Warning 9mm Remington & Winchester

[Double Naught Spy]

Well Sky, where is this Larry's place that you are talking about. Being a gunsmith, gun store, and gun range owner, I find it odd all this stuff is happening at his place, rather hard to believe. Even harder to believe that he would be passing on ideas about the mythical perishable primers ammo, though it now being attributed to Wolf is a twist I didn't hear before. Used to be Walmart was selling perishable primer ammo. Used to be that the Obama Administration had made it happen, or the Brady Bunch.

I bet Larry's has live jackalopes out back that can't be stopped with a .50 BMG as well.

 

[Shadow 7D]

Are you sure the ammo was NEW and stored in good condition, I mean we ought to be through the Hurricane Katrina salvage, but..

 

[buck460XVR]

Well Sky, where is this Larry's place that you are talking about. Being a gunsmith, gun store, and gun range owner, I find it odd all this stuff is happening at his place, rather hard to believe. Even harder to believe that he would be passing on ideas about the mythical perishable primers ammo, though it now being attributed to Wolf is a twist I didn't hear before. Used to be Walmart was selling perishable primer ammo. Used to be that the Obama Administration had made it happen, or the Brady Bunch.

I bet Larry's has live jackalopes out back that can't be stopped with a .50 BMG as well.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

If we can have documented proof that current ammunition from established manufacturers like Win And Rem is often substandard, then this would justify the use of competently made handloads for self defense. I have been loading for over 30 years, and my QC seems to be WAY better than what is being discussed in this thread. I'd like to have the issue of handloads vs. factory loads thrown out of argument in self defense cases, so that we may use what we want to defend ourselves. I could make a solid argument in court that my handloads are far better than factory loads if I had to, but a growing public awareness of the deficiencies in factory loads would just make it easier.

 

[Bubbles]

There was a discussion on problems with WWB on ARFCOM. The OP is my husband. The issues were cropping up with three different guns owned by three different people in the area.

I really hope that with the ammo manufacturers didn't cut corners to push product to market faster when demand spiked last year.

 

[Sky]

Finally got more Info. The AR is a patrolman A4 XM-15 E2S.

The girl was indeed shooting ammo out of the white box 9mm Winchester. The only problem is I find out today she was shooting reloads..wolf primers which she was using out of the factory box she had placed them in. Five "no bangs" in less than two mags got my attention.

Asked him about the primers going bad and he said there has been rumors of primers going bad after a short period but that he felt it was really just some runs of poor quality control from the factory. He to had heard of the planned obsolescence rumor and like most think it is a crock.

Saturday on one of the pistol lines there was indeed enough misfires of factory ammo to fill half way a 32oz cup. Larry said he has been experiencing 1 to 2 rounds per hundred failure rate from the Rems and Winchesters. His ammo does not sit around very long to get old or stale. The range gets rather busy and he only charges one to two dollars over Walmart prices depending on ammo type so people just get their ammo at the range. Beats the lines at Walmart and everyone likes him.

Just receive a call from Larry (rather late for him) who replaced the bolt and ran two mags through the Bushmaster with no problems. Did not ask if they were 20 or 30 round mags. He said he would work on the new original bolt tomorrow and if all goes well I can pick up the AR.

I humbly apologize for the misinformation on the Remington and Winchester ammo. One or two per hundred ain't great but no where near what was originally posted or thought. Blush..embarrassed...disgraced... and not happy.

The deal on the Bushmaster is a trade for my Glock 23c. I have two mags for the 40 cal barrel and 2 for the 9mm Lone wolf barrel; still have the box. The Glock has the Crimsontrace laser on it and has been a good shooter with no problems. I just don't like the Glock (personal) and the swap is straight across with some ammo I have in 9mm and 40 cal. The Bushmaster will fit my need for a weapon I can mount my night scope on and not have to take optics off of another Ar for night hunting. Night scope is zeroed one hour after sunset and can be time consuming having to change and check zero on a spur of the moment hunt. Yes I know zero should be the same when swapping providing scope is placed in the same slot. My night shooting is for Jack Rabbits mostly and I don't like to miss. Everyone needs a few idiosyncrasies I guess?

