Where to Live: NH/VT/ME

[nextjoe]

Hi all,

My girlfriend and I are in the process of deciding where to live. We're considering Vermont, New Hampshire, and Maine. I'll have a degree in Economics with minors in Management and Psychology and she's an EMT, soon to be a paramedic.

All three states have better gun laws than Michigan (where I live) and New York (where she lives). Vermont has the benefit of no-permit-required CCW, but that also means no reciprocity in other states (as I understand it).

Can any THR members offer advice/opinions? Which state or states are best in terms of shooting ranges and hunting opportunities?

Also, not directly gun-related, but I'm concerned about taxes. Vermont and Maine have relatively high income taxes, while New Hampshire apparently has no sales or income taxes at all. Does that mean high property taxes instead?

Thanks in advance for any and all advice.

Best,
Joe

 

[Devonai]

New Hampshire will get you on property tax if you own a home. I moved from Massachusetts where rent is outrageous and I think rent in NH is a bargain, so you might find renting to be a viable compromise.

IIRC, property tax in NH is $40 for every $1000 worth of property value. This tax is collected once a year. This is no small chunk of change if your home is work $100k or more.

New Hampshire also has a meal tax of 3%. This is the only tax in NH that effects me personally, so I have little to complain about.

As far as firearms go, all three states are excellent. Gun clubs are numerous, in NH it seems every other town has one. NH may have an edge on the other two as your CCW is recognized by so many other states. This is indeed an advantage over VT as you rightly speculate.

I can't comment on hunting as I don't participate, but from my casual observation it seems there are infinite possibilities in all three states.

 

[DigitalWarrior]

I am going to NH. The free State Project is the only reason that I choose that state. www.freestateproject.org

 

[fivepaknh]

Devoni
The meal tax is 8%, not 3%. Mass has us beat here. Theirs is 5%.

The property tax rate varies from town to town. I only saw about 5 towns in the whole state that had a rate $40 per $1000 or higher. The property tax rate for many cities and towns in NH are much lower. In Nashua, where I live, the 2003 tax rate was $24.37 per $1000. The reputation NH has for high property tax is greatly exaggerated.
http://www.state.nh.us/revenue/property_tax/2003/2003_tax_rates.htm

 

[Devonai]

Oops, you're right. Thank you for correcting me.

http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/V/78-A/78-A-6.htm

 

[fivepaknh]

No problem. You’re not the only one who thought that. I say someone else recently mention the $40 per $1000 rate.

I think NH has more relaxed gun laws than both ME and VT. VT has more restrictions on where you can carry and no reciprocity with other states.
ME has a slightly tougher requirement for obtaining a permit. ME requires proof of firearms safety training, NH does not. ME permits are more expensive than NH. ME also has more restrictions on where you can carry. NH has reciprocity with more states than ME.

 

[Devonai]

To be precise, Vermont restricts carry on school grounds, "state institutions" and courthouses, while New Hampshire only restricts carry into courthouses. However, the law explicitly allows for checking a firearm before entering a New Hampshire courthouse, while Vermont law is silent on the issue.

It would be interesting to hear from a Vermont resident who has been to court; perhaps they do check firearms as a courtesy anyway.

 

[Khornet]

Greetings from Wolfeboro

a lovely old town on Lake Winnipesaukee.

When I was getting out of the Navy and wanted to return to New England, I thought it over and concluded:

Connecticut: top-notch fly fishing, high taxes, intrusive laws, no gun freedom to speak of, expensive, socialistic government. Out.

Maine: excellent fly-fishing, high taxes, socialistic gov't, great hunting, fair gun freedom. Out.

VT: good gun freedom, socialistic govt., high taxes, taken over by wealthy yuppie immigrants and organic/green/save the planet poseurs. Beautiful state, ugly under the skin. Out.

Mass.: my birthplace. Terrible on all aspects of taxes, freedom, cost, govt, hunting. OK on fishing. Out of the question.

NH: mind-your-own-business mindset, great on gun freedom, low taxes except for property which in some places can be onerous, not socialistic, not as pretty as VT for the most part but lovely under the skin. The southern portion, below Concord, being taken over by refugees from the People's Republic Of Mass. who then want it to be a nice cushy welfare state anyway, so the political landscape is changing. Also, it's zero degrees here now and falling. NH is looked down on by its neighbors for lacking all the thing which make them undesirable. Now it's home.

There is only one state in New England to bother with, friend. Come on up, but stay well north of the Mass. line.

 

[Willard]

New Hampshire, for all the reasons stated above. I have lived there, and I have friends in Vermont, NH is better for all the mentioned reasons. Plus, if you need to, you can commute to Mass.

 

[RTFM]

DigitalWarrior, please don't think I'm attacking you, but COME ON, don't you think that the free state project is just a little wacky?

Roust up 20,000 people and take over New Hampshire.

It just makes me laugh to my self every time I think about it.

Good luck to them, but it will be just like when Mass-holes (Massachusetts residents) migrate north, they may live in New Hampshire now, but they will NEVER be FROM New Hampshire, and will always be treated as an ugly step child.

