What Magnum Rifle?

[X-Rap]

I sure wouldn't choose another rifle to add to my collection based on what bullets I already had.
I'm not a fan of the 270 in the first place but only due to the way my personal calibers have developed over the years. My first serious rifle was a 280 and I dropped to a 25-06 for deer and antelope so the 270 never caught traction with me.
Given you have a great deer gun loaded with 130 gr bullets if I wanted to expand I'd sure look hard at the Rem 7mag or 300 Win Mag, both sell commercially anywhere you go, have ample power and range for your stated needs, have an excellent range of bullets available.
I applaud you for wanting to expand your firearms horizons and don't believe you will be disappointed by such, I'd also recommend you move the other way and pick up a 243 or similar when finances allow.
The cold water some want to dump on a hunter who looks past the cookie cutter world some live in makes me want to puke sometimes and I wish I could apologize for them all.

 

[Covelo-NdN]

Thank you everyone for your time and consideration. I'm really surprised in OYE response. Just buy a out a state tag... What states can a Californian go into and hunt with just a out a state tag? Should I post this in another Area?

 

[Robert]

You can legally hunt any state as long as you meet their requirements. Usually some form of Hunters Safety/ Education class. Colorado has a draw or you can buy over the counter tags for some areas. But be ready to pay form them. I think out of state cow elk tags are running north of $400. While as a resident I pay less than $50.

All states vary a bit but any of the western states with elk will allow you to buy or put in for a license as long as you meet their requirements.

 

[OYE]

Th

ank you everyone for your time and consideration. I'm really surprised in OYE response. Just buy a out a state tag... What states can a Californian go into and hunt with just a out a state tag? Should I post this in another Area?

Pretty sure Idaho is first come first serve for elk in many units for nonresidents and residents alike. I see people from California that come up to hunt every year There are quotas on most units. Used to start for nonresidents in December, but I haven't looked for a while. Go to the Idaho Deparment of Fish and Game website and read the regulations. There are some draw units for everybody also. As Robert mentioned Colorado has over the counter tags. Go to their website and read the regs. OYE

 

[Lloyd Smale]

I never personaly said a 270 wouldn't kill an elk. Heck 757s have killed piles of elephant What I believe is most guys on a shooting site are shooters (some just pretend) and when someone posts that guys shooting relatively mild guns like a 7 mag or 300 mag are apes just spraying bullets it just shows me that they don't spend much time at the range. If your to timid to shoot a 300 mag enough to get it into your head they they make a lot of noise but don't really hurt you stay with a 243 for sure. But don't put down someone who does take the time to master one. Then you get those who want to insist a mag isn't more powerful. Id like to see the loading manual that puts the 270win and 270wsm neck and neck or the 280 and 7 rem mag or an 06 and a 300 win mag. Yup they kick more, that's a given. Personaly I bought big boy underware many years ago. Shooting big guns can be fun once you get over the fear that there going to actually HURT you. Geez id hate to think what youd think of me if you showed up at the range and I had my 475 or 500 linebaugh out. Bottom line is the mags kick a bit harder, burn more powder (about 10 cents worth a round), factory ammo cost more and you have to shoot them more then 5 times a year to master them. In exchange the shoot flatter, hit harder. Funny thing about these posts in next week youll be defending your 270 against someone who thinks his 243 is the ideal gun and doesn't want to deal with the recoil of a 270 or 06. :banghead: If you cant handle one that's fine. Its good that you admit it to the world but don't believe for a second there isn't a lineup of guys who can. You can say your 270 is enough but can you say that a 7mag or 300 mag in the hands of someone that can shoot it not a better elk rifle. What if the huge trophy of a lifetime steps out at 400 yards and its getting to be dark 30 and you don't have time for a stalk. You going to be just as confident in your 270 as you would be if you had a 300 mag? If so maybe the guys that hunt deer with a 223 or even a 243 are right about your overpowered 270 on deer

I just went and looked at hornadys ballistic chart. You super duper 270 at 400 yards with a 150 is going an amazing 1500fps that's 30 carbine energy levels (some real elk medicine) a 300 win mag has a 180 grain bullet still traveling at 2050 which is about equal to a 3030 at the muzzle. Which would you rather have

 

[MachIVshooter]

I just went and looked at hornadys ballistic chart. You super duper 270 at 400 yards with a 150 is going an amazing 1500fps that's 30 carbine energy levels (some real elk medicine) a 300 win mag has a 180 grain bullet still traveling at 2050 which is about equal to a 3030 at the muzzle.

