tourniquet, Mr. O’Dell stopped the bleeding in his arm and then leap-frogged across a half-dozen desks to the front of the room. He slammed the door shut and barricaded it with his foot, leaning against the blackboard to avoid shots coming through the door. Two classmates propped their feet against the door. The others tried shoving the podium over, but it was bolted to the floor.

Sure enough, the gunman returned. He got the door open an inch, before the students shut it again. He squeezed off half a dozen shots into the door, and left.

Hearing the disturbances, Clay Violand, a junior in the Intermediate French class in Room 211 told Jocelyne Couture-Nowak, the professor, to push a desk against the door. She glanced out in the hallway first, and pulled her head back with a look of frozen terror. She told her students to call 911 and get down. She shoved a desk against the door, but the barricade did not hold.

“I saw a gun emerge into view,” Mr. Violand said. “Following the gun was a man.”

He ducked under his desk.

The professor and nine students were killed.

“Shot after shot went off and I never felt anything,” Mr. Violand said. “I played dead and tried to look as lifeless as possible.”

He whispered to a classmate, “If he thinks you’re dead, then he won’t kill you.”

And he prayed: “I prayed that an invisible blanket of protection be placed around me.”

Colin Goddard had called 911 and then dropped the phone, the line still open to the dispatcher. A bullet hit him in the left leg, breaking his femur. He, too, lay motionless, and the gunman left.

Moments later, he was back. Lying still on the floor, Mr. Goddard saw shoes approach, heard additional shots fired, then the shoes stopped next to him. He felt two more bullets rip into him, in the shoulder and buttocks. He was still conscious, and he would live. So would Mr. Violand. The shoes moved away, headed toward the front of the room. Somewhere nearby, one more shot rang out.

The police had burst through. Mr. Cho had turned his gun on himself.

Alicia C. Shepard contributed reporting.
 
What can we learn from this?
Well, here is what I chose to learn (IMHO, YMMV, etc):

1. Hiding under a desk will not stop a murderous lunatic from shooting you. He may decide not to shoot you, but the desk itself will not save you.

2. If you play dead a murderous lunatic may not shoot you. But he certainly can, and in many cases the Va. Tech murder DID shoot people who were lying still. For these first two points, you are basically leaving the decision of weather you get shot up to a madman with a gun.

3. If you try to run away from murderous lunatic, it is best to run away from where they are (not towards them.)

4. Jumping from a window and breaking a leg seems to be less bad than getting shot (none of the people jumping from the windows died. More than half the people who got shot died. About half the people in the class rooms the murder got into were shot and killed.)

5. If you are going to shut a door between you and the murderous lunatic, make sure he cannot open it (make sure you can lock it, or you can hold it shut if he tries to open it.) If you are holding a door shut, try to be out of the path of any bullets that may (are likely to?) come through the door.

6. Fighting back may or may not have worked in this case. We can speculate what might have happened, but the eyewitness antidotes listed in the first post above do not give us any lessons to learn about fighting back.

----------------------------------------------
Anyway, there is pretty comprehensive coverage of the VA Tech. Shootings in New York Times today and yesterday, conforming many things discussed here over the last week, and answering several questions (of course you can decide if they are likely to be correct answers.) In addition to the article posted above, the main front-page article is:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/22/us/22vatech.html?_r=1&ref=todayspaper&oref=slogin

Yesterday’s article, claiming the murder WAS “…adjudicated as a mental defective,…” and the NICS should have prevented him from buying firearms is here:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/21/us/21guns.html?fta=y

Links to other stories and interactive diagrams are on the left. A few excerpts from today's main article that are firearm related:

“The first gun he bought was a Walther .22-caliber pistol. He ordered it from an Internet gun site and picked it up at a pawnshop near campus on Feb. 9.”

"The next day, [March 13] he bought the second gun at Roanoke Firearms, where he laid out the requisite three pieces of identification: his Virginia driver’s license, his green card and a personal check. He paid by credit card: $571 for a 9-millimeter Glock pistol, one of the store’s best sellers, a favorite for target shooting and self-defense. He took 50 rounds of ammunition.”

“On March 22, Mr. Cho showed up at the PSS Range, advertised as “Roanoke’s only indoor pistol range,” $10 an hour. Mr. Cho spent an hour practicing and bought four ammunition magazines for the Glock. Range employees, investigators said, remembered a young Asian man videotaping himself inside a van in the parking lot.”

