What should I say to the Executive Vice President of First Data?

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boredelmo

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You guys should all know the news about them cutting off ties with CDNN:

http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Talk/talk.politics.guns/2008-01/msg00304.html

His/her father is living in my room right now, I'm stuck in my sisters :(. He/she is family. I will call him/her tomorrow.

What do I say? What do you guys want to know? Are people canceling accounts because of this? How big of a deal is this to firearms owners?

Serious replies only please. I'm doing my part for our Pro-gun movement... Yay.

-Elmer
 
Um I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Personally I'm cutting off all dealings with CITI and I'm encouraging everyone I know to cease all patronage of CITI. I don't tolerate financial meddling such as this.
 
In no particular order -

Are the comments about the "reason" for the termination accurate? Is it all because somebody feels CDNN's business is "immoral"?

Are the statements in the 12/26/07 letter vetted by corporate legal? Did Citi really believe that CDNN was violating the law(s), and if so, what was their evidence or reason to suspect that? Again, was this run past corporate legal?

Are they nucking futs?

Did anybody anticipate the backlash this will create? Did anybody prepare to respond to the stockholders once this hits the media and/or the fan?

Will Citi review the account status of all other account-holders and take the same action against any others found with practices similar to CDNN's? (In other words, what is Citi doing to avoid a discrimination type lawsuit? I know selling guns is not a civil right, but there is more than likely some sort of restraint of trade or other category they can be sued under.)

Are they nucking futs?

Did anybody prepare a plan to respond to the potential loss of revenue from the backlash from this move? How's that working? (I know it is very early, but ask them to revisit the question in 6 months.)

Did they know about and approve this prior to it happening? Would they have preferred to have known about it in advance?

Are they nucking futs?

It's early in the AM & I'm still in a state of amazement.

stay safe.

skidmark
 
Since ANY firearms sales from any on-line retailer MUST go to a licensed FFL, I do not see what non-FTF sales have ANYTHING to do with their concern.

Please add my voice to those that will cease ALL dealings with the company. Furthermore, I will use my voice to insure that others do the same. I personally can think of 12 people RIGHT NOW that are not aware of this situation but WILL be outraged enough to cease dealings with the company as well.

What is it they say about word of mouth? Please a customer and he will tell one person. Anger one and he will tell 20 persons....



-- John
 
They are obviously acting either out of ignorance of the law, or making a direct affront to every gun owner and person whose livelihood stems from the shooting industry.

The former can be fixed, the latter cannot.

If it is the latter, I'll gladly cut up my citi card. With so much credit competition out there, I can undoubtedly find a card with better terms and rewards.
 
It sounds to me like an activist move by the company.

I can hear them saying "We can't change the Constitution, but we can deny gunowners the ability to purchase guns. Afterall, if you control the financial networks, you control the policy.

OR...


They are SO stupid that they actually believe things that some of the anti-gunners spew about being able to order "assault rifles" on-line with no regulation.


I think it is some of both. Sadly, this is the new trend in our country.... Making HUGE decisions based upon sound-bites, and not bothered to check the accuracy of the statements. AND then defending your original decision by altering your reasoning if those statements prove to be wrong.

Ignorance and Pride... that is the trend these days.


-- John
 
It sounds to me like an activist move by the company.
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i'm not so sure about this.

citigroup has been through the wringer on a number of fronts and have been beaten up by financial regulators for seemingly the past decade. remember the dot-bomb stock scandals? i think they had to shell out a billion quid to settle that mess.

now, they have to clean up their subprime loan exposure. they have $55 BILLION in subprime loans. they've identified $10-$15 BILLION of these loans that are probably worthless. there are probably other shoes to drop.

all this basically tells me that they're clamping down on the risk controls and, in usual fashion, are over-reacting to anything and everything after the fact.

i wouldn't be surprised if Citi goes bankrupt. nowadays, who knows if "too big to fail" is now "too big to bail." if that happens, the merchant clearing services will be sold to somebody else who doesn't have such a big stick up their butt about lawful firearms transactions.
 
I'll cancel my credit card with them if this is not taken care of. If they do the right thing and rescind this letter then I'll keep it. Tell your cousin this, and I'll be writing a letter of the same effect, to both the crazy woman who wrote the letter and to Citibank customer service.
 
"We were contacted recently by First Data/Citi Merchant Services by a June Rivera-Mantilla stating that we were terminated and funds were
being seized for selling firearms in a non-face-to-face transaction,"
said Charlie Crawford, president of CDNN Sports Inc. "Although
perfectly legal, we were also informed that no transactions would be
processed in the future, even for non-firearms. I find this very
frightening."

:what: :fire: :fire:
Click to expand...
 
I looked in my wallet, and yeah, there is a CITI card in it. I would be glad to cancel it, although I don't think it will impress anyone. I haven't charged anything on it for over two years, and before that any time I did, I paid it off right away. They will probably be glad to see me go! :eek:
 
To hell with rescinding the letter they should never have done it in the first place! If I had a CITI card it would be in the trash right now!

I would also have them add to the account specifically WHY you are canceling the account.


gun.gif
 
I am cancelling my Citi account.