Even if they take over how much sway will they really have?
New Hampshire does not have the state clout as CA, or TX, or NY.
So there all in N.H. they willl only a very small representation in Congress and the Senate. The other states will not give a DARN about what the flat landers are crying about.

Any way, nextjoe, I did not mean to hijack your thread, I use to live in New Hampshire, even born there, but now that "they" are moving in, check out there web site to see what you possible new state may be like, some day.

RTFM

 

[Devonai]

Actually, I do commute to Mass and I'm starting to feel really stupid for paying Mass state income tax. Oh well, at least I have a great job.

I don't mind refugees from Mass, like myself, but I do worry about the ones who want to make NH into Mass Jr.

 

[RCL]

You may want to consider Pennsylvania also.

It's a shall issue state.
Hunting opportunities abound.
Same with fishing.
Lots of gun clubs/ shooting ranges.
Elk!
Very Scenic.

However, I'm not sure about the taxes.

 

[RTFM]

but I do worry about the ones who want to make NH into Mass Jr.

And that is exactley what it will turn out to be when they all get there.
"Well in PA We use to do it this way."

"No, no, no. In Texas We use to do it this way. Which is far better than YOUR WAY"

"Texas Ha! Kali does it the best for the people so we need to do it this way"

And so it will begin in New Hampshire.

I'll apologize now if I have offended anyone, and I know I should not get in to this type of discussion. I'll refrain from further comment here.

RTFM

 

[Coot]

In our town, we're paying somewhere around $0.25 per thousand for school/town taxes, $0.06 sales tax, and under $50.00 motor vehicle registration (NH kills you with user-taxes, such as vehicle registration).

Hunting/fishing opportunities are plentiful, but with few exceptions, larger deer can be found in Maine.

For your wife, there are probably more limited opportunities for EMT-P employment than in NH: except for a few of the cities, most EMT services are not at the paramedic level (you may wish to call our State EMS # (802) 863-7310 for more info).

Bringing a firearm into the Courthouse is not well-received: at the least, you will be asked to leave it in you car. It's fine pretty much everywhere else, excepting schools and state/ federal office buildings.

Good luck!

 

[LynnMassGuy]

Mass-holes (Massachusetts residents)

?????????????
That is just uncalled for.
Massachusetts, like any state with a large city (Boston and suburbs.) has it's vote hi-jacked by the city liberals and the government-dependant votes they rely on. I think you would find that most people who migrate from MA are not going try to turn your precious little states into the same socialist mess that MA is. Quite the contrary.

they may live in New Hampshire now, but they will NEVER be FROM New Hampshire, and will always be treated as an ugly step child.

Not necessarily, I'm sure incest and lack of hygiene are traits that can be learned.

 

[megatronrules]

Hi nextjoe I'am from newengland originaly Rhode Island born and raised and yes I know that state sucks for alot of things gun laws included. That being said me and my family were concidering a move to NH. and we settled on Florida due in part for the cost of living and the weather my mother is in her 60's and simply did not want to do winters anymore.,infact i'am only 25 and diddn't want either. All that being said FL. ain't the best state for jobs but I think out of the three you mention NH. would be the best as I've been to all the new england states except maine and can't comment of that from experiance.

If I had to do it all over again I might have moved to NH. yes I don't like winter anymore after living in FL. but I think going form RI. to NH. obviously woulden't have mattered in the weather dept. With that said I woulden't sell my home in FL. and move to NH. If someday I can afford to I would get a small vacation house the for the spring/fall to me you can't be the fall in new england perfect time of year to live there hope this helps you out man and good luck and let us know what you decide.

P.S. Hey lynnmassguy you wanna talk about ugly stepchilds? I'am originaly from providence,RI. I have to say it does make me feel funny at times lol especialy when I was in NH. once and this cop walks over to my car after seeig my license plates and says "hey kid thats a corrupt state you come from" aern't they all?

 

[Moondancer]

Do You Need to be in New England?

Nextjoe,

Do you have some particular reason to want to move East? I know it's beautiful out there, as my two best vacations have been to Maine, but is there some legitimate overriding reason for it?

I'm a former Michigander myself, born and raised and lived there for the first 45years of my life. Now I'm in Indiana and other than people calling me a "Hoosier", I don't know why I'd go back north.

I'm in Granger, and live less than one mile from the Michigan line. My parents are in South Central Michigan about an hour's drive away. I've got family land I can hunt on (if I'm willing to pay the out-of-state license fees I can even do it legally ).

Gun laws are great here in Indiana. Shall issue, four year "License to Carry Handgun". You can carry LOTS of places in Indiana you can't in Michigan. (I know, I've researched this a lot as I lived in Indiana but worked in Detroit for sixteen months. Commuted up on Monday mornings and home on Friday afternoons.) Carried most of the time in Detroit, but WAY more restrictions that back in Indiana. Taxes? Well, not that different than Michigan anymore.

Worth a thought if you're open to anything!

 

[Khornet]

Devonai et. al.,

I don't care where you're from. I'm an ex-Massh**e myself. All are welcome to come to NH for the sake of living in NH. None are welcome who come to find a lower-tax version of Mass. The two concepts are incompatible.

