Who gives a rats royal behind? YOU? (Advertising RKBA ideas)

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Oleg quote:
I'll do it.
That's enough for me. How do we proceed? I think we need to go after the progun folks to swell our ranks before we take on the anti’s. A 3/20’s ad here and there with the right message is, I believe, the proper way to go. I defer, by contributing, to the decision of Oleg as to where, when and how these ads should be placed. We have the message, let’s get it out there.
Business Plan?

I think a proper way to go forward is to make a business plan or outline. State the goal of the amount to be collected, and what the goal is for spending it.

This way, we can delegate tasks, attach costs, get consensus on WHAT we're going to do, WHEN it'll be done, WHERE it'll happen, WHO will do what, etc.

THR oughta have some savvy business type people here to pony up a business plan.

I will contribute $100 when the business plan outline shows up.

I realized three years ago when I became a "second amendment cyber advocate" that my emotions are like a roller coaster, and when I'm fired up I write my best and send the most letters. But after a while I get discouraged about lack of perceived headway, until I get hot again.

So I'm willing to work on a proposal/business plan if someone could provide more details on the goals of this little fundraising action...

Feel free to PM me...
A Task Force or yet another pro gun group?

First of all I agree that the RKBA message does not get out.

A few short commercials in prime time using some of Lott's statistics (more kids die in 5 gallon buckets than from handguns, that kind of stuff) would go a LONG way.

Don't think I have ever seen a pro gun infomercial or commercial. So the idea of advertising has merit.

So does the idea of organizing purpose, goal, mission scope etc.

Not sure if a business plan is appropriate or some project/organization charter. Which raises other questions that are not completely straightforward either.

Is THR incorporated? Is a 503c filing appropriate?

Does it make sense to do something like this under a THR banner? What exposure does this leave for THR and it's organization?

Bottom line: You need a lawyer and an accountant.

But if you first start with why do this, aren't you essentially going to work your way around to starting just another pro-2a org and aren't there enough already?

Would it be a better idea to encourage the NRA or some other group to set up a special fund that goes straight to advertising?
let's leave Oleg alone

to sort out the graphics, et.al.

My idea of the target audience is

first, the hunters--SCUBA Ted's 30-30 quotes, etc. Maybe that's national advertising in a magazine--but a *.PDF (or whatever) poster has to go to ALL internet site for hunters, etc.

second, gunshop visitors--a well-done counter setup at the gunshops that can also be printed out by us and distributed to local hunting groups personally can come out of the same product.

third, a more general public--but I have a hunch that this depends on how Oleg does it--the 'general' product might also be effective in AWB sunset material.

So, right now, let's let Oleg work with the concept and see just what he comes up with.

DOES ANYBODY KNOW HOW THIS FITS IN WITH THE CAMPAIGN FINANCE LAWS? I don't follow that stuff.... That may have an impact on what business structure, if any, we want to set up.

one more thought--$10K won't go far these days; a $100K might have some lasting impact--and I think the hunting angle on that (most ninnies have their own idea of what a hunter is, at least; not many know what gunnies are) is the one that gains the most traction...

finally, for now--I see this as a task force, to obtain a specific objective: increasing hunter's awareness of AWB/AP/political issues.

IDEA #2: Does anyone have a trophy shot of deer hunter with his AK-47 / 7.62x39 gun??
Don't reinvent the wheel.

The grassroots thing is very powerful here, but there very well could be resources who have put radio, tv, film adds together already. I know the JPFO offered some subsidisation of billboards and radio adds a couple years ago. I have talked to Aaron Zelman on the phone, and he is a very nice gentleman who is focused on RKBA. The comics by JPFO are cheap, and very pointed. A bit hokey, but that helps put people off their guard. Perhaps using this resource and others in our respective states we could best manage our time and money.

I like the idea of handouts for hunters/trap shooters, etc. They're not the choir they should be. Too many of them wouldn't be too upset to trade in their shotguns for golf clubs.