“Investigators said he went to the Wal-Mart in Christiansburg on March 31, April 7, April 8 and April 13. During those visits, he bought cargo pants, sunglasses and .22-caliber ammunition. He also bought a hunting knife, gloves, a phone item and a granola bar. He visited Dick’s Sporting Goods for extra magazines of ammunition.”

“All told, investigators calculate that Mr. Cho spent several thousand dollars getting ready for April 16, most of it charged to a credit card.”

“Emily Hilscher, a freshman, lived in Room 4040, near the elevators on the fourth floor of West Ambler Johnston Hall, one building from Harper. Shortly after 7 a.m., she was killed by bullets from Mr. Cho’s gun. The same fate met Ryan Clark, one of the dorm’s resident advisers. Mr. Clark is believed to have come out of his room to investigate the noise, only to stumble into death.
Officials say they know of no connection between Mr. Cho and Ms. Hilscher, and remain baffled about why he began there and why he chose not to end there. “The biggest thing for us is Location One,” a law enforcement official said. “Why Location One? Why did he stop at two killings there?””

“…where there were seven classrooms. Two were vacant, and five were in session: Rooms 204, 205, 206, 207, 211. Gun drawn, he forged into four of them. Inside of 10 to 15 minutes, forensics evidence concluded, he fired more than 175 rounds in killing 30 people,…”

“The first police officers on the scene forced their way in by blasting open the front doors with a shotgun. That blast, investigators believe, alerted Mr. Cho that he had time for only one more shot.
They found his body sprawled in the stairwell. He had turned one of his guns around and shot himself. The officers shouted, “Shooter down! Shooter down! Black tag!” Black tag is police code for dead.”

===============================================
A few excerpts about non-firearms related aspects that have discussed here over the last week (to avoid thread drift and off topic stuff, stop reading here.):

“From the beginning, he did not talk. Not to other children, not to his own family. Everyone saw this. In Seoul, South Korea, where Seung-Hui Cho grew up, his mother agonized over his sullen, brooding behavior and empty face. Talk, she just wanted him to talk.”

“The goal, of course, was to own one’s own business. But it did not happen for Seung-Tae Cho [Father of Seung-Hui Cho]. He began as a presser — an 8 a.m.-to-10 p.m. job — and that is what he is today. His wife worked in the same capacity until a few years ago, when she accepted a job in a high school cafeteria so the family could have medical insurance.

“Mr. Cho’s older sister, Sun-Kyung Cho, went to Princeton…”

“In his junior year, Mr. Cho told his then-roommates that he had a girlfriend. Her name was Jelly. She was a supermodel who lived in outer space and traveled by spaceship, and she existed only in the dimension of his imagination.
When Andy Koch, one of his roommates, returned to their suite one day, Mr. Cho shooed him away. He told him Jelly was there.”

“A few hours after they left, he sent an instant message to one of his roommates suggesting he might as well kill himself. The campus police were called, and Mr. Cho was sent to an off-campus mental health facility.
After a counselor recommended involuntary commitment, a judge signed an order deeming him a danger and he was sent for evaluation to Carilion St. Albans Psychiatric Hospital in Radford, Va. A doctor there declared him mentally ill but not an imminent threat. Rather than commit him, the judge allowed him to undergo outpatient treatment. Officials say they do not know whether he did.”

“Last semester, he took a playwriting class in which he submitted two one-act plays, “Richard McBeef” and “Mr. Brownstone,” both foulmouthed rants. In “Richard McBeef,” a 13-year-old threatens to kill his stepfather. Steven Davis, a senior in the class, said he finished reading the play one night, turned to his roommate and said, “This is the kind of guy who is going to walk into a classroom and start shooting people.””

“In death, Seung-Hui Cho finally spoke, but it was through the QuickTime videos received by NBC and broadcast on Wednesday. A pastor at a Korean church in Centreville watched the tapes on television with his family. He told the Seoul newspaper JoongAng Ilbo, “All my family said that was not the Seung-Hui we knew. It was the first time we saw him speaking in full sentences.””
 
Last edited:
In recent memory, the only two school shooting situations that were stopped quickly were at the Appalachin School of Law, and the Pearl, MS High School. In both cases, the violence was stopped by armed citizens, not the police (do not construe this comment as a swipe at the police -).