Larry has a 20 inch AR with the fluted barrel (not chromed) and all the the fix-ins kinda like Tonyangel's with a standard AR type stock though. Thought about that but golly gee that thing is heavy and I can't see walking and hunting with an extra 2.8 pound night scope on it. The 20" was close to $500 dollars more than the Bushmaster.

 

[Sky]

Good read Bubbles. Quality control, Quality control, unfortunately ammo manufactures receive items from outside vendors as do Arms manufactures. We as consumers have very little tolerance for something not working and tend to buy different brands (if available) when things don't go the way we intend them to.

 

[Shadow 7D]

Primers are sensitive, if they weren't, well they wouldn't be primers

Messing up a little can kill one, leave lube from tumbling, too much for sizing, even a tiny spec of oil will kill a primer.

 

[hank327]

This Larry Guy... Who & Where?

Hey Sky, who and where is this Larry you keep referring to? From what you are saying he has a gunshop and a range somewhere in Texas. Inquiring minds want to know more.

Personally, I've shot lots of WWB and Remington UMC 9mm with no issues whatsoever. Also, I recently shot about 140 rounds of Wolf 7.62 X 39mm HP that I have had for 9 years. I bought it right after 9/11/2001 and it was the old green lacquer, red sealant stuff. It fed and fired 100% in my AK.

 

[Wildbillz]

+100. I am looking for a rang in TX to fire at. How long of a rifle range do they have?

WB

 

[Sky]

The range has two pistol ranges which are out doors guesstimate 50 and 75 yards; one range has 2 metal framed 8 plates knock down targets at approx 30 yards

One rifle range berm at approx 125 yards

one rifle range berm at 325 yards with intermediate targets.

One shotgun range dunno have not shot there. Skeet is shot there sometimes. Think throw you own?

Nothing fancy just a good ole boy place you can shoot all day for $10.00 or pay yearly $300?

Brownsville, Texas..Take Boca Chica east and when you pass the boarder patrol station from there it is 8.5 miles on the right side. There is a large yellow ball with a smiley face about the size of a WWll naval mine sitting at the entrance. Turn right and go down a horrible dirt road which seems like 2 miles bit Larry says it's really just a mile.

If you continue straight down Boca Chica you will run into the Gulf of Mexico. We have boarder patrol stations in many places even two hours north of Brownsville on highway 77

The range is on U.S. side of the boarder (of course) located approx 7 miles from Mexico.

Guys were talking about a new range being built I think down highway 100 that might be closer. This one will have quarters, swimming pool, and a bunch of non-good ole boy stuff. Supposed to be privately owned but from what I hear, it's some security outfit with government contracts or our Homeland security tax dollars at work. I do plan on checking it out when finished but I think they are only open on weekends and doing construction during the week. Was in Harlingen 3 weeks ago at the True Value Hardware picking up some scope ring covers and the counter guys were talking about it.

The amenities at Larry's consist of a log cabin style 1800ish sq ft house. He has safes full of guns shelves full of ammo and a kitchen that usually has some of the best brownies you are likely to eat. Larry is a transplanted Canadian but try not to hold that against him. Many Boarder Patrol and a few other Leo's frequent Larry's. I have met some neat people there but I usually do not go on the weekends due to being crowded. Monday and Tuesday are the slowest days.

Anyone live down this way and plan on going send me a Pm and I will give you his phone number which unless he is on the range he usually picks up. Voice mail box is always full so it's hard to leave a message. Usually takes two calls back to back to get him; dunno if his voice mail is that busy or he does not know how or just to busy to empty it. First weekend of the month and the last wekend he does CCW so don't call he is busy. Usually has around 10 to 20 students and I think he charges $100 for the course.

 

[Mikee Loxxer]

I find out today she was shooting reloads..wolf primers

That explains a lot. I have found the Wolf primers are unreliable :banghead:

 

[Sky]

Seems like I read somewhere when I first joined to read and not post!! That was a wise man that said that; especially if you don't know what you think yours eyes or ears are telling you. It will never be the same.........and I am sorry for yanking so many around with non factual B.S.

 

[Sky]

Well I finally got the Bushmaster tonight. Evidently the extractor spring was either broken from the factory or the first round fired yesterday broke it. Bushmaster is sending replacement so I am using a different bolt in the mean time. I only shot 20 rounds through the gun tonight as a function check before I had to get back; mosquitoes were thirsty.

