Which of these three rifles for the "Ultimate Newb Inductor"?

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

Simplifying and going to sell some things, but trying to pick one rifle to keep whose main function in life is to put a great big smile on newbies' faces at the gun range, when I take newbs or old hats alike (and my own face as well). Something that is the most fun and pleasant to shoot - something that feels extremely EASY to make hits with at 100, 150, and 200 yards. So looking for fun, user-friendliness, lack of recoil, top accuracy. All three of my choices have already proven themselves to be very accurate. Whatever rifle I choose will have a nice 56mm user-friendly scope put on it, so we're considering rifle only:

1. Weatherby Vanguard, Sub-MOA version, 22" bbl, .223 Rem, medium-heavy type rifle.

2. Custom Mauser in .243 Win, with 26" Remington barrel and benchrest type stock - heavy-type gun.

3. Stag AR15 with Shaw 24" bull barrel in .204 Ruger


#1 is a good all-around choice, and perhaps the best goldilocks gun balancing all the factors.

#2 is heavier which will minimize recoil, but the round itself has a lot more recoil than the other two, so that part is probably a wash; the caliber will make it much easier to make no-brainer hits at 200 in high winds, with the heavier bullets, but then again, most noobs are gonna shoot at 100 or less, not 200, so does it really matter? We do have a lot of wind around there, though. Also, the 26" bbl may have less blast than the 22" .223 bbl above, so it may be the most pleasant. I guess I'm leaning toward this choice. One "problem" with this choice is that I'll have to keep my handloads for THIS .243 separate and distinct from my handloads for my OTHER .243s, as the twist rate and appropriate load for the job will be different, so it's a slight added complication that choosing one of the other two, whose ammo is easily distinguished from any hunting ammo for other rifles, solely by virtue of its cartridge.

#3 will have the least recoil and be super-fun, but could be a problem being semi-auto with real newbs who might shoot more than once accidentally, and it's harder to benchrest solidly, and ammo is more expensive (unless handloading).

Any other thoughts?

 

[NCsmitty]

I would choose: 1. Weatherby Vanguard, Sub-MOA version, 22" bbl, .223 Rem, medium-heavy type rifle.

Easy shooting, cheapest to shoot and a basic, accurate, fair quality rifle that a new shooter will feel confident using.
It still is a tough decision though.


NCsmitty

 

[General Geoff]

I vote for the AR, but in .223 instead of .204 Ruger.

#3 will have the least recoil and be super-fun, but could be a problem being semi-auto with real newbs who might shoot more than once accidentally, and it's harder to benchrest solidly, and ammo is more expensive (unless handloading).

Get a few 5-round magazines. This will make it much easier to use on a bench with sandbags or other supports. As for newbies who shoot more than once accidentally, that's solved by simply handing them a mag with only one round in it. And .223 would fix the ammo expense problem. The AR also has the "whiz-bang" evil black rifle factor, which for many newbies makes it super cool. I'm not saying a bolt action isn't fun, but given the choice between a bolt action and an AR-15, I'd bet a lot more than half of people who are new to shooting will want to shoot the AR, and it will hold their interest longer.

 

[Geno]

#1 It's hard to top a Weatherby, or the .223.

 

[rfurtkamp]

If you want to make the AR ultimate retard friendly, get a single round loading sled.

 

[hammerklavier]

Where do you want the "big smile" to come from? Ease of making accurate shots? Go with #1 or #2. Fun to shoot? Go with #3. A little thump from a bigger cartridge? Go with #2 (or a .260 or 7mm-08).

All three? You could get an ar-10 in .260 or .243

Put a bi-pod on an ar pattern rifle to aid on the bench (if your bench is long enough).

 

[blackops]

Custom Mauser in .243 Win, with 26" Remington barrel and benchrest type stock - heavy-type gun, from the choices given.

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

Any other thoughts?

 

[ArmedBear]

Not sure you need the Sub-MOA heavy barrel gun. My .30-06 Vanguard Sporter is very accurate, and attractive-looking, too. Less expensive than the version you're looking at, and easier to carry.

 

[MJR007]

What, a new kid or old "Kid"? Kids .22 and big "kids" .22.

200yrd newbie BAD.

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

Well, MJR, what I mean is, on the *second* trip to the range, after the first trip where I typically have noobs / kids shoot these 4 things:

1. A .22 rifle, iron sights or 1x scope (at 5-10 yards)
3. .22 handgun, iron sights, (at 5-10 yards; exception being, with young kids I like to limit to rifles only)
2. Another .22 rifle, scoped (at 25 yards)
4. .17 HMR rifle (if time; at 25 or 50 yards)


Or for semi-noobs who are ready to step up.