I think its the general public who need to be reminded that the 2A comes before the rest, etc.

For hunting pictures of military style SLR, probably the individual rifle model's enthusiasts boards (if they exist) would be the place to ask....
I like the idea. I will be doing a flyer for my senators to be displayed in a local gunshop, and will make it available for the AR members too. If I do it right, I may be able to make it modular, so that I can just add a pic of your anti-senator and a few quotes, so that you can do it too.

I would love to do one for err, ahh, Teadday Kenneday, err, ahh, but I would never be able to top Oleg's work.:)
Great ideas.

You can make an impact without spending any money as well.

If you frequent other internet forums, put www.thehighroad.org in your sig line.

Put it in your sig line when you send emails; especially when emailing your local politicians. Let them come here and see the REAL gun culture.

Every time I talk to somebody at the range or gunshop, I somehow work THR into the conversation and I usually end up writing it on the back of my business card for them. If it's ok with Oleg, ask your local gunshops and ranges if you can post a small flier or leave a few on the counter for people to take. Maybe Oleg can design something that we can all download and make copies ourselves.
I know these things sound grassroot, but they're FREE (ok, so paper costs a bit if you don't have access to a copier at work!), it's easy, and it's effective.

I think our money would best be spent right now on attracting new members to the forum, not trying to convey a political statement. Let's face it, once you're here you're hooked:D

But I'm in for a few dollars....been sending a few checks to the local politicians who have been pro-gun....especially the ones that are fence sitters, so money is a bit tight right now.
Perhaps we should be looking at "I am the NRA" type of ad to be run in women's magazines? I think the females who frequent this board would make excellent candidates to be featured in the ads.

We shouldn't have to preach to the trapshooters and their ilk, but when was the last time the ATA publicly defended the RKBA?

I'm willing to offer some $-I've already put some of my money into putting Sen. Patty 'Osama Mama' Murray out of office. Whatever we can do to edumacate more gunowners-especially the deer hunting crowd-is a good thing.

Things to remember when doing things attempting to influene federal elections (and I mean lawfully influence-no buying votes or registering dead people.)
1. Only registered PACs, collecting regulated 'hard money' can buy TV/radio advertising within 60 days of an election. Do we really want to create a THR PAC?
2. Newspaper/magazine ads are not subject to the above restriction. Ads in hunting mags have already been mentioned. Also, I know SC sells ad space in their hunting & fishing Rules & Regulations pamphlet. Not sure if they'd take political type ads, but you can always try.
3. Direct mail is also allowed. How tough would it be to get names and addresses of every person issued hunting licenses in states where hunters can make a difference-PA, WI, IA come immediately to mind.
Your average American does not seem to have a favorable opinion of the NRA. This should be an independent initiative.

My response to this is, why?

I realize emotions often run high around the NRA and I'm not looking to promote or bash the NRA or any other pro gun group. Leave that out of this discussion.

My intent is to offer suggestions for the best means to an end.

We need to first figure out what "this" is; what gap are we looking to fill in existing RKBA group activities.

In reading this, my thought was the advertising perspective - i.e. I never see any. And I have a dish, so it's not just that its local NJ cable operators.

In any case decide what the purpose is and then you can evaluate whether or not there are existing vehicles to achieve the objective more readily.

You will find that it is a non-trivial excercise that takes time (and money) to establish a 503c or any other legal protective vehicle - and you need one to protect the individuals in the effort!

If this is just about getting more airtime in the media, then rather than getting hung up in creating an organization, it might pay to use one of the existing ones.

Scenario would be that Oleg or whoever makes the commercial spot and we donate it and enough money to run it in the media to the NRA or GOA or whoever. But it is a specific donation to do a specific thing. No 50% admin costs or general fund nonsense.

That's the thought - don't care who it is, NRA or otherwise, just use an existing group as a vehicle for the message, if that is indeed the idea.
For consideration:

1. One of the real benefits of Oleg's work--his own creative genius, really--is that he has been able to create powerful images that resonate with both the ninnies and the gunnies.

