Waterfowl hunting question

[Steve Smith]

Ok, I was just watching a hunting show and you know the typical duck blind scene that they show. In once episode, the hunters were showing off two ducks after the dog had retrieved them. One of the feet on one duck was moving around so the duck was obviously alive still.

Now here's my question. I was always taught to make sure my "kills" were always kills as fast as possible to reduce cruelty and pain on the animal and I have always tried to adhere to that. Is this practice not common with duck hunting (I have never hunted waterfowl)? Even when dove hunting I have always (after my first lesson when I was a child) made sure the bird was dead if it didn't die after being shot.

TIA

 

[auschip]

Often times even after being shot the animals will still have nerve reaction. Similar to a chicken running after it's head has been cut off. Every duck hunt I have been on, we break the ducks neck after the retrieve.

 

[TrapperReady]

I didn't see the show, but every bird hunter I've ever hunted with has made sure to dispatch wounded animals as quickly as possible. As auschip mentioned, sometimes they'll thrash around for a while even when dead.

A couple years ago, I had a rooster pheasant flush pretty closely. I was shooting a tightly-choked 12ga, and made a head-shot with an ounce and a quarter of #5 shot. The dog dove in and grabbed the bird, which seemed to put up one heck of a fight. However, when the retrieve was made, everything forward of the red band on the bird's neck was completely gone.

"Running around like a chicken with its head cut off" is pretty accurate sometimes.

BTW, the thing to really look for is what the bird's head is doing. If it is holding its head up and looking around, then it's not dead.

 

[Steve Smith]

gotcha.

 

[HSMITH]

I saw that show Steve, and it looked to me like nerve twitch. Only one leg was moving and there was no apparent damage to the other. If I am not sure a bird is dead I will wring it out of course, and then look in the eyes to see if anyone is home.

Some of the duck hunting shows really wind me up. Those guys shoot a duck, it hits the water and comes upright obviously alive, sometimes they loose a dog after it and sometimes just cut the camera away. BOTH are the WRONG ANSWER!! An ethical hunter will swat them on the water the instant they pop up. They also shoot a lot more hens on TV than they should, they should be ashamed of themselves shooting hens in broad daylight!!

A lot of guys watch TV and think the guys on the shows are 'professionals', and emulate them. I would like to see more of them take that responsibility as seriously as they should.

 

[Jon Coppenbarger]

I hunted quite allot of ducks and other birds and always made sure they were dead. Did have a pheasant I thought was dead come back on me while I was driving down the road. Had them laid out in the back of my land cruiser and while heading home it came to and was flying around and banging off the windows. Wonder what the other cars thought that were behind me on the freeway before I pulled over.

 

[TrapperReady]

HSMITH - I've got a question for you. I've only been at this waterfowling thing for a couple seasons, so I'm still trying to figure some of it out. Like in your post, if a bird isn't dead on impact, then I'll hit it again in the water (usually with smaller shot - #7 steel aiming for the head/neck).

However, a few weeks ago, I ran into some guys who were talking about the duck opener (I'm in WI also), and they made it clear that they didn't swat the crippled birds in the water. At the time, I was just trying to get them to shut the heck up and move on (I was hunting geese and they were just scouting for ducks) so I didn't ask them why.

The only thing I can think of is if the public access areas are so packed with hunters that shooting at birds in the water would be unsafe... but frankly, I just don't know. Do you have any insight on WHY people wouldn't want to finish of their cripples?

Jon - A season or two ago, I was working with my dog on a game farm, shooting some preserve chukars. He was doing OK and I had a vest heavy with birds, so we decided to take a break. I emptied my vest into the trunk of the car, fed and watered the dog, and we headed back out to get the last couple birds. Probably 45 minutes later, we returned to the car and I opened the trunk again. When I did so, a very much alive chukar was hopping around and looking at me.

Now, each of those birds had been shot, retrieved by the dog, had its neck wrung and spent at least 1/2 an hour in my vest with not so much as a twitch. I'm thinking it was some kind of mutant zombie undead-chukar.

Tasted good though.

 

[scout26]

Probably 45 minutes later, we returned to the car and I opened the trunk again. When I did so, a very much alive chukar was hopping around and looking at me.

As my father-in-law used to say when we'd go after Nebraska pheasants: "The shotguns are just to knock 'em down, so that we can wring their necks."

I've had a few "dead" pheasants come back to life on me. Even to the point of climbing out of my vest and having to be retreived by the dog again.

 

[1911 guy]

Pheasant burger

My reaction then a pheasant story. First, I'm not a waterfowler, so is there a reg against shooting ducks on the water? Maybe they're afraid of the warden accusing them of illegal behavior. If that's not the case, by all means, I'd pop a cripple on the water. Don't think I'd use a reduced or smaller shot load, either. Put them away quick.