Interesting. Because when I look at the Hornady chart, I see 2,095 FPS @ 400 for the .270 150 gr load:

http://www.hornady.com/store/270-Win-150-gr-SP/

Nobody is telling you not to hunt with a .300 mag, Lloyd. In fact, I don't see anyone on this side of the debate saying magnums are a bad idea. What I see if a bunch of us who have figured out that under almost any circumstance, a big boomer is just not needed to take a North American ungulate. It's not that we're afraid of recoil, and for some of us, it's not even a question of owning the rifles: I have 2 sporting rifles chambered in rounds that make your .300 win mag look rather pitiful.

The issue is that the OP has nigh been convinced by hunting/gun rags that he needs more rifle to take elk, which is patently untrue. The .270 has been used on elk with great success for the better part of a century, and before that, even less powerful rounds like the .30-30, .30-40 Krag on back to the straight walled black powder stuff and even muzzle loaders. There are even people who kill these animals with - gasp- a bow and arrow!

 

[Lloyd Smale]

http://www.hornady.com/ballistics-resource/ballistic-chart

 

[Lloyd Smale]

Well I don't live where the elk roam in my backyard and for me its a big expense going out there to hunt them even though my sister lives out there and I can stay with her. I go back to what I said. If a once in a lifetime trophy is out at 400 yards and its my last chance to shoot him id feel kind of stupid trying to prove I can do it with a gun that's not ideal. 1500 fps at 400 yards Id rather be 30 yards away with my bow! Maybe if I lived out there and had to the whole season to causally hunt id think different. Ive got friends out west. The husband has hunted elk with a 2506 for decades and his wife uses a 243. Thing is they got all season and there not looking for trophy bulls. Theyd rather shoot a 300lb cow. Im retired now and don't even get out there very often even to visit anymore.

Locally we have deer and that's it. A very long shot in deer season is a 100 yards and a 3030 is all a guy really needs. As a matter of fact I hunted for 15 years with a handgun. I have a safe full of flat shooting rifles because I have the opportunity to do crop damage deer culling and shoot probably an average of 50 deer a year and a close shot is 200 yards, most are 300 or so and a few each year are shot out past 500. I put what I consider logical limits on my guns and the 308 gets put away any time something past 300 yards is possible and the 280/2506/06 ill stretch to 350 and maybe with a perfect setup 400. After that its time to break out the magnums. We shoot maybe 5 deer on a good night and I don't want to spend the whole night chasing around deer that ran off into the swamp and drag them out. I like the dead right there! and have found magnums with cup and core mid weight bullets just get it done better. I also use it for a chance to test different calibers and bullets. My partner is a gun nut like me and he uses two guns a 2506 for the closer stuff and a 257wby for the long. Even he shakes his head at me out there with my 7stw or 300 ultra but the kill the hell out of deer and with a proper shot don't waste anymore meat then a 270.

Everyone has opinions as do I. I know what I like for whitetail and am certainly not taking what I consider a gun that marginal for long range deer out after long range elk. I feel I owe it to the animal to use enough gun and like I said im to old and lazy to get a kick out of dragging deer all night but your circumstances could be completely different then mine.

 

[Lloyd Smale]

I apologize I went back and looked and those were ft lbs of energy differnces I quoted you. Velocity on that sight had the 150 270 at 2097 and the 180 300 mag going 2289 with then energy difference quoted in the other post. any way you look at it that 300 is packing as much punch at 500 yards as a 270 at 200 and so does a 7mag according to that chart

 

[Hunter8mm]

I have and love a 7mm Mag, but if you already have a 270 and really wanted a magnum I would get nothing less than a 300 magnum. any 338 magnum would probably make the most sense.

Of course if you want the best long range (and most obscure) find an 8mm Remington Magnum and you will always have a conversation piece. Of course I have one!

 

[nathan]

7 mmRM is the way to go. Its a step up to the .3006 the caliber of the 20th century .