Now I'm leaning towards #3, the .204 ruger. Can't make up my mind! Something tells me I'm gonna end up keeping 2 or all 3 of these.

 

[MJR007]

Well Sir, with that said, #3.

You sound like a good man.

Michael

 

[Big Bill]

I wouldn't choose any one of the three. I would keep them all. Take all three out to the range and WOW them with all of your three sweet things!!!

 

[AKElroy]

Of these options, I would go with #1. I would lien towards #2 with a shorter barrel; 26" for a .243 is a little more than necessary and counter productive IMO. If the 26" length is non-negotiable, I would want it in 25-06 or .264 win mag.; both would put the extra length to good use.

 

[AKElroy]

I just re-read your post, Doc. Disregard my last post; I did not get that you already own these three. If hunting anything is going to be part of the justification, then I would definately keep the .243.

 

[Maverick223]

I would keep the Mauser because it is a nicer rifle (at least in my mind), than the Weatherby and is a bolt action, which is very useful for the new shooters. I would not keep the AR, unless you wanted to swap the bbl for a .223 (the .204Ruger is not one to keep around if you are looking to simplify your cartridge/caliber selection IMO).

 

[litman252]

I'd keep #2, I'm guessing it has the least resale and is worth more than you will get from it. You could easily sell the other 2 for a good amount of $$. Most nice mausers seem to be worth much less than they should be to me.....

To each there own, but why sell for less???????

Tony

 

[taliv]

if you want to put smiles on faces:

1. something with a happy switch
2. something in 22lr with a suppressor
3. a barrett 50

satisfaction guaranteed

 

[Dr.Rob]

#1, can't see a reason to do otherwise.

 

[dispatch55126]

Age, maturity and final intent all factor in. If this is someone in their teens though their 20's, the "coolness" factor makes the AR win out. If this is someone older or younger, I'd go with a scoped bolt action. The final intent for both being you want to get other into shooting.

A young kid wants to prove him/herself to the adults around them. Have a scoped rifle gives the best chance to hit the 10 ring and show just how good of a shooter they can be. Someone older isn't trying to "prove" themselves to their peers, but their maturity allows them to challenge themselves with their accuracy.

While a teen/20-something who has never held a gun may have the maturity, intense action usually is the more immediate joy. Give them an AR that looks like a battle rifle, let them empty a mag and they'll have fun. Once hooked, the self-competition with accuracy becomes more of a challenge.

As for my kids, once they are mature enough, they'll learn to shoot. While they may have fun doing it, responsibility and concentration are the primary objectives.

 

[benzy2]

It really is a question on how you shoot and how you want to have the newer people shoot. Both the Weatherby and the AR could be shot off hand, from a bipod, or from a rest, though the AR may take a little more effort on a bench. The .204 should buck the wind well with the longer bullets but at 200 yards the real heavy .223 rounds will hold good enough. What twist is the .223? If it is 1:9'' or faster it should handle at least the upper 60's grain bullets which will hold the wind fairly well. I personally like the .204 option the best if you reload for it. Its a little expensive to let people learn and blast with and the AR certainly has a bit of the blast mentality be it a new shooter or experienced. The .243 is probably the rifle I have the most personal interest in but it is the most specific in that its a bench rifle. If the new shooter isn't into bench shooting they probably won't enjoy the .243 much. I know of the group I shoot with I am one of the few that has the most fun shooting from a bench. The rest like more reactive and quicker shooting. As such I wouldn't want to force them to only shoot from the bench if they came with me. I have a feeling a lot of other new shooters may not be 100% sold on the bench game so it would go first for me. From there it really depends on if you can reload your own ammo to get moderately priced .204. If that isn't an option I would go with the .223 just for the fact the new shooter can shoot longer on the same dime. I think trigger time is the biggest factor when starting out and if you get half to a third as many shots with the AR as you would the weatherby I would go towards the turn bolt. Even if the loads only shoot at 2 MOA using the cheapest 55gr fmj you can make at 100 yards you can turn a groundhog inside out and you can blow most fruit into salad. If the new shooters need to provide their own ammo its much easier to find .223 as well which needs to be a consideration.

 

[RonE]

Were it me, I would keep all three rifles. I would reserve the Custom Mauser .243 for new shooters. Because it is (as stated) heavy, it will probably have managable recoil. Some recoil is good for new shooters, not enough to hurt them but just enough to let them know that it is a "high powered" rifle. I like this gun also for the reason that when you take new people to the range, they are usually shooting from a bench so the weight won't be so much of a factor. If you are going to teach someone to shoot, perhaps rifle No 1 in .223 with iron sights would be more appropriate to teach them the various shooting positions. Whichever way you choose to go, it will be alright with the new shooters, they get to shoot something for free and have a competent person guide them through the process. Maybe throw in some reactive targets at the end of the session.