What arms would be popular today if not for the 1934 NFA?
- Thread starter MatthewVanitas
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Tall Pine,
I remember reading, several years ago in a Readers Digest, about a small full auto .22 . Suposedly had a high rate of fire and a big drum magazine. Also had a lazer beam for aiming. Seems the developer loaned one to one of the police departments of a large city to try out for a while. Well, one day while the cops got called to a bank robbery they used it on the robber as he was shooting at them from his stalled get away car.
If memory serves, the officer only held the trigger for like 3 seconds as he trained the lazer spot on the perp"s car door. The article stated that it ate a 3" hole through the driver door, the bad guy and the opposite side door.
Bet that would be a hoot to shoot at least once at the range.
I remember reading, several years ago in a Readers Digest, about a small full auto .22 . Suposedly had a high rate of fire and a big drum magazine. Also had a lazer beam for aiming. Seems the developer loaned one to one of the police departments of a large city to try out for a while. Well, one day while the cops got called to a bank robbery they used it on the robber as he was shooting at them from his stalled get away car.
If memory serves, the officer only held the trigger for like 3 seconds as he trained the lazer spot on the perp"s car door. The article stated that it ate a 3" hole through the driver door, the bad guy and the opposite side door.
Bet that would be a hoot to shoot at least once at the range.
I think there might be a lot of people interested in a short barreled shotgun for home defense.
Sound supressors would be nice to have in a lot of situations, and I think would be popular if reasonably priced.
Full auto weapons would likely be more common than they are now, but not really that popular.
A full auto gun would be fun to shoot occasionally, but ammo is expensive, and other than for entertainment value I don't really have a need for full auto.
A gun that could do semi-auto and burst fire would be fun to have, but it would be for fun more than a real purpose.
Semi-auto works fine for hunting, home protection in the vast majority of cases, and target shooting.
If I was ever faced with a large number of attackers a full auto weapon would be useful, but I expect that I'd be better off with a smei-auto with a large mag capacity. I like better control of where my shots are going than I feel I'd have with a full auto gun.
Sound supressors would be nice to have in a lot of situations, and I think would be popular if reasonably priced.
Full auto weapons would likely be more common than they are now, but not really that popular.
A full auto gun would be fun to shoot occasionally, but ammo is expensive, and other than for entertainment value I don't really have a need for full auto.
A gun that could do semi-auto and burst fire would be fun to have, but it would be for fun more than a real purpose.
Semi-auto works fine for hunting, home protection in the vast majority of cases, and target shooting.
If I was ever faced with a large number of attackers a full auto weapon would be useful, but I expect that I'd be better off with a smei-auto with a large mag capacity. I like better control of where my shots are going than I feel I'd have with a full auto gun.
I can see subguns and small carbines being a lot more popular, especially for home defense. As some other poster stated, an MP5SD would make a nice "bump in the night" gun.
We would probably have some cool pistol cartridges thrown into SMGs/Carbines too... a .44 Mag in an M2 package might be cool.
We would probably have some cool pistol cartridges thrown into SMGs/Carbines too... a .44 Mag in an M2 package might be cool.
BAR
"Perfect for ranch defense" read one 1920's brochure.
I bet the sawed-off shotgun would be the most popular defensive arm ala Stevens "Auto-Burgler Gun".
And we'd all have silencers, just to shoot indoors and not annoy the neighbors.
"Perfect for ranch defense" read one 1920's brochure.
I bet the sawed-off shotgun would be the most popular defensive arm ala Stevens "Auto-Burgler Gun".
And we'd all have silencers, just to shoot indoors and not annoy the neighbors.
ditto previous comments about silencers. I don't know if the NFA restricted it (as opposed to, say, the Geneva convention), but I always thought smarter bullets could be developed. Those whose target energy was not just a function of mass and velocity. Micro HE rounds. Imagine a .22lr delivering equivalent energy of a .45ACP, on impact. Various micro shaped charges, that would behave in specific ways, to be effective on different targets. That would be cool.
If not addressed specifically, NFA and its descendants have had a chilling effect on mass-marketed weapons development.
If not addressed specifically, NFA and its descendants have had a chilling effect on mass-marketed weapons development.