2. At the risk of proposing inappropriate use of The High Road we have a name that is equally appealing, for the reason that it implies a powerful positive image, and is unknown as of now. IOW, the ninnies can't immediately stereotype the ad content and pre-judge it.

3. The anti-hunter / SCUBA Ted quotes, done right by Oleg, can maintain the interest and appeal of both ninnies, hunters, and gunnies--until the clincher/paradox comes in.

So, I guess that, while I am personally very much committed to KISS and Don't Reinvent the Wheel, here we need to figure out how to use the best of an important moment in this fight--and maybe that just means putting forth an ad package that somebody else (having already done the structure, etc.) can utilize. I don't see this as an "NRA-type" ad--nor GOA, NSSF, etc.--it's closest cousin might be the S&W ads in women's magazines, etc.

I suspect there's an existing vehicle--e.g., re 503, whatever--that we could funnel this to--but whose is it?
Yeah . . . . that's the down side. Using an existing org puts you in business today but also comes with baggage that may impact the effectiveness of the message.

THR would be great but you wouldn't want that activity to endanger this board and if they aren't incorporated, then there would be some time and money involved in setting it up properly.

Ideally it would be nice to use some unknown organization (like a local state org) or politically "bulletproof" org (Pink Pistols?) - pun intended.

Thoughts on the message(s):

1. Getting the hunters to put skin in the game is one but I'm not sure that those in the group that aren't active are recycleable

2. Some factual statistics regarding concealed carry and crime, gun safety and children for the masses would be another.

3. A third more risky one would be "The Second Amendment isn't about hunting" that one email and post that floats around, if factual, could be the basis for it: i.e. how many people have been slaughtered because of gun control and famous people who have been for it like Hitler

And that's just for starters . . . .
From some experience and some thought - in no particular order:

Magazines operate 2 to 4 months in advance of publication, plan accordingly. Check the circulation vs ad cost. Might check with SWAT mag execs for faster ad dates. And maybe Rich Lucibella would look fondly upon his "grandchild", so to speak, to advise the often needed information for structuring an organization.

15 or 30 second TV/Radio ads with a solid message will work... off hours, early AM, some afternoon times, & different days work re expense. Prime time costs!

Newspapers, while politically motivated, can work; but take the high road, no in-your-face Ragin' Cajun ads.

Hunter getter? Try: "This fall may be your last hunt! Were you planning to retire?" Appropriate graphics, of course (scoped rifle & shotgun included, maybe screened down game, rounds and shotshells).

For the hunter world, use the local town and county papers - rates are better for one thing, target audience too. For urban world, rights are one thing - robbery, rape, drive-by shootings, knifings, car-jacking, home invasion. etc. - are another... more concern. Why? Watch the 5PM through 6:30PM news... how many of these events are reported most every day?

Flyer/countertop/window displays can work. Doorknob hangers work in the right market.

THR-ers in local groups might have a Saturday coffee in an eatery where interested folks might drop by - if they know of it, of course. Include local activities in your local flyers.

And if the THR "business card" comes online we'll have that to download, print and distribute.

BTW: Literature/media might require copyright protection; it probably will need appropriate disclaimers.

While organization, enthusiasm, and work is involved, the material distributed and the words spoken, while forthright and passionate, must be true - and proven so where necessary.

Some among us are prolific writers, others I'm sure, carry the oral word well. These folks should be prepared - to write - to appear - wherever, whenever invited, whether a local meeting or TV/radio show. Let us not forget "Talk Radio" as a medium. We have a member who, if persuaded, might help in this area.

If they'll let you - use our gals. Show that women have (2nd A) rights too, and may, can, and DO own firearms for fun and personal/family protection - and more every year. But please, no leather clad 30-gun-toting graphics.

