What size Buckshot?

[clubsoda22]

I'm gonna order federal low recoil LE shells for my defender. What # buckshot do you guys like for home defence and why. Really, i'm trying to decide between 000, 00, and 4.

Understood that if the BG is 3 yards from you it won't make a difference, but as far as terminal ballistics go, what's better, 2 dozen 1/4" holes or 8-9 1/3" holes?

 

[Dave McCracken]

At typical HD ranges,you'll have ONE hole,up to a coupla inches across, regardless of load.

There's no way to forecast what'll work best for you. Best to measure, not estimate, the longest possible shot inside your domicile and test ammo at that range plus one yard for GPs. After getting the results you want, retest at 25 yards in case you have to militia things up outside. Any HD shotgun may be a Community Defense tool also.

Wheelman just did it.He's much better prepared than someone just taking advice.

I suggest testing 00, 1 and 4 buck, in 2 3/4" only. Mag loads aren't needed and are counter productive.

I use 00,which has been thoroughly tested. Your needs, skills and shotguns are different.

HTH...

 

[Glamdring]

At close range pellet size doesn't matter much. If you live someplace that has real winters I would lean towards OO buck. Just remember with SG one to the body and one to the head should do the job even with 6's.

 

[Al Thompson]

Um - does Federal Low Recoil come in anything other than OO?

 

[El Tejon]

Al, yup, #4 buck. I may have purchased the last cases in the country though. Do not know if Federal will put in back in the catalogue.

club, go shoot your gun.

 

[Sunray]

A 3" mag with 4 buck holds 47 6mm pellets. Yes, it'll make one hole at close range, but it'll be a very big hole. Outside, you'll have more pellets in the air than with OO or anything else. Mind you, it ain't defensive being outside.

 

[Navy joe]

More info please on the last case in the country comment? Fed #4 RR is my favorite carry/killing steel monsters load.

 

[El Tejon]

Navy joe, cleaned out a couple of distribs around here this spring. Check out your way.

Last I knew Federal stopped cataloging it; however, someone may be sitting on some (that never makes sense to me, move that ammo, eats up overhead).

 

[Al Thompson]

Huh, learn something every day. Thanks ET.

 

[HerbG]

I'd suggest actually patterning your shotgun with several buckshot sizes before making up your mind. I settled on #4 buckshot after patterning my Benelli Nova with 18.5 cylinder bore barrel. Larger buckshot left some gaping holes in the pattern at 15 & 20 yards. #4 loads have enough pellets to get multiple hits at those ranges.

Personally I don't share the idea that any size shot is OK at "typical home defense ranges." Exactly what is "typical?" The assumption seems to be that encounters in the home will be at very short distances, but I'm not sure that is true. In my home, the maximum distance from bedroom entrance to back door is 16 yards - not exactly point blank range. I don't want to be shooting a load of #6's at that distance!

 

[Al Thompson]

Excellent point Herb. That's why we look at our engagement zones and plan accordingly! Thanks for the reality check!

 

[Dave McCracken]

Herb, have you shot some 6s at that distance from your HD shotgun? Out of the chokeless barrel on my HD 870, the old Remington 1 1/4 oz Ringneck puts the core of its load into 5" or so at 15 yards, Fringe pellets open it up to a total spread of about 12". But the core would hit as a semi solid mass.

I also suggest you pattern again with larger buck,using stuff like the Fed Lite, Estate RR and Winchester basic 00. At those close distances, there shouldn't be patchy patterns.

 

[clubsoda22]

i measured the longest distances in my house, there's no hallway or pair of rooms bigger than 10 yards. I'm going to pattern, but i think #4 may suit my purposes as it has less penetration than 00 and would be more effective if the fight were taken outside (10-25 yards).

 

[Ringer]

Last I knew Federal stopped cataloging it; however, someone may be sitting on some (that never makes sense to me, move that ammo, eats up overhead).

Ammoman has the "FEDERAL TACTICAL # 4 BUCKSHOT LAW ENFORCEMENT HIGH ENERGY LOW RECOIL AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC ( 27-PELLETS )" available or were you referring to the Classic Low Recoil (H132)?

 

[Corey ACP]

You will want to try it before you buy any large amounts of federal's or any other brand of low power load, make sure it will cycle your SG if it is a self loader. My dept. used to issue to LE reduced Federal load and some of the shorter length barrel guns that had a light mounted in the forestock. refused to cycle reliably. So they went back to the full power load.