RevDisk
Member
I'm honked off at the 1934 NFA from the military/LE viewpoint. The majority of our weapons are now made by foreign companies. Fabrique National makes our SAW's, M240, etc. Beretta makes our M9. H&K is making the XM8. Colt and Barrett are virtually the only US companies that are making weapons for the military. Most of the M16's I've seen have the FN logo on them anyways.
Now, yes I know that most of the weapons are physically being made inside the US. But FN, H&K, Beretta, et al are still foreign companies. Do I think we should stop doing business with them? No, of course not. Unless US companies can compete with foreign companies, we NEED foreign companies to design our happy toys.
If it wasn't for NFA, I'd probably invest in a nice select fire SMG and maybe a light MG for fun. A paratrooper version of the SAW would be nice, I really liked handling it. Probably a .22LR happy toy for amusement. Definitely suppressors for all of my toys.
Now, yes I know that most of the weapons are physically being made inside the US. But FN, H&K, Beretta, et al are still foreign companies. Do I think we should stop doing business with them? No, of course not. Unless US companies can compete with foreign companies, we NEED foreign companies to design our happy toys.
If it wasn't for NFA, I'd probably invest in a nice select fire SMG and maybe a light MG for fun. A paratrooper version of the SAW would be nice, I really liked handling it. Probably a .22LR happy toy for amusement. Definitely suppressors for all of my toys.
Sylvilagus Aquaticus
Member
If there were no NFA'34 I am quite certain I'd have
1). A very nice BAR
2). Likely a Solothurn for 'fun times' out at the farm.
3). Suppressors for everything I own. I blame the Fed.Gov for my hearing loss as a 'preventable condition'.
4). A short barrelled shotgun for varmint control like my grandfather had, vis-a-vis, a H&R Handi-Gun.
Regards,
Rabbit.
1). A very nice BAR
2). Likely a Solothurn for 'fun times' out at the farm.
3). Suppressors for everything I own. I blame the Fed.Gov for my hearing loss as a 'preventable condition'.
4). A short barrelled shotgun for varmint control like my grandfather had, vis-a-vis, a H&R Handi-Gun.
Regards,
Rabbit.
stevelyn
Member
If it were not for the '34 NFA, most widely sold FAs would probably be those in current use by the world's militaries. Older weapons such as WW II era FAs and earlier would be sought out by collectors, re-enactors, history buffs, etc. similar to the way C&R holders collect milsurp rifles.
There would also be a profitable industry manufacturing replica WWII and older FAs.
There would also be a profitable industry manufacturing replica WWII and older FAs.
Daedalus
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Obviously the chrome ay-kay wit "da switch".
carpettbaggerr
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American 180. I'd love one if they repealed the NFA
entropy
Member
I would have to have a belt fed of some sort, I'd favor the M249. I agree with wasrjoe, an MP5 (make mine an MP5SDA3, please!) would be a good 'bump in the night' gun, and yes, supressors! I suspect MAC's and Uzi's would be the 'entry level' subgun. And if the DD part were gone, lots of Claymores and clackers would be on my list!
Hand_Rifle_Guy
Member
I'm in agreement with a bunch of folks. BAR's, submachineguns of a variety of types, 22LR buzzguns, silencers, shorty shotguns, and maybe we'd be seeing repeating handguns in calibers over .50. And I want a 1917 MG, they have a pretty slow cycle rate.
Ideally, I'd like a nice artillery piece. The 8" 'long tom' howitzer is still in the armed forces inventory, and was one the most acurrate guns of WW-II and Korea. (I don't suppose you can run on of those by yourself, though.) A 'match-grade' 105mm would be a neat competition gun. Bullseye at 12,000 yards, anyone? For historical fun, I think a Wehrmacht '88' would be like owning a Luger. And for true select-fire over-the-topitude, a Bofors 40mm AA gun would really be the cat's meow.
Recoil-less rifles have a muzzle velocity of of 1000 fps or so typically, regardless of bore size. For those days when you can't make it out to the 'long' artillery range, the lightweight recoil-less rifle could pack in the car trunk, and with the right ammo and backstop, you could recycle projectiles. 25mm wadcutters at say, 500 yards? Wonder what kinda groups you could get?