Now my story. I was a young kid with a H&R single shot 20ga and got invited along to a pheasant hunt. Never been bird hunting before, so was unsure what shot size to use. What does a kid do? Ask Dad. Dad is completely unfamiliar with the 20 ga and tells me to go get a box of 3" No.4's! So, I'm walking through the field with the fellow who invited me along with his son and his nephew, when a bird pops up not twenty feet from me. I let him have a good dose of shot and he fold and drops about ten feet back to the ground. Jim had told me ahead of time about wringing their necks. As I go over to do so, he says "Don't bother". Ever seen what an ounce of #4's at close range does to a pheasant? It tasted great, but we were spitting out shot with every mouthful. Oh, steel shot and a full choke, by the way.

 

[Flyboy]

On one of our hunting trips many years ago, Dad dropped a duck coming down the Scioto River. He went out in the canoe to retrieve it, came back, and noticed that it was still paddling its feet. Being the humane sort, dad held its head and swung its body to break it's neck.

Swung the body clean off. Feet were still paddling, ten feet away from Dad and the duck's head. It was dead, it just hadn't come to terms with that fact yet.

We got dad an umbrella with a duck head handle shortly thereafter.

 

[HSMITH]

Trapper, one 'reason' I have heard is the expense of the shells. A guy I took hunting one time shot a duck that popped back up and told me to shoot it on the water if I wanted to waste a shell, he wasn't going to waste an expensive shell. I shot it, took him to the launch and and told him to get out of my boat. I won't hunt with someone that has no respect for the game. Other than the cost of the shell I can't think of anything that would keep someone from shooting a cripple on the water.

Down here in the crowded part of the state you certainly have to watch where you shoot as there are always other hunters in the area. Sometimes some manuevering is needed to get a safe swat but we always do it as soon as possible.

1911 guy, the smaller shot is actually better to swat a bird on the water. Head and neck is the target to kill one quickly and that is about all that sticks up out of the water that is vital, the internal organs are basically submerged when a duck is on the water. The smaller shot will penetrate the neck and head, and you get more pellets in the pattern making odds of killing the duck quickly a little better.

 

[TrapperReady]

HSMITH - I'm surprised you took him back to the launch before ejecting him from the boat. BTW, what kind of steel loads do you like for ducks? I've mostly been shooting Hevishot, but am going to try some steel in the morning. I've got some Kent #4 and Federal #2 (both 3 1/2") which pattern decently. Which would you recommend for mallards?

Edited to add: Don't worry about responding, I used the SEARCH feature and found an answer (sounds like #2 is better). I also managed to hit my own personal Lotto and found about 30 shells of #4 Hevishot left over from last year... so I'll probably use that instead.

 

[goosegunner]

If the duck don't have its head below water, or have the feet in the air, it gets one more shot. Usually with the shotgun and the smallest shotsize awilable in a heavy load (50 gram / #6 or #7 in the lead days, bismuth in 42 gram / #6 is the best i have tried in non-toxic) or if the duck is to far away (>35 meters) I use the .22WMR if the background alows it. The use of the rifle is that my hunting grounds (or waters) are pretty dog-hostile with slippery rocks, heavy seas and cold water. Leaving the retrieving of birds in the water to me

 

[HSMITH]

Trapper, since you already found the answer I'll point out one thing. That Kent steel isn't waterproof, neither is the Federal unless it is 'Premium'. If they get wet they will rust and clump. I was PO when I found out as I like the Kent, it patterns well and the price is nice, but I lost a full box when I hunted in a driving rain and my pockets got wet. It rusted and clumped even though I dried them out as best I could when I got home.

My local Gander just blew out some of last years Winchester Supreme 3.5" #2's, great shells and at $15 per box I picked up enough for the season.

 

[belton-deer-hunter]

well i dont know about waterfowl but around here we hunt dove and often the bird comes back alive but injured to the point to where it feel from the sky we get it and humanly kill the bird usaaly by breaking the neck

 

[TrapperReady]

HSMITH - Thanks for the heads up. A good friend told me about steel clumping a while ago, so all of my ammo is kept in Zip-Lock bags inside an MTM waterproof box. I just take out what I've got in the gun, plus a reload.

Not that I would advocate this, but I absolutely creamed a goose with #6 Hevishot. We heard a goose in the distance and gave a little call. I then swapped out the shell in the chamber with BB steel. Before I could get the shells in the magazine changed, the goose showed up, coming in to land right in our spread. When he was about 20 yards out, I shot and missed (swung too far in front), worked the slide and shot again, with less lead and going for his head. The only goose I've seen go down harder had been hit by two shots at the same time. While the first shot had been BB, the follow-up was #6 Hevishot.

I also dropped a mallard drake at about 35 yards with the same load. I was really impressed with how well it worked.

 

[HSMITH]

I am all worked up to try hevi, and will soon. I've only been out once, work and home and too many hunters etc for me to get any time in so far.....

I shot a goose a few years ago with lead #5's at about 40 yards. Long story but it was ethical to do so even if slightly illegal. Load was hard 5's and Longshot in a 2 3/4" 1 1/4 ounce flavor. It ROLLED a giant canada, full choke was used but still, it ROLLED him!! Hevi is supposed to be more effective, if it is I can't imagine how hard it hits.