What Would You Do w/ 30-30 Like This

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DMW1116

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I’m inching closer to a good cheap cast load with my 336. I tried the “Miniature” load today I found on Marlin Owners forum, or very close to it: 5.5 grains W231 and in my case an Acme 135 grain RNFP. Velocity isn’t important really as these are just practice loads. They need only make it through 3 layers of cardboard at most. The main requirement is they be accurate enough out to 100 yards that they’re interesting to shoot and I’m actually practicing instead of guessing.

The issue is the sights I’m using do not have enough adjustment range to accommodate the cast loads and the full power loads I have. With the sights at the maximum elevation the cast loads are still about 6 to 8 inches below point of aim at 50 yards. The way I see it I have some options.

First I could put a scope or other optic on the rifle. The ones I’ve seen surely have enough range to handle the difference.

Second I could get a different sight set. I’m currently running a Ranger Point rear sight and a Skinner front Patridge sight. I’ve filed the front sight down as much as I dare. My calculations show I’d need to remove another 0.065” to raise the impact point enough to zero at 50 yards. There wouldn’t be much post left at that point. I was thinking some sort of tang sight or a Williams receiver sight with more vertical range. I have not tried the factory sights and that could well be the answer, though I shoot much better with aperture sights than the semi-buckhorn factory sights.

Third I could use faster cast loads and use gas checks and such. I know there is a limit to how fast I can push powder coated bullets. Can a plated bullet be pushed faster than a powder coated one? The Acme and equivalent bullets are cheap and readily available. Using a more complicated load increases the cost.

The last option might be to just pick one and go with it. Choose jacketed hunting loads and the RPP sights are great. Choose just cast target loads and I can make that work too probably. What it looks like I can’t do is both.
 
I run 165 grain coated cast in my 30/30. I think 10 grains of red dot or green dot. Been awhile since i loaded some. They hit close to the same POI as factory Remington hunting ammo.
 
I have the opposite problem in my 357 leaver. I need a taller front globe because even with my Williams sights on the receiver, I'm still way high. I'm debating a new globe or red dot. I have zero desire to do a scope.
 
I run 165 grain coated cast in my 30/30. I think 10 grains of red dot or green dot. Been awhile since i loaded some. They hit close to the same POI as factory Remington hunting ammo.

Do you use gas checks on them? Any idea how fast they’re going? I’m guessing the ones I tried today are in the 1100 fps range but I don’t know. I’m getting ready to clean the rifle and see if there was any leading.
 
I have the opposite problem in my 357 leaver. I need a taller front globe because even with my Williams sights on the receiver, I'm still way high. I'm debating a new globe or red dot. I have zero desire to do a scope.

I’d prefer to avoid a scope if possible but a good 1-4x20 would probably be the easiest solution. I have that problem in my Henry 22. It shot 4” high at 50 yards with the factory sights as low as they would go.
 
If you're not totally opposed to a scope, a 1-4x20 will really benefit your shooting. Same as CoalCrackerAl said, I have used a 165gr coated rnfp, only with 9.0gr Unique. Worked rather well out to 80-100 yards. Haven't tried any 135's. Might be a Spring project.
 
I would up the velocity until you get the trajectory you want. A lighter bullet, or different powder for higher velocity but still within the pressures you want.

I am working on similar myself right now. I’m looking for 50 yard plinking loads with 4227 and the lee 309-150-f, and 25/50 yard loads with bullseye and the lee 311-93-1r. I’m I no the beginning of working it out stages but I have stalled because of other loading obligations; keeping the 44 special happy.
 
I feel like I should try the larger sized 0.311 bullets for Marlin rifles. I might get highs velocity and no leading. These Acmes are just what I happen to have and they’re cheaper than anything else I’ve seen so I’m trying to make them work.
 
You could try the Marbles improved tang sight. The company makes 3 different height posts that can be changed with a small allen wrench. You could use one of the taller posts for long distance and a shorter one for closer in targets.
 
I have a load using about half the normal charge of H335 with these bullets that shows promise but I haven’t shot enough at 50 yards to tell how accurate they are.

I’m in the process of giving the barrel a white glove cleaning as I am still seeing signs of leading but don’t know if it’s from the initial tries with 2400 when leading was quite severe or if it’s new.
 
The issue is the sights I’m using do not have enough adjustment range to accommodate the cast loads and the full power loads I have. With the sights at the maximum elevation the cast loads are still about 6 to 8 inches below point of aim at 50 yards. The way I see it I have some options.

Cheapest way out would be to mount an "aiming target" 6-8" above a "scoring target" and have at it since these are only practice loads anyway. Or determine POI of your practice rounds using your jacketed load sight setting and mount your "scoring target" that far below the aiming black. That way you don't have to even change the sights on the rifle.

Regards,
hps
 
Cheapest way out would be to mount an "aiming target" 6-8" above a "scoring target" and have at it since these are only practice loads anyway. Or determine POI of your practice rounds using your jacketed load sight setting and mount your "scoring target" that far below the aiming black. That way you don't have to even change the sights on the rifle.

Regards,
hps

That’s not a bad plan. That’s basically what I’ve been doing for load testing.
 
So I finished cleaning for tonight. There are no more lead flecks on the patch now, but if I run a bronze brush down the barrel a couple of times and follow with a patch with Hoppes 9 it will still bring out some black/gray stuff. I plan to keep cleaning and also load up a test array of these bullets with 5.1 to 5.9 grains to see if I can tighten up the group, which is pretty good at 2.1” at 50 yards. Not great but better than the 4” at 50 I was getting from the 2400 load. I hope the W231 load tightens up as that’s the least expensive option. I also hope the leading was left over and not from the handful of shots I fired today.

This load drops about 8” from POA @ 50 yards. That will be about 18” @100? Maybe more? This is all a little frustrating but it’s more fun to shoot these than the full power LEVERevolution loads with 150 and 160 grain bullets.
 
Many folks are shooting cast and coated to 2000 FPS in an AR, so I’d expect you should have no problems in the 30-30. Most plated is good for ~12-1400 FPS and the heavy plate a bit faster. I’d probably gas check going 1500+ just in case, although it may not be necessary.
 
How are they doing that? Will they cycle?

I’ll see how the test arrays go next weekend. In the mean time I think I’ll research 1-4 scopes.
 
http://www.peabodyrifle.com/home.html
This sight set up is amazing. I load lots of cast 30 WCF and have used this for years. Not reall to much problem with leading if your alloy and hard lube is doing its job. I dont cast 130 gr but usually run 150 RCBS flat nose gas checks ~2350 or so. I use this sight on a marlin that i do use speer 130 flat nose running 2750 ans have plenty of adjustment between the loads.
 
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