Ah, to dream...
Ideally, I'd like a nice artillery piece. The 8" 'long tom' howitzer is still in the armed forces inventory, and was one the most acurrate guns of WW-II and Korea. (I don't suppose you can run on of those by yourself, though.
) A 'match-grade' 105mm would be a neat competition gun. Bullseye at 12,000 yards, anyone? For historical fun, I think a Wehrmacht '88' would be like owning a Luger. And for true select-fire over-the-topitude, a Bofors 40mm AA gun would really be the cat's meow.Recoil-less rifles have a muzzle velocity of of 1000 fps or so typically, regardless of bore size. For those days when you can't make it out to the 'long' artillery range, the lightweight recoil-less rifle could pack in the car trunk, and with the right ammo and backstop, you could recycle projectiles. 25mm wadcutters at say, 500 yards? Wonder what kinda groups you could get?
Ah, to dream...
BluesBear
member
In all honesty I believe the most common NFA type weapons to day would be 14" barreled lever action rifles like Winchester made at the turn of the century and Remington/Mossberg pump shotguns with a 12"-15" barrels for home defense use. And I think the Ithica Auto-Burglar would have been a big seller too.
Full auto has always been more of a novelty with limited practical use.
A short barreled rifle or shotgun has many more practicle uses.
I suspect you'd see some smoothbore handguns for shot use too.
And a 4" .44 Magnum mountain gun with a detachable skeleton stock would be great for Alien-Ninja-Zombie-Bears.
Full auto has always been more of a novelty with limited practical use.
A short barreled rifle or shotgun has many more practicle uses.
I suspect you'd see some smoothbore handguns for shot use too.
And a 4" .44 Magnum mountain gun with a detachable skeleton stock would be great for Alien-Ninja-Zombie-Bears.
armoredman
Member
Heard of a belt fed 12 gauge, called Rolling Thunder, but it was in a sci fi book, sorry.
I agree on mandatory suppressors, which, BTW, would have eliminated a lot of complaints about outdoor ranges the antis use to shut them down!
I also agree FA would be popular, but still only with the well-to-do, or huge volume reloaders, as ammo is kinda expensive.
I second the older heavy guns, like the stuff available before the modifications to the NFA34 by GCA 68, as Interordnance in importing fully restored Soviet WWII T-34 medium tanks, and an operating 85mm gun would be a nifty thing - what fun is a neutered tank? How about long long range competetions with Solothurns and Lahtis?
Sorry, momentary fantasy of restored PZ IVG with 75mm and MG42s....
I agree on mandatory suppressors, which, BTW, would have eliminated a lot of complaints about outdoor ranges the antis use to shut them down!
I also agree FA would be popular, but still only with the well-to-do, or huge volume reloaders, as ammo is kinda expensive.
I second the older heavy guns, like the stuff available before the modifications to the NFA34 by GCA 68, as Interordnance in importing fully restored Soviet WWII T-34 medium tanks, and an operating 85mm gun would be a nifty thing - what fun is a neutered tank? How about long long range competetions with Solothurns and Lahtis?
Sorry, momentary fantasy of restored PZ IVG with 75mm and MG42s....
TallPine
Member
For defensive use by a private citizen, I think a 3 round burst would be quite useful and effective.
Desert Dog
Member
Just think of the custom Thompson/1911 combination sets that you could buy...
WVleo
Member
Hi, For Me at least it would be a Thompson aka Tommy Gun ! I have shot a few of the semi-auto versions, but they just don't give the same effect ! Hell I would even start wearing wide brimmed hats to boot ! I guess that was the gun I most enjoyed in the movies and on tv growing up as a kid ! Man to think you could order 1 threw the mail ! Seems stupid we can only have these types of firearms in semi-auto when it only takes 1 shot to kill a person. Where's the argument in that ? Sorta like Pot is illegal but booze and tobbacco are sold in convenience stores and taxed ?...........WVleo
Third_Rail
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Armoredman, I GUARANTEE you that that gun would exist.
Many many times I've thought of a belt fed shotgun, of a belt fed revolver (think minigun where only the chamber rotates, only one barrel) and many other things.
