Which AR round for whitetail deer?

[essayons21]

Mods I apologize if this should be in hunting, but I figured the questions I am asking fit better here.


I am looking for a new upper so I can take my EBR hunting next winter. .223/5.56 is illegal for deer in my area (VA), so I am exploring caliber choices.

My criteria:

-Needs to be accurate and effective on eastern whitetail out to 250yards.
-Compatible with standard AR-lower without modification
-Ammunition availability would be nice, but component/die availability is more important, as I reload almost everything I shoot.
-Preferably feed from 5-10 round AR magazines

I've narrowed it down to 6.5 Grendel, 6.8 SPC, and .458 SOCOM, with 6.8 SPC in the lead. I've read that the first 5-7 rounds of 6.8 will feed from a standard USGI 30-round magazine, I am assuming it would feed from a 5-rounder. Anybody know if this is true? I also like the wider variety of .270 caliber hunting bullets I can load for the 6.8. Also uppers and 6.8 parts generally seem to be less expensive.

Are there any pro's or con's I should know about these choices I listed for hunting? Or are there any other calibers I am forgetting that would suit my purposes?

Thanks in advance

 

[Erik M]

Is there a reason that you have not added 7.62x51 to your options?

 

[matrem]

-Needs to be accurate and effective on eastern whitetail out to 250yards.

Yikes!
6.5 or 6.8 may do what you're asking.

 

[essayons21]

Is there a reason that you have not added 7.62x51 to your options?

-Compatible with standard AR-lower without modification

-Needs to be accurate and effective on eastern whitetail out to 250yards.

Yikes!
6.5 or 6.8 may do what you're asking.

Realistically, the longest shot I would be taking would probably be under 150yards, but I'd like a little bit of wiggle room. From what I read of the .458 is that it stays pretty flat out to 150 and then starts dropping hard, but still keeps enough power for another hundred yards or so.

 

[browningguy]

I would go (am going actually) with the Grendel personally. I currently shoot a Beowulf but for me it is definately a 100 yard gun, maybe 150 on a really good day, it drops like a rock once it gets past 100 yards or so. Inside 100 yards I can say it hits deer and pigs like the Hammer of THor, they don't even twitch.

I'm also going to use the Grendel for 300 and 600 yard target shooting, and it seems to have just a bit better ballistics than the 6.8.

 

[matrem]

.30 Rem AR is another worthy of consideration.
Assuming Remington sells them in quantity?

 

[DWFan]

What about the .30 HRT (Herrett Rimless Tactical)? Uses .30 Herrett dies and reformed 6.8 brass. Another cartridge would be a .357 Herrett Rimless made from .32 Remington brass and should be quite effective loaded with the 180gr Hornady XTP.
Since you load your own, even a .375 SuperMag Rimless is possible.

 

[franconialocal]

How bout something in .243?? I'm not sure about compatibility, but it's a very popular caliber here in NH for deer. Very flat shooting...nice. No problem at the distance you are talking about.

 

[R.W.Dale]

-Needs to be accurate and effective on eastern whitetail out to 250yards.
-Compatible with standard AR-lower without modification
-Ammunition availability would be nice, but component/die availability is more important, as I reload almost everything I shoot.
-Preferably feed from 5-10 round AR magazines

of the criteria you outline there isn't anything these cartridges you list will do that 7.62x39 won't do for less money thus allowing you to practice much more.,

I will recommend that for 250yds you stick to 20" RIFLE uppers as contrary to internet wisdom the velocity and power increase is real and worth having

I also like the wider variety of .270 caliber hunting bullets I can load for the 6.8.

that wide variety ENDS with bullets 130grains and heavier, it's a bit of a myth that 270 and 6.8 use the same bullets. Kinda like saying 30-30 and 308win do too.

What about the .30 HRT (Herrett Rimless Tactical)? Uses .30 Herrett dies and reformed 6.8 brass.

This is what I use but let me tell ya brass forming is a very involving process with a high failure rate.

 

[OhioChief]

I think you mean .458 SOCOM or .50 Beowulf. Might as well toss in .450 Bushmaster too. Actually just the right load in your .223 would do a pretty good job, but I choose the .308.

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

6.8 spc or 6.8 grendel, yep.

 

[R.W.Dale]

Is there a reason that you have not added 7.62x51 to your options?

How bout something in .243?? I'm not sure about compatibility,

The OP mentions using his AR15 lower and magazines

NEITHER of these rounds even fit in an ar15's magwell

 

[essayons21]

Krochus you beat me to it,

I'm not too familiar with 7.62x39 conversions for ARs, do they work with a .223 lower? Special magazines I'm assuming? How is accuracy? It is an appealing option seeing as I already have quite a bit of 7.62x39 for plinking as well as reloading equipment and components.

 

[R.W.Dale]

with a 7.62x39 Ive had OK luck only using 5 rds in a 20rd 5.56 mag. That failing just buy a c products 10 rounder.

How is accuracy?

Accuracy is a direct function of the ammunition quality your feeding the gun. With cheap steel cased fodder expect 2 to 3 MOA. With a quality hunting handload it's accuracy potential is as good as anything else

do they work with a .223 lower?