I traded my 23c and 5 boxes of 9mm along with 2 boxes of 40 cal to include the Lone Wolf 9mm conversion for the Bushmaster. It came with the detachable carry handle and sometime this week I will get it sighted in properly and then remove and sight in the night scope. The gun is light and may just add one rail for a light or do nothing except mount the night scope.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Well Sky, where is this Larry's place that you are talking about.

This Larry Guy... Who & Where?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hey Sky, who and where is this Larry you keep referring to? From what you are saying he has a gunshop and a range somewhere in Texas. Inquiring minds want to know more.

Brownsville, Texas..Take Boca Chica east and when you pass the boarder patrol station from there it is 8.5 miles on the right side. There is a large yellow ball with a smiley face about the size of a WWll naval mine sitting at the entrance. Turn right and go down a horrible dirt road which seems like 2 miles bit Larry says it's really just a mile.

If you continue straight down Boca Chica you will run into the Gulf of Mexico. We have boarder patrol stations in many places even two hours north of Brownsville on highway 77

The range is on U.S. side of the boarder (of course) located approx 7 miles from Mexico

Anyone live down this way and plan on going send me a Pm and I will give you his phone number which unless he is on the range he usually picks up. Voice mail box is always full so it's hard to leave a message. Usually takes two calls back to back to get him; dunno if his voice mail is that busy or he does not know how or just to busy to empty it.

Since you have yet to actually give the correct name of the business and not given an address, let me help you. Maybe this way folks will better know how to avoid this range of quality control gloom and doom misfortune and mythical perishable primers.

Larry Massey Top Gun Range 1 Massey Way Brownsville, TX 78521. Phone: 956-831-2990

Map
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=1+MAS...code_result&ct=image&resnum=1&ved=0CBQQ8gEwAA

 

[Sky]

Tis true but your average wayward pedestrian without specific directions will miss the turn in or go half way down the dirt road and figure this can't be it..

I thought post #36 explained the location fairly clearly for non directionally challenged personage.

Because an AK goes into slam fire or someone brings a box of Winchester filled with reloads does not make a range bad or doomed.

I prefer, silly me, to observe and hear, see, and try and be informed of the good bad and ugly even at my own expense of looking like a dummy.

Larry's is not an air conditioned big city gun range; to me it is just a place to sweat, shoot, learn, and occasionally swap or purchase fire arms. I like it but obviously it might not be for everyone.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

I thought post #36 explained the location fairly clearly for non directionally challenged personage.

You gave fine sounding directions, but seemed to be going out of your way to obfuscate the information by not including salient data like the actual address, actual name of the range, contact information for the range, or whether or not you were talking about the Border Patrol Station (which isn't actually on Boca Chica) or a Border patrol checkpoint (which I will assume you meant one of the permanent checkpoints and not a temporary one, right? Your directions are probably great, if the reader actually understood the start point which was a big vague.

Why you would go into so much detail about how to deal with Larry on the phone without providing a phone number or about what the main building of the range looked like without providing an address seemed odd.

It is much easier to simply provide an address and contact information and then the reader can google a custom map of the specific area.

 

[Sky]

Good point...figured everyone who was in the local area would understand where and what I was talking about. Seems pretty much everyone in these parts either knows him or have heard of Larry's Gun Range.

I personally did not give out his number because I did not ask him first. He is a business that is true but he is also someone who does not advertise on the Internet. I did mention to P.M. me for number.

Myself and others have a rather hard time understanding him in person and it is harder on the phone. If you ever meet him or call you will understand.

Like I said just a good a good place to shoot, eat Brownies, and buy firearms. He has always been honest and forth right with me and has been in business for many years.

Yep can Google yet people still have a hard time finding the location. The smiley yellow Naval land mine thingy (don't think the yellow smiley will show up on google) is the secret to finding the entrance plus the boarder/immigration/check point/guys with O.D. uniforms and guns 8.5 miles before his turn in.

Funny actually showed a guy how far he had to go down the road yesterday when I went to pick up a Bushmaster. Not that unusual; my first time I went halfway down the dirt road and turned around thinking this can't be right. Happens all the time by the comments he receives and experiences I have had with new people.