 

[Mike Irwin]

I keep Number 4 in the S&W, with 5 rounds of S&B 00 in a cuff on the buttstock.

 

[Snowman92D]

The metro LE agency I work for was unhappily saddled with standard-recoil #4 buckshot for almost ten years before we unloaded it and went to a reduced-recoil 00-buckshot load.

#4 buckshot is a poor penetrator on big or heavily-clothed bad guys at anything much beyond bayonet range. Given that drawback we got our best results from #4 buck by aiming about collar-bone high on the target. Regardless of whether you struck a bit low, a bit high, or dead-on, you were hitting softer tissue and/or areas where major blood vessels were closer to the surface and clothing was often lighter. Worked better that way.

00-buckshot is much more forgiving of the imprecise targeting that happens when you're shooting under stress, plus it drives deeper. The low-recoil 00-buck pellets tend to not over penetrate if you're targeting an adult...or so far that's how it's been.

Just a thought...

 

[JeepDriver]

I like the Remington Reduced Recoil 00 Buck.

I tried it out of my 18.5" Mossberg with good results. At 18ft (the distance from my front door to the wall I'd be behind) there was pretty much one hole in the B27 target. The wad had seperated and punched another hole in the paper at the shoulder

I tried it out to 40 ft and all 9 pellets were still on target.

 

[Mike Irwin]

"A 3" mag with 4 buck holds 47 6mm pellets."

Que?

Remington and Winchester No. 4 buck shells, 2 3/4" length, have 24 to 27 pellets.

How do you fit an extra 20 pellets in a shell that's 1/4" longer?

 

[Mike Irwin]

Snowman,

Luckily, penetration at range is, or should be, much less of an issue for the home defense shotgun user.

The longest conceivable shot I'd take with my shotgun in my house would be about 12 yards.

 

[OrvilleYertleson]

"A 3" mag with 4 buck holds 47 6mm pellets."

Que?

Remington and Winchester No. 4 buck shells, 2 3/4" length, have 24 to 27 pellets.

How do you fit an extra 20 pellets in a shell that's 1/4" longer?

I don't really know, but I am looking at a box of 12 Ga. 3" Winchester Supreme Double X Magnum copperplated lead buckshot loads. They are number 4 buck, and it says right on the box: 4 Buck (41 Pellets).

I suppose this is probably because shotguns chambered for 3" shells are built to withstand the higher pressures necessary to push the extra pellets out of the barrel at a reasonable velocity. They probably just used a smaller wad to make more room.

Personally, I have been trying to find some good #1 buckshot rounds in both 2 2/4" and 3", but no luck yet (I don't want to order any if I can help it).

For me, I feel that #1 or #2 would be about right. I am looking for a round that can be used inside/outside and I am nervous about the penetration of OO buck, and, like HerbG, I don't like the sparseness of a OO pattern at longer ranges. On the other hand, #4 buck, and anything smaller just seems too small to me. I know it is mostly psychological, but since the main purpose of my self defense weapon is peace of mind, I want something in between.

In a perfect world, I would be able to buy tactical loads with #1 buck.

 

[Youngster]

I tested some 4 buck a little while back and found it even worse than I expected when it came to penetration, those little pellets just bounced off many of my test targets outright and often failed to exit empty plastic milk jugs sitting less than 20 yards away.

I came away thinking of 4 buck in terms of being more like big birdshot than small buckshot, it might be fine when ranges are short or when you want to minimize the chance of overpenetration but it's not something I'd be confident with.

Make mine 000 or plated 00 in 2 3/4.

 

[clubsoda22]

changed my mind, did some reading and decided on 00 after taking some measurements and realizing that in a SD scenario in the home, over penetration was a moot point, the house has 18" stone walls. Also, no hallways end with a bedroom.

 

[Mike Irwin]

"I don't really know, but I am looking at a box of 12 Ga. 3" Winchester Supreme Double X Magnum copperplated lead buckshot loads. They are number 4 buck, and it says right on the box: 4 Buck (41 Pellets)."

Greg,

Do those shells have a folded crimp or a roll crimp?

If a roll crimp I can see how they could get the extra pellets in there.

As for the pressure I don't really think that's much of an issue in a modern gun as you can get 1.5 ounce slugs for 2 3/4" shells.

 

[Ringer]

OK MIke, you got me curious. What is the difference between a folded crimp and a roll crimp?

Here is a pick of 41 pellet #4 Buck if that helps.