What do you think about the AR 11.5/5.5 Commando Uppers?

[El Rojo]

Ok, I want to get a shorter upper for my FAB-10 than my 20" heavy barrel varmint rig. The main reason is so I can shoot coyotes with it from about 10-30 yards away and because I like AR uppers now. I don't have a lot of cash and the Model 1 and the M&A parts sets look like a good deal because you get a colapsable stock and everything you need for like $400. However I don't know if I am going to want to swap out my buttstock on a regular basis.

My other option is I have found a used Bushmaster 11.5/5.5" Commando A2 upper complete with bolt, bolt carrier, and charging handle for $325 shipped to my door. I would like to get an A3, but for the price, it seems sort of like I am getting a pretty good deal. I like Bushmaster too so that is a big factor.

I have read around on AR15.com and here and the general consensus is that these rifles are not for long range work. They say 2-3 MOA at 100 yards plus is pretty much what you can expect. Ok, I know that and know what to expect. However, they do say a plus is that the 11.5/5.5 flash suppressor cuts down on the noise quite a bit and that vs. a 16" barrel, there is a noticable difference in sound. I like that.

So being on a limited budget I think I am going to get the Bushmaster name and get an A2 commando for a pretty good price. Since I don't plan on using this upper over about 50 yards, I think it will suit my purposes.

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

My 11.5"/5.5" combo was an Olympic Arms and not Bushmaster; but I would have to say that contrary to what you are stating, blast and noise on it was worse than many 16" barreled ARs. Not tremendously worse; but enough that it was the only rifle I've owned where the shooter in the next lane complained to me about it.

 

[fix]

11.5 is too short. I think 14.5 on the M4 is too short. 16 minimum. I just don't get the whole 5.5 inch flash hider thing.

 

[Kharn]

If you're not going to pay the SBR tax and then chop off the flash hider, just get a 16" barrel (or at least 14.5" + flash hider).

Kharn

 

[Harry Tuttle]

the 11.5 is not a great HV frag performer with ball ammo
but with softpoint or OTM ammo it might do the coyote job OK

The bushie is gonna have a chrome bore and be nicer grade 4150 barrel steel

i'm waiting to get my 20" a 16" LW with a threaded end on September 14.

 

[Zundfolge]

Since you have to have the big flash hider to bring the barrel length to 16" you aren't gaining the advantage of the 11.5" barrel and are sacraficing the velocity you'd get out of a 16".

Other then "it looks cool" I can't see any reason for the 11.5/5.5 Commando upper (not that ain't a quasi-legitimate reason ). But if you want "looks cool" then go for the 11.5" barrel and have a fake can put on ... then talk to Skunky (he can hook you up with some other tactical gear, like boots and SpecOps BDUs and stuff )

 

[ny32182]

Get the Bushmaster 16" Superlight upper.

Its VERY lightweight, you get 16" worth of velocity, and its the shortest overall length you can have without paying the SBR tax.

 

[Redlg155]

I don't see any disadvantages since you aren't going to use it past a limited range and then only for target and busting coyotes. If you were going to get it to double as a defense weapon, then I'd definitely go with the 16".

Personally, If I had a 11.5" upper I'd pull the flash supressor off and replace it with a faux silencer. I can't remember the name, but there is a guy over at AR15.com who makes and attatches them for a very reasonable price.



Good Shooting
Red

 

[No4Mk1*]

11.5" barrel is much worse than 14.5" barrel with 1.5" flash suppressor.

 

[GunnFixr]

You may run into reliability issues with the short bbl. When I was in Iraq, I ran across a few SEALs that were using the stubby piped M16 rifles, and they complained to me about failures to eject (I was an armorerin the USMC). The root cause came from the gas system (there wasn't enough). The 14.5" M4 tend to have the same problems to a lesser extent. For my $ the shortest I would go on an AR would be 16"

Since you have to have a total of 16 inches between bbl and brake, I'd just as soon have the full length be barrel.

 

[444]

I have two 11.5" barrel, 5.5" flash suppressor uppers. They are just as accurate as any other garden variety AR15 barrel. I don't notice any increased noise, flash, or blast. They run fine, no reliability issues.
I think they look cool.
They would work fine for the use you plan for it.

 

[B27]

What 444 said. My preban Bushmaster in this configuration is probably the most enjoyable and versatile AR I've ever owned-



-as a civilain I can load it with anything I want, and loaded with Ballistic Tips it will ruin the day of most anything smaller than a horse not wearing armor.

 

[fix]

I ran across a few SEALs that were using the stubby piped M16 rifles, and they complained to me about failures to eject (I was an armorerin the USMC). The root cause came from the gas system (there wasn't enough). The 14.5" M4 tend to have the same problems to a lesser extent.

For those who insist on using the shorter barrels, the pigtail gas tubes can help to alleviate this problem to some extent, but it still will not be as reliable as a longer gas tube. This is the #1 reason I like the mid length setup on a 16 inch barrel.

 

[El Rojo]

Thanks for all of your input everyone. I find it interesting how lots of people say this set up works fine and others who don't particularly care for it. I anticipated that would happen. It seems that most people who had one say they work fine. Those who don't have one don't like them in theory. I am going to send off my my money order today and I will let you guys know how it works out. I appreciate all of your input.