 

[magnatecman]

Covelo,

I have lived in elk country and hunted elk my whole life with nothing but a .270 that I worked all summer for when I was 16 years old. It has never let me down ! In fact my lil' brother used a .243 for many years with great success and never had that let him down either. I'm not saying a .243 is the right gun for the job, just that your .270 is plenty if you use the right bullets and know your dope.

I would rather spend some money and time preparing for that hunt with practice, practice and more practice. Get a scope with either a turret, or a bullet drop compensating reticle that you like and make sure you know the dope of your elk load and that it is accurate out to your max effective range. If you don't have a good range finder, get one, it's as important to you as good binoculars.

That being said, I would bet that the vast majority of my shots on game are well under 100 yards. That's why all my rifles are zeroed at 100 yards ! But 600 yards is also no problem so long as the wind is not too bad !

Just some food for thought that has served me well for the last 26 years.

 

[elktrout]

magnatecman raises a point that is important: the darn wind. Take a good look at the wind drifts on some of the ballistics calculators that are on-line, such as the one Hornady has. Elk hunting almost always involves wind to some extent, and 10-20 mph winds in the mountains are typical on a lot of days.

The wind drift calculations are hard to believe: however, if you enter your load data correctly, the drift numbers are darn close and very scary when you start considering shooting 400 yards or more.


Before you buy something different, do the research on the wind drifts. It may give you more direction on what rifle to buy or simply to stay with your old 270.

My last point is that elk stopping is largely unpredictable. Same bullets, same cartridge, same day, same distance, same impacts on bodies can have remarkably different results. 1858 is correct that really big guns have incredible stopping power, if the point of impact is proper. But most of us will likely not be comfortable with his recommended 375. HOWEVER, he is absolutely correct that tracking one very far is a nightmare. I had it happen to me, and I never found the bull that ran off into a horribly steep, thick, and dangerous ravine after he nearly collapsed when the bullet him in the rib cage.

My hunting friend on that trip is a former guide who has personally killed 40 elk in his lifetime with various rifles, ranging from the 270 to the 375. He also witnessed many other elk killed by his clients. His personal favorites are the 300s, and he has killed the majority of his elk with one of them.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

The wind drift calculations are hard to believe: however, if you enter your load data correctly, the drift numbers are darn close and very scary when you start considering shooting 400 yards or more.

Many years ago the Norwegian Army did a study on sniping and concluded that errors in estimating wind cause more misses than errors in estimating range. I believe them.

 

[PabloJ]

The great news is having fine 6.9x63mm you do not need a magnum for game you intend to hunt. For larger game bullets of better construction should be chosen. If one does not reload there are commercial cartridges loaded with Nosler Partition, Swift A Frame and Trophy Bonded Bear Claw bullets.

If you want real solid magnum this one is hard to beat.....http://www.cabelas.com/product/CZ-Model-550-Rifle-300/1959976.uts

It is little expensive but you get high quality detachable magazine and professional grade ERA-Recknagel running game rear/front sight. That nice backup sight to have in case you want to shoot some rabbits for the pot.

 

[PabloJ]

I love my M70 Safari Express in 375H&H. Contrary to what the internet says, the 375 will not vaporize meat. In fact 375 does less meat damage than the modern 7mm and 30 caliber magnums. If you hand load you can create some powder puff range loads all the way up to safari grade solids.

If you can shoot a 12ga with heavy field loads then you can shoot a 375. The recoil is easily managed and not severe at all. He round is inherently accurate across a wide range of bullet weights meaning there is less poi shift across the range.

My rifle weighs 9lbs with optics, is well balanced and is a breeze to carry all day in the Colorado mountains.

Having owned couple I have to disagree. The recoil is about twice that of .30-06 which average fellow would likely consider quite stout.

 

[d2wing]

I choose the 7MM RM because it shoots flatter and not far behind the bigger magnums in energy. If you plan on close shots it doesn't matter much but if you want to reach out 400 yards or more The 7 MM Mag is hard to beat. Or the .300 Win Mag. The bigger mags drop too much for me and lose velocity faster.

 

[Robert]

Pablo my experienc has been the exact opposite. But that's OK, its good to get a complete picture of things. Mine kicks like a 12ga with heavy field loads.