I had already planned on weeding out the extra credit cards and now I know which ones to dump.

Thank her for making my decision easy. Goodbye Citi.

(Ironically I had just discovered a citibank in my area and was considering moving accounts there to simplify... guess that's not gonna happen either.)
 
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My mortgage is thru CitiMortgage. It didn't start out that way, but it was sold to them. I don't have any Citi CCs.

Is this worth refinancing to a higher rate plus? I don't think so, but I will write to the induhviduals listed and assure them that I will never do business with Citicorp again.
 
Questions to ask.

Background:

CDNN is responsible for operating its business in accordance with federal and state laws. Those laws provide for firearms sales at a distance between seller and buyer. Federal and state agencies are charged with enforcing those laws. Those agencies evidently allow CDNN to continue in business, presumably because CDNN operates its lawful business in a lawful manner.

Questions: Part 1

  1. Is CITI a law enforcement agency?
  2. Under what authority--federal, state, or local--has CITI assumed law enforcement responsibilities and powers?
  3. Does CITI have law enforcement responsibilities and powers superior to those of existing law enforcement agencies in the area of firearms sales?
  4. Are CITI employees sworn officers?

Questions: Part 2

  1. Does CITI have evidence that CDNN is violating or has violated federal, state, or local laws?
  2. If so, has CITI presented that evidence to the appropriate law enforcement agencies?
  3. If not, why not?

Questions: Part 3

  1. If CITI is not a law enforcement agency and has no evidence that CDNN violated any laws regarding firearms sales, what is the extent of the liability CITI assumes for the acts of CDNN and its customers?
  2. How does CITI plan to discharge the liability it has assumed by virtue of CDNN's past sales?
  3. Why does CITI assume liability for the acts of its merchants and their customers?
  4. Is CITI concerned about the liability it has assumed for the acts of merchants in other businesses and their customers?
  5. How does CITI enforce its responsibilities in those other businesses that use CITI to process their receipts--as for example to restaurant customers who are made ill by foods served in restaurants and to automobile owners whose cars are involved in accidents or to pedestrians injured by those cars?

Questions: Part 4

  1. Does CITI refuse to process transactions with other lawful businesses and/or professions operated within the law?
  2. Does CITI refuse to process transactions with political parties such as the Democratic, Republican, Libertarian, Communist, or American Nazi parties?
  3. Does CITI refuse to process transactions with physicians, pharmacies, automobile mechanics, new and/or used car dealerships, booksellers, web sites, or newspaper, book, or magazine publishers?
  4. What investigative process does CITI employ to determine and certify the bona fides of the above enterprises and others with which it does business?
  5. How does CITI justify its methods of operation in these areas in a free enterprise system in which lawful businesses entitled to operate?
  6. Is CITI the beneficiary of any federal, state, or local monies?
 
I just left June a voice mail. The phone number was in her letter to CDNN.

I basically asked what CDNN was doing that was illegal and was she even aware of what the laws are governing firearms sales! What a fruitcake!
 
Personally I'm cutting off all dealings with CITI and I'm encouraging everyone I know to cease all patronage of CITI. I don't tolerate financial meddling such as this.
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I couldn't have said it better myself. I can think of about 6 other folks that will be canceled in the next few days.

-John
 
We cancelled all accounts with CitiBank and CitiCard several years ago due to their policies and actions, and it had nothing to do with this latest thing.

If you really want to pursue this (you being the original poster of this thread) then ask if the news is accurate, and if so then ask if it was based upon legal reasons or political reasons or other reasons. If you want to tread into dark waters then ask if they also prohibit the use of their cards for any other types of purchases. Based upon the answer you receive, if any, you can proceed from there.
 
So they'll process transactions for porn or alcohol or (perscription) drugs, do cash advances for a 19 year old to an ATM on the floor of the Vegas Mirage, but not legal firearm sales?

See this is where I go all "big gov" if I'm the POTUS or a state governor and revoke their ability to lend, to use the police to repossess or to use the court system to collect until they agree to process all lawful transactions.
 
The part about seizing funds, that just screams that they want sued. I have a hard time believing it can be true. To do such a thing would open them up to such liability, would it not?

As for the OP, ask this guy what he knows about it. If he pleads ignorant, inform him. Then, inform him he is no longer welcome in your home and boot him out. No place to go? Tough. See how the big shot likes getting the short end.
 
First Data is more responsible for this than Citicorp. Citi Merchant Services is a division of First Data Merchant Services. The Citi name is used under license.

Here in Omaha, First Data has the reputation of having the highest IT employee suicide rate in the area.
 
The part about seizing funds, that just screams that they want sued. I have a hard time believing it can be true. To do such a thing would open them up to such liability, would it not?
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Absolutely not true, it's part of the agreement that you sign. When they close or cancel an account a certain figure, based on average return rates, it maintained by the processor to cover any future returns or customer problems.

But let's see about actually doing something to get Citi to take positive action. Lets get some email addresses and start writing, when they see millions of $$$ in potential customers running from them they might change their minds.
 
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