Alas, it's all going to change as the southern towns fill up with folks who vote for bigger govt and more laws and handouts. They outnumber the rest of us. But maybe it won't happen in my lifetime.

 

[Balog]

I'm rather curious as to how you picked those three states myself. Why not some place out west or Alaska?

 

[nextjoe]

Thanks everyone for the great replies so far. Keep 'em coming!

We're looking at those particular states right now for a few reasons. My girlfriend, for various reasons, wants/needs to be within a day's drive of her family in Manhattan. VT, NH, and ME seem to be a 5 or 6 hour drive from NYC. She's an avid snowboarder, so we want to be close to some mountains and in a state with a long winter.

Upstate New York is nice, but it's politically unacceptable for me. Pennsylvania may be an option.

Basically, we want: good gun laws, small and unintrusive state government, good snowboarding, low taxes, low cost of living, reasonable proximity to NYC, and good employment prospects. Or at least the best possible combination of those factors.

Any and all ideas or suggestions are much appreciated.

Joe

 

[Blain]

I plan to move to NH due to the state's laws and the freestateproject plan. The only bad thing about NH is that there are not many good jobs there.

 

[warrior23]

Does anyone have any good realtors web sites for NH,I'm looking for some land up north to build on down the road.thnxs

 

[clubsoda22]

Vermont has the benefit of no-permit-required CCW, but that also means no reciprocity in other states (as I understand it).

True, but you can get a NH CCW for $10 and they give it to any VT resident with a letter of good character.

You may want to consider Pennsylvania also.

It's a shall issue state.
Hunting opportunities abound.
Same with fishing.
Lots of gun clubs/ shooting ranges.
Elk!
Very Scenic.

However, I'm not sure about the taxes.

There's a statement i can agree with! Taxes are quite reasonable unless you live in the city of philadelphia and property taxes are collected by the township, not the state. Anywhere that has high property taxes usually has an amazing public shool district attached to it and the property values that go with it. My public high school averaged 99% of students going to college and an average SAT score of over 1200. Important if you're gonna be having kids. Good places to live for you guys would probably be somewhere in SE PA in montgomery/delaware/chester county as your line of work will probably bring you the best oppertunities if you're near the city.

-Shall issue permits: 5 years for $19.
-Class 3 if you want it, both MG's and supressors.
-Tons of hunting in between philly and pittsburgh. Second biggest hunting state in the nation.
-Tons of fishing.
-Plenty of places to shoot. (Not to mention a surplus of THR members to go shooting with)
-Beautiful state.
-We rank #1 in the nation for retention (it's addictive): People who are born and live here usually stay here.
-It's also a bit warmer than the new england area.

As for work oppertunities for you and the wife:
-Coming from an EMT in the area, i can tell you that everyone is hiring medics.
-You don't have to live in a urban area to be a short commute from the city.

 

[BlkHawk73]

I've lived in Maine all my life so I guess I'm biased on this question . NH is nice also. I think thier would be more job opps. here in ME but that's something that should be looked at ahead of time anyways. I obtained my permit quite easily and cheaply ($40 for 5 yrs). A course is required, but isn't it a good idea anyways? As far as what legal for firearms here. If it's alowed federally, it's ok here too. (more than I can say for MA, CT, NY and others. There is other staes that recognize Me's permits but I'm not totally sure which ones. Not a large number of gun clubs , but enough so that there'll be one nearby wherever you live. Gun shows are fairly frequent also with a couple in NH every year also. A few nice ones too. A large portion of the state is accessable for hunting.

That is just uncalled for.
Massachusetts, like any state with a large city (Boston and suburbs.) has it's vote hi-jacked by the city liberals and the government-dependant votes they rely on. I think you would find that most people who migrate from MA are not going try to turn your precious little states into the same socialist mess that MA is. Quite the contrary.

Think again! I see 'em every summer on vacation at the beaches, every fall "leap peeping" and every winter at the ski slopes. The term "m???????" is usually quite fitting. :banghead: The ones that move up here from MA have thier noses up so high they have a hard time driving.



If mass is so great how come everyone there comes here to vacation?

 

[Jonesy9]

3 great states. based on your criteria I'd say NH would be a good match. I love Maine the most but I'm an ocean guy and couldn't live far from it or the fish. Maines taxes are worse than Mass these days, gonna get worse once their experiment with socialized health care explodes.


If memory serves are 3 are about the same in being Class III friendly too.

You will pay taxes in some way shape or form no matter what. The quality of your services doesn't always correspond to the tax rate either. With all the similiarities between the states I would recomend investigating actual communities instead of states. Many great communities in southern NH that can still allow you to pursue any career aspirations you may have in MA. Not that there aren't jobs in the northern states though (and even more opps for some one with an entreprenuerial bent).


I'm a proud M-a-s-shole and high roaders tend to forget that gun rights do not rule everyones lives. I could never move from my friends and family and the best striper fishing grounds on the east coast over gun laws, liberal pols or taxes. My quality of life far outweighs the small flaws of the greatest state. : )