 

[444]

If I only owned one AR15 upper, it probably wouldn't be the one you describe simply because it doesn't maximize the performance for it's overall size. Obviously if the overall length has to be 16" by law, you maximize your performance by having all 16" as barrel. However, I own more than one AR15 upper. So, I don't have to worry about achieving maximum performance out of each one. I can buy one just for looks or the cool factor if I want to. Actually, I ended up with the two 11.5" uppers pretty much by accident. I wanted to build a replica of the rifle I was issued in the military. I found an upper at a gunshow that had the right upper reciever, all I had to do was replace the 11.5" barrel. I brought it home and of course had to try it as is, and I liked it. So, I left it alone. The other one I bought because I wanted the lower. It was a pre-ban lower. I removed the 11.5" upper and made the carbine into an M4orgery. So, I have an 11.5" upper lying around with no lower.
One of my gun school instructors worked on a SWAT team that used 11.5" barrels. They wanted the shortest, reasonable configuration for CQB. They also wanted the option of using a suppressor and having the OAL of the whole package no longer than a regular 16" barreled upper. They bought Colt guns and when they got them, they would not run on full auto although they ran fine on semi-auto. They spoke with the factory and found that Colt did not function test them. They said that because they were selling them to the police and military who had their own armors who would sort out any problems they had He mentioned what they did to correct the problem, but I don't remember what he said now. He did say that it was not a problem in semi-auto, only full auto. I have had no problems at all with my short barreled uppers.
If you do have a problem, there are aftermarket companies that manufacturer different gas tubes. Some are wound in a spiral so you get a longer gas tube in the same length. These are called pigtails. Their purpose is to correct function problems with short barreled uppers.

 

[Onslaught]

My first AR15 was a Bushmaster "Commando" with an A1 upper. I sold the upper and moved on to longer barrels and A3, etc...

BUT

Now that I have multiple AR's, I wish I still had the Commando just for the heck of it.

Also, having owned AR's with 11.5", 14.5", 16" (all pre-ban) and 20" (postban), I can say from first hand experience that the first three were pretty much even on sound and muzzle blast (from my end) and that the 20" post-ban Armalite with "blast enhancer" is BY FAR the loudest, most annoying muzzle blasting AR I've owned.

As for accuracy, the longer barrels were better, but not by much... Plus, I've scoped all my A3's, so that could have been the reason. What I CAN say is that MY Commando did NOT like the 62grain stuff. I had about 1200 rounds of actual US Military "green tip" ammo (don't ask how ) and I would get literally 12" groups at 100 yards. Others have reported no problems, but I sure had 'em.

On the reliability end, I never had a single malfunction from my Commando. It fed everything from Winchester to S&B to the NATO stuff and never hung up once.

Lastly, I can tell you what advantages the 11.5"/5.5" have over the 14.5" and 16" barrels, and you can decide if they are worth the lower muzzle velocity...

Not so much anymore, but back in 1993 when I bought mine, and still in 1999 when I bought my fluted 14.5" HBAR, the Commando was noticeably lighter in weight than the other carbine barrels. 5" of barrel weighs more than 5" of flash supressor. With the M4 profile and the new Bushmaster ultralight barrel, I guess that's no such a difference. I have NO first hand experience with the UL, but the M4 barrel is still a tad heavier, especially muzzle-heavier, than the Commando.

One last TINY little thing I like to point out. Sometimes, you hear "well, you need the flash supressor to make it legal, so what's the point of a shorter than 16" barrel" in discussions of the M4 and Commando barrels. Not a big deal really, but a pre-ban 16" barrel with A2 flash supressor is 1" longer than the M4 and Commando barrels. IF, only with the M4, you added a flash supressor of the same quality and effectiveness as the one probably on the M4 (Phantom or Vortex) then it's 1.5" longer. Again, not a big deal, but apples and apples and all that.

Personally, the upper is of more concern to me than the barrel length. I know yours is an A2, but to demonstrate my point, if I had to choose between a 16" A2 and a 11.5"/5.5" A3, I'd go with the A3 and shorter barrel.

 

[BushyGuy]

i did some testing with my Bushmaster with the 11.5" Hbar and 5.5. can it offers deeper penetration then the longer barrels, i was able to penetrate the boards and still have enough to go thru the other boards with spaced in between.

dont be fooled by the shorter barrel is not good enough crap- they offer better penetration.

i have the same gun as B27 has on the bottom of the picture above.

 

[ramis]

 

[W L Johnson]

5 1/2 years between postings. Wow

 

[BushyGuy]

does anyone know the max frag distance form the 11.5" HBAR? with 55 gr bullets

 

[adam.lamb72]

I know the NAVY has the Mk 18 MOD 0. Its a 10.5 in upper. To fix the cycling issue they installed a larger gas tube and port. i have shot thousands of rounds from the 10.5 and i own an 11.5 on a pistol lower. the 11.5 is from m&a . i have had no issues with feeding. and shoot 200 yrd no prob with a 3x9x42.