If it weren't for the NFA, I would most likely be making weapons instead of just designing them and working them out.
Many many times I've thought of a belt fed shotgun, of a belt fed revolver (think minigun where only the chamber rotates, only one barrel) and many other things.
If it weren't for the NFA, I would most likely be making weapons instead of just designing them and working them out.
Zach S
Member
Other than oiling it so it doesnt rust, I havent had my civie-legal thompson out of the safe for a month, maybe two.
I read this thread right before going to the range, and though "WTH, may as well."
Sure, its just a semi-auto with a 16" bbl, but its still fun and gets lots of attn. I spent a over hundred bucks on ammo today...
The problem with my front sight drifting out of the dovetail got worse
, but I still had fun, despite picking my front sight up off the floor three or four times and realizing that I had a little too much oil in the action.
I read this thread right before going to the range, and though "WTH, may as well."
Sure, its just a semi-auto with a 16" bbl, but its still fun and gets lots of attn. I spent a over hundred bucks on ammo today...
The problem with my front sight drifting out of the dovetail got worse
, but I still had fun, despite picking my front sight up off the floor three or four times and realizing that I had a little too much oil in the action.abaddon
Member
I don't think shotguns would be as common for self-defense. A SMG on 3 round burst would have similar, if not better, stopping power and much more controllable recoil. Also they'd be much cheaper than they currently are, possibly approaching the price of a typical pump shotgun. I agree that an MP5SD would be an awesome home defense gun, but they wouldn't even have to go that far cost-wise. At the end of WWII they were making greaseguns by the truckloads very cheaply. The companies making them could have transitioned to supplying for the American civilian market and made a fortune. I think just about every household would have one, just because they are reliable, cheap, and would make a passable home defense gun. Especially if they were modified slightly to make them 3 round burst.
Jeff
Jeff
Benjamin
Member
Just had a thought.
Want to find out what sorts would really be in circulation?
Look up some of WildAlaska's posts.
Buckmark with suppressor and detachable stock stand out in my mind.
Want to find out what sorts would really be in circulation?
Look up some of WildAlaska's posts.
Buckmark with suppressor and detachable stock stand out in my mind.
armoredman
Member
Actually, the more I think about it, small concealable machine pistols might be the rage, with two or three round burst, calibers like the 5.7mm being king....25/30 round internal magzine, auto fold down foreward handgrips, integral lasers, etc.....
Ranald
Member
My Choices..
So when we repeal the 1934 NFA and all the rest of those odious and egregious infringements upon our Constitutional, natural and Divinely decreed liberties... 10000 flowers will bloom and 1000 schools of thought will contend for our attention and money! I'm sure there will be many more types of oddball firearms out there than most of us can imagine... And pigs will take to the air on wings of eagles.
BUT for starters, I'm easy to please... A good full auto AKM variety, an m-16A1 and some kind of .22lr bullet hose just for grins! Imagine .22lr being on sale at Walmart on cheap plastic belts for your m60 lookalike! And suppressors, yes suppressors, for the CHILDREN (we MUST protect the young!), so they dont get deaf like most of us older gun-guys! I really wish, back in the 60's when I was being inducted into the gun culture, that earplugs or SUPPRESSORS had been in common use.
But mainly, I would continue to plink and to collect, just as I do now...
So when we repeal the 1934 NFA and all the rest of those odious and egregious infringements upon our Constitutional, natural and Divinely decreed liberties... 10000 flowers will bloom and 1000 schools of thought will contend for our attention and money! I'm sure there will be many more types of oddball firearms out there than most of us can imagine... And pigs will take to the air on wings of eagles.
BUT for starters, I'm easy to please... A good full auto AKM variety, an m-16A1 and some kind of .22lr bullet hose just for grins! Imagine .22lr being on sale at Walmart on cheap plastic belts for your m60 lookalike! And suppressors, yes suppressors, for the CHILDREN (we MUST protect the young!), so they dont get deaf like most of us older gun-guys! I really wish, back in the 60's when I was being inducted into the gun culture, that earplugs or SUPPRESSORS had been in common use.
But mainly, I would continue to plink and to collect, just as I do now...
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