In the Mexican engagement that csmkersh metioned Patton used his .45 SA to kill two Mexicans. He notched the left grip for those two kills. I have seen those notches myself at the Patton Museum; the first pistol I had ever actually seen marked for killing someone.
What model was Gen. Patton's .357?
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256M-S
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Patton called his S&W 357 his "killing gun." though it doesn't appear that he actually killed with it. If memory serves, his primary kill with the SAA 45 was General Cardenas, the chief of Los Dorados, Villa's body guards. Lovely picture of 2 bodies draped over the fender of his Dodge (?) touring car.
It's probably a matter of wordplay, but Patton in his stated view, wore the ivory stocked functional guns not for show, but as a distinctive part of dress so that he could be readily recognized by his troops. Hard for gun folks to fault even a Flag Rank officer for liking firearms and preferring to carry a personal sidearm or sidearms. The ivory was in the view of many folks of the time, a practical gunstock material that had warmth to the feel and added to the balance and handling qualities of the weapon. Very much unlike today when so many tack plastic ivory on their sidearms for nothing but show. Certainly Patton's weapons were acquired legitimately and carried honorably in service. They were probably much less an affectation than Gavin's M-1, Ridgeway's grenades, and Hank Emerson's SAA Army 45 in RVN....not to mention DugOut Doug's salty crushed barracks hat replete with shades and corncob.
Personally, I always thought the composed brace a proper touch for a fighting genera to wear weapons that he had used and carried rather than affecting a pure show rig. It's also a nice touch that with all of Patton's flair for showmanship and his tendency to wear the maximum stars on his uniform and even on the butt of his Remington and Colt pocket pistols, he wore his Sam Myers belt rig for the SAA and S&W with the old 1910 Web Belt buckle instead of the fancier General Officers belt buckle.
I think we'll not see his like in our left media world again....though some of the Flag Ranks who retired during the clintonista administration and have been returned to active duty under Bush to run his war against terrorism, certainly have more ground combat experience than any general officers since the War for Southern Rights....Their growing up amongst the Silent Professionals just shaped their approach to leadership differently.
It's probably a matter of wordplay, but Patton in his stated view, wore the ivory stocked functional guns not for show, but as a distinctive part of dress so that he could be readily recognized by his troops. Hard for gun folks to fault even a Flag Rank officer for liking firearms and preferring to carry a personal sidearm or sidearms. The ivory was in the view of many folks of the time, a practical gunstock material that had warmth to the feel and added to the balance and handling qualities of the weapon. Very much unlike today when so many tack plastic ivory on their sidearms for nothing but show. Certainly Patton's weapons were acquired legitimately and carried honorably in service. They were probably much less an affectation than Gavin's M-1, Ridgeway's grenades, and Hank Emerson's SAA Army 45 in RVN....not to mention DugOut Doug's salty crushed barracks hat replete with shades and corncob.
Personally, I always thought the composed brace a proper touch for a fighting genera to wear weapons that he had used and carried rather than affecting a pure show rig. It's also a nice touch that with all of Patton's flair for showmanship and his tendency to wear the maximum stars on his uniform and even on the butt of his Remington and Colt pocket pistols, he wore his Sam Myers belt rig for the SAA and S&W with the old 1910 Web Belt buckle instead of the fancier General Officers belt buckle.
I think we'll not see his like in our left media world again....though some of the Flag Ranks who retired during the clintonista administration and have been returned to active duty under Bush to run his war against terrorism, certainly have more ground combat experience than any general officers since the War for Southern Rights....Their growing up amongst the Silent Professionals just shaped their approach to leadership differently.
Oscar Orum
Member
PATTON'S RIG
BluesBear, Let me see I can help with "Guns and Ammo" about 1970 showing the general's rig and description thereof. I have at least 35 years of the publication and will check it for you. I seem to remember the article you speak of. A pm with mailing address would be appreciated.
BluesBear, Let me see I can help with "Guns and Ammo" about 1970 showing the general's rig and description thereof. I have at least 35 years of the publication and will check it for you. I seem to remember the article you speak of. A pm with mailing address would be appreciated.
tulsamal
Member
An officer (especially a senior one) doesn't carry a handgun to use against the enemy. It is a long standing tradition and based on the idea of force being behind the orders. If he ordered you to go forward and close with the enemy and you refused, he could just pull out his pistol and shoot you!
This idea is long before we had some officers who were unwilling (and even unable) to use force for discipline in some circumstances. Our military was never anything like the Soviet Union where you were just as likely to be killed from behind as by the Germans but officers DID use their sidearms in such a way on occasion. If an officer realized he was just about to have a general revolt, killing the ringleader might be just the thing to get everybody back into proper military order!
Gregg
Harve Curry
Member
csmkersh wrote:
He used his Colt SAA while with Pershing's Expeditionary Force chasing Poncho Villa. He ran it dry and was not to happy with the slow reload while still taking fire. The Pershing thing was the last calvary charge and the first use of the 1911 in battle. The airplane shooting was apparently with his general officer's gun, a 1903 Colt Pocket Pistol he often carried under his jacket.
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Sam A. Kersh
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If ignorance is bliss, why aren't more people happy?
The last U.S. horse cavalry charge belongs to Col. Ed Ramsey of Orange County, California. He was orderd to hold a bridge crossing a river in the Phillipines against the japs, January 1942. His charge caught the japs off gaurd and they got to shoot alot of them from the banks of the river.
He wrote a book about it,"Lt. Ramsey's War", what a man of action he is, a true American hero.
He used his Colt SAA while with Pershing's Expeditionary Force chasing Poncho Villa. He ran it dry and was not to happy with the slow reload while still taking fire. The Pershing thing was the last calvary charge and the first use of the 1911 in battle. The airplane shooting was apparently with his general officer's gun, a 1903 Colt Pocket Pistol he often carried under his jacket.
__________________
Sam A. Kersh
NRA Patron Member
L.E.A.A. Life Member
TSRA Life Member
GOA, JPFO, SAF
If ignorance is bliss, why aren't more people happy?
The last U.S. horse cavalry charge belongs to Col. Ed Ramsey of Orange County, California. He was orderd to hold a bridge crossing a river in the Phillipines against the japs, January 1942. His charge caught the japs off gaurd and they got to shoot alot of them from the banks of the river.
He wrote a book about it,"Lt. Ramsey's War", what a man of action he is, a true American hero.
OP
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DMK
Member
I've often wondered if part of the reason (surely unspoken) was self defense. An unpopular officer or one who issued an order that wasn't well received may find himself in a situation where he'd be glad to have a sidearm.
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