YES
If they didn't we wouldn't consider x39 to be an ar15 compatible cartridge

I already have quite a bit of 7.62x39 for plinking as well as reloading equipment and components.
__________________

IMO this is a big +7.62x39mm

Expect to have $100 EASY tied up in reloading dies, and components for any of these rounds, MORE in the case of the AA offerings. This ASSUMES you can find a meaningful qty of brass in stock to even start load development

the last 6.8 cases I bought set me back $33 for 50! and let me tell ya 50 ain't enough

 

[tango2echo]

7.62X39 for the win, Alex.

 

[BushyGuy]

69gr BTHP would do the job in .223 rem , if they can bust thru a 1/4 inch piece of steel, they wont have no problem bringing a deer down at 200 yards.

 

[R.W.Dale]

69gr BTHP would do the job in .223 rem , if they can bust thru a 1/4 inch piece of steel, they wont have no problem bringing a deer down at 200 yards.

This is wrong on so many different levels I'm not sure where to begin.

A 69BTHP is a MATCH bullet PERIOD- the manufacturers of these projectiles designed them with accuracy in mine with NO consideration to terminal performance whatsoever. Making real world results unpredictable at best

1/4" mild steel is NOT a deer. Penetration on mild steel is a direct function of VELOCITY and velocity only. Bullet construction doesn't matter in the slightest. At the same impact speeds a 55g TBBC will penetrate no more steel than a 55 v-max. But in flesh former will vastly out penetrate the latter

Of course the above from the guy who posted this about using 7.62x39 at this range

BushyGuy

u must have sprayed and prayed cuz no way an 7.62x39mm has that much power to kill a deer out close to 300 yards....i figured you had ot aim like 2 feet above the deer i call it a lucky shot i wonder if a .223 rem can do the job also cuz they have better distance then a 7.62x39mm..

 

[trigga]

the 6.8 and 6.5 are very promising, if you can find ammo locally or reload. i've used .223 55gr hornady tap on a deer at 25 yards on the last day of deer hunting, it's a home defense round i believe that uses the vmax bullet. i was surprise it penetrated all the way through. the shot was placed on the chest but somehow one front leg broke clean off the bone. wish i had it on camera but maybe next year. the heart was like jello in the aftermath.

honestly, at least here in wi that i've experienced, most cases the deer you see is within 100 yards and the ones you actually get a clear shot are within 50 yards or less. the only time you're gonna see a 200 yd+ deer is in the open which is rare. the 7.62x39 is a perfect 100 yd gun that i've seen taken many deers. next year i plan to take one with mines.

 

[-v-]

BIG +1 on a 7.62x39 upper for your AR. The 7.62x39 will do everything you ask. krochus has demonstrated this with his prior experience with the exact same set-up. Roll your own for hunting and any deer inside a 300 yard envelope can be taken with that round. Also, cheap practice with full power ammunition is another concern to consider.

 

[R.W.Dale]

I would like to elaborate a bit if I may

I'm not saying there's anything WRONG with the other rounds. But for the OP if you have ammo for and already handload for the x39 and impose a 250yd limit there's simply no reason to choose one of the other cartridges unless you just want something different.....not that there's anything wrong with that.

Heck I even got away from 7.62x39 for no other reason than I got a GREAT deal on a White Oak Precision .30HRT upper that shoots like a darn heavy barreled varmint gun

 

[Zerodefect]

I'm going to vote 6.8spc. 6.5 is better, but more expensive and rarer.

Every 7.62x39 gun I've shot needed alot of adjustment for range in the scope or a ton of holdover compared to faster rounds. Just feels like a short range blaster round. <150yards.

 

[redneck2]

We have some goofy rifle laws for deer hunting here in Indiana (don't ask). You have to use a round that is .350" or greater and has a case length of 1.16 to 1.685.

Anyway, some guys have come up with a .35 IDC (Indiana deer cartridge). Uses a very slightly trimmed .25 WSSM necked out to .35. Two guys that I know of originally put it in a turn bolt, but it feeds thru a standard AR mag and lower.
http://ingunowners.com/forums/long_guns/46673-358_indiana_deer_cartridge.html


It's a true 300 yard round, something like 200 grains @ 2,600 fps IIRC. There's a guy that specifically makes uppers chambered in this round.

There is at least one die manufacturer that makes custom loading dies in this caliber.

 

[MetalHead]

Slightly off topic, yesterday I tried a C-Products Grendel 10 round mag with 7.62x39 Wolf and SilverBear shot in a DPMS 20 inch upper. As you might expect the rounds would not feed because the front of the mag didn't have enough up preasure, but at least the back end had enough room for the rounds to stack right. Unrelated I think as the very cold weather the bolt was undergassed. Will check for leaks and try McFarlane gas rings.
With the shorended ejector spring emptys went 7feet into the pickup bed in a pile the size of a bucket mostly.

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

That .35 IDC is interesting.

 

[Frankl03]

+1 on the 7.62x39, good round, plenty of punch for short to medium range.