Timing - is everything. Generally, we are in the right time frame. The election performers and operators are gearing up for heavy work - whether it is national, state, or local, their plate is full. They will be watching the numbers all summer and proving or disproving their techniques. This is a key time to affect policy at many levels.

In my opinion, the activity proposed here to rally grass-roots support for RKBA, if organized, planned and executed reasonably well during this election time frame, can be our most effective non-choir effort to change things.

CAUTION: Going to another group is NOT viable. Too subject to their agenda(s) and their baggage. Stay in control.

Lastly, as it might be useful to strike up an RKBA conversation, please ask many of whom you will meet - - Are YOU the Militia?

I don't want to be a killjoy here or anything, but this seems like a shotgun approach to a rifle situation.

We have lots of people saying that they will kick in money, but so far there is no plan, no organization, no real mission statement, and no real idea of what we want to do.

First I think that some serious thought and consideration should be given to what is desired, and what the specific target is. Then you need to ask yourself if a new organization is needed to do that. Then you need to figure out the financial and legal repurcussions.

Right now THR is a great source of information, and a great place to exchange ideas, and coordinate activism. Basically what I'm seeing here is the idea that THR be transformed into some sort of RKBA advertising organization like a mini version of GOA or something.

I just don't see that being effective at all. The amount of money that we could raise is really quite small realistically speaking. Yes there is 10,000 registered members here, figure that only a couple thousand of them are active, and of them a couple hundred can afford to donate money.

There are already other very well organized and powerful gun rights organizations. You have to ask yourself what exactly we would bring to the table that they wouldn't.

Personally I think that THR should stay with its strengths. Which is being a great information and coordination point.
When I read the first post, I took it to mean that we as a group advertise The High Road as a great place to trade information on firearms and discuss civil liberties issues. I'm sure there are plenty of people sufficiently interested in the types of things that are said and done here that don't even know THR exists. I frequented The Firing Line for over a year before it was closed and I didn't know about THR until relatively recently.

If this thread was started to generate ideas about promoting THR to bring more interested people aboard, then I would be very willing to help however I can. I'm with Correia in that I don't think THR's place is to be a gun rights organization.


Right. Structure is needed IF there's a serious effort to be made, and that structure need not be directly linked to THR - it is that part of a willing membership we all know and respect that "could" make up the structure.

That said... since Teddy R. had the "BullMoose" party, and that short acronyms work well (RNC, DNC, XYZ;) ) THR would work well as a PARTY name and acronym - that is, if it were legally obtained.

A new Party? Well, maybe. There are many now http://dir.yahoo.com/Government/U_S__Government/Politics/Parties/ but you don't hear about them.

Of course, I'd rather start from scratch than join any of them. But, they may have some useful organization and plank shortcuts to believe in.


Yet - how about RID (Republican, Independent, Democrat)? All those who believe as we. (I only omitted Libertarian because I didn't want to have some newsclown playing with "ridl" - like we were flaky or something.)

I understand exactly what Correa is talking about--but what I think we could bring to the table is a unique message/advertising.

While I am not schooled in 'advertising,' I have yet to see any advertisements for pro-gun viewpoints that have not been encumbered by the fearmonger's mud-slinging. E.g., how many of the 'uncommitted' hunters have seen, or know of, Oleg's movies?

What Oleg is creating is a fresh model for approaching the fundamental issues of firearms ownership, and his symbols are clean and direct.

So, ads put up by a committee out of Oleg's efforts, appearing intermittently, with a calculated plan, could get high impact. They would be unemcumbered by the 'baggage' the fearmongers have attached to the NRA, et.al. The philosophical underpinnings of THR virtually guarantee that.

While I certainly agree to the idea that this could be a group effort that turns into a SNAFU (you sure wouldn't want me organizing it), we have something here that is truly unique for promoting pro-firearms viewpoints, and I hope we can figure out how to maximize that.
I'll support something like this

I'll support something like this.

Might be able to pull $100. But like was said before, I want to see a game plan first.
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