At ASOL, it was two students who ran to their cars and got their guns (both had VA CHPs, IIRC), and at Pearl, it was the Vice Principal who stopped the shooter after retrieveing his gun from his truck. Until the 'powers that be' allow people to defend themselves, this stuff will continue to have horrific consequences. It will never really stop, but it could be significantly reduced or be over a whole lot sooner if 'the powers' didn't frustrate the basic human right of self-defense and get over teh follow of 'gun-free zones', AKA 'victim idsarmament zones'.

In the meantime, here's hoping those who infringe those rights someday find themselves on the receiving end of mindless violence with no armed assistance in sight - may they reap what they sow :barf:
 
What we can learn is that Virginia Tech students are wonderfully well behaved people. The university requires them to comply with its policies and they did so.

In recognition of their excellent behavior despite great stress, Virginia Tech awarded their degrees posthumously to those who were murdered even though they did not complete the requirements. It will be of great help to them in their chosen careers and it saved their parents considerable tuition money and other fees. Being murdered for complying with Virginia Tech's policies is obviously the equivalent of meeting its other requirements. The state of Virginia should take great pride in Virginia Tech.

Here is an excerpt from Virginia Tech's Campus & Workplace Violence Prevention And Crisis Management Resource Manual:
When confronted with an angry person:

During an event, use the flowing steps as means to attempt to diffuse the situation.

* Put departmental plan into action.
* Try to stay calm. Raising your own voice may increase the anxiety of the potentially violent person.
* Speak slowly, softly, and clearly to reduce the momentum of the situation.
* Ask the belligerent person to leave and come back at a time when they feel more calm.
* Move away from any objects, such as scissors or heavy objects, which may be employed as a weapon.
* Avoid challenging body language such as placing your hands on your hips, moving toward the person, or staring directly at them. Remain seated and do not turn your back on the individual.
* Position yourself, if possible, so that an exit route is readily accessible.
* Listen empathetically by really paying attention to what the person is saying. Let the person know that you will help them within your ability to do so or you will send for additional help.
* Remain helpful while you summon your supervisor for assistance. Sometimes, the opportunity to talk to a supervisor will help satisfy an irritated client.
* Neither agree with distorted statements nor attempt to argue - REMAIN CALM. Avoid defensive statements. This is not the time to place blame back on the enraged person.
* Ask questions to help regain control of the conversation.
* Ask uninvolved parties to leave the area if this can be done safely. Use the prearranged code word to alert your coworker to call University Police.
* Never challenge, try to bargain, or make promises that you cannot keep.
* Describe the consequences of any violent behavior.
* Do not physically touch an outraged person, or try to force them to leave.
* Calmly ask the person to place any weapons in a neutral location while you continue to talk to them.
* Never attempt to disarm or accept a weapon from the person in question. Weapon retrieval is only to be done by a University Police Officer.

* Observe Who, What, Where, When for reporting purposes


Steps to take in violent situations:

• Recognize the reality of what is happening, remembering that it may seem unreal because it is so far removed from your normal experience.
• Remain calm and proceed in a logical, rational manner.
• Take shelter, assisting others if necessary and possible.
• Assess the situation in terms of the degree of threat, injury, or damage.

Those students were young people in the prime of life. Cho, the mentally disturbed murderer, was slight of build. His victims outnumbered him. But instead of taking the rash step of overpowering and disarming him, they followed Virginia Tech's policy: "Never attempt to disarm or accept a weapon from the person in question. Weapon retrieval is only to be done by a University Police Officer." Students jumped out of windows rather than violate university policy, because of course the murderer Cho was armed and they were not. How many of us would have been as levelheaded in their situation?

Of course no one but the murderer had a firearm--not even students, faculty, other employees, or visitors to the campus who had concealed weapons permits--because Virginia Tech is a "gun free zone" intended to make those people "feel safe." So none of them disobeyed Virginia Tech's policies, which demonstrates that all of them were good, law abiding people. The murderer, Cho, violated Virginia Tech's policies and brought two weapons onto the campus. He can't get his posthumously-awarded degree even though he's dead too. Virginia Tech can't be expected to compromise its principles. Perhaps the university will even suspend Cho for violating its policies.

Most universities have similar gun bans on campus. Who would doubt that their students will prove themselves to be equally well behaved when they are given the opportunity to prove themselves.

Perhaps Virginia Tech and the state of Virginia should commend its President Charles W. Steger, and the administrators who serve under him, for their success in attracting such widespread and well-deserved attention. Virginia Tech will be remembered along with Columbine High School in the annals of American education. They set the mark for universities and schools who adhere to their shared policies with respect to self-defense.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top