Who is using H4895 or IMR 4895?

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scythefwd

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Guys, I am very new to reloading but I want to reload for my garand. I will be using 165gr bullet for it and I think I read that IMR or H4895 were acceptable powders for reloading with for that gun. Is this the case?

Second, as a means of economy.... does anyone have experience with this powder in .30-30 and .308 win? They only need to be hunting rifle accurate at 100y (2 inches is enough, hopefully 1 moa doable with some fine tuning). I plan on using the same bullets, if I can find a good supply of them, for all three if possible until I get a better handle on loading. The less initial outpour of money this requires.... the more the wife is willing to budget the money for it. I will probably start off with a lee turret kit, with my CH single stage press for small batches while doing load work up. I know the IMR or H isn't the best powder for the .308 or .30-30, or so I hear but will it do the job well enough?

How are the two powders different? I know they aren't identical, but are they close enough to use one or the other in the Garand? I am basically looking to find a powder that is acceptable in the Garand and will attempt to find load data for the others, which are much less picky about pressure curves. I can always use different powders on the other two if I am not happy with the H/IMR loads.

Thoughts, suggestions, attitude adjustments, swift kicks in the pants, or anything else I might need are welcome. I probably won't post much in the thread, as I don't have anything to really add except clarifications. I will answer direct questions, but defer to the more experienced people here.
 
I use both BL-C(2) and IMR 4895 for .308 winchester. I know there is a particular bullet/powder combination for the Garand, but I cant remember it at the moment. I have many collector friends that load for the Garand, and they use that combination. If I can find out what it is, I will post it here. Maybe someone else can chime in on this one..
 
168 Gr bullet, 47.5g H4895, 47g IMR4895, CCI #34 primers seems to be agreed on for the M1 loadings. I was planning on having a lot of nosler partitions at 165gr, and I figured that was close enough to the recommended (found it after I posted) to start with. I won't work up a load from there, but I might work down to a load from there. With the lighter gr. bullet, overpressure shouldn't be an issue...... says the noobie. Besides, don't bullets tend to vary a gr or two in weight when you buy them?

So, thanks for the info on the .308 win info, anyone on .30-30?
 
imr 4895 burns slightly different to H4895. they are not interchangable without load building. either will be fine in a .308 win, they are medium burn speed powders and will be fine. i use imr4895 in my 7mm08 sometimes. What will you be hunting? i can build up some data for you no problem. i loaded some rounds in .308 using some 150gr nosler solid base 30/30 style bullets and they were very accurate. one thing to bear in mind the .308 has lots higher velocity than the the 3030 so a bullet designed to expand in the 3030 with fail in the 308. i would suggest an easy opening .30cal bullet at fairly steady velocities if you are going down that route. or just buy another box of bullets for the 3030. bullets in the states are pretty cheap!
 
interlock - the partitions are rated from 1900 fps to infinity by nosler. I have heard no complaints about them not opening at 2200 fps or so in .30-30's or at 2700 fps or so from .308 wins. I am going after whitetail deer at close range so I don't need super penetration, but I do need to have the bullet open quickly and hold together mostly. I have a thread asking about the nosler ballistic tips in hunting, and didn't like what I read, but the partitions were praised pretty uniformly.

I have load data for the IMR and the H4895 for all 3 rounds. When I said interchangeable.. I meant with powder specific loads... not just swapping them out. When I said I won't work up a load, I meant I won't be going higher on the charges, but I might downgrade the charges a hair if the rifle likes them shooting softer. The intent is to keep from overpressureing the oprod. Since the posted loads are safe with a heavier bullet, I expect that I can use it with a lighter bullet without fear of over pressurization. I wouldn't go to a stiffer charge because the loading I would be using is so close to the ones recommended that I would fear overpressure. The Garand is my biggest concern due to that pesky oprod... and that will be punching paper for fun, not score. The other two are hunting arms, and I will use loadings from Hogdons site or a newer speer manual to start with. Till then, I have my lee manual to work with.

I understand what you mean by medium speed burning powders. Is that what the .308 generally likes? Why is it that medium burn rates work well in it? Is it basically getting the most speed out of a round while keeping pressure down and not throwing burning powder out the barrel? If that is the case, why do we have the slower burning powders? Like I said, I am new to this whole thing. The bullets may be cheap here in the USA, but they can't lay a finger on my wife :) There is a reason I bought the $40 dollar a boxes of ammo.... it makes the math look better when I bring up reloading kits :) I also hear that he Federal brass is pretty good. I'm not so sure about the winchester (silver in color, not the normal brass color.... will have to look into difficulties in neck sizing that).
 
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I bought 50 lbs of military 4895 at $10 a lb. Why? Because I can use it for .30-06, 25-06, .308, .223, 6.5 grendel, and many others. It is one of the best all around powders out there. It is a great powder, and though there are better powders out there for specific cartridges, almost none of them will work well with all of the cartridges that I just mentioned.
 
For my Garand, I've always used 47 grains of IMR4895 with a 150 grain FMJ with no problems. At times, I've thought of using IMR4895 for my .30-30 but I've always had some IMR3031 around, so I've stuck with it.
 
I bought 50 lbs of military 4895 at $10 a lb. Why? Because I can use it for .30-06, 25-06, .308, .223, 6.5 grendel, and many others. It is one of the best all around powders out there. It is a great powder, and though there are better powders out there for specific cartridges, almost none of them will work well with all of the cartridges that I just mentioned.
Click to expand...

+1. Like you, I bought up all the surplus 4895 I could, when the last of it was available several years ago. It's the "Unique" of rifle powders - works with d@mn near everything.

Don
 
IMR 4895 is made in Canada, H4895 in Australia. The H4895 for the USA has been made darker looking compare to what is sold to other countries. Since DuPont got out of the powder business decades ago, IMR powders have been made in Canada by Expro Tech and simply distributed by IMR Powder Co. Hodgdon's powders with the same numbers are made in Australia by Australian Defense Industries (ADI). AR2206H was released into the North American market in 1999, and is distributed by the Hodgdon Powder Co. under the brand name H4895. http://www.thalesgroup.com.au/handloaders-guide/news.asp More> http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0BQY/is_12_51/ai_n15736803/?tag=content;col1 Reduce loads with H4896 > http://www.hodgdon.com/PDF/Youth%20Loads.pdf
 
USSR hit the nail on the head about 4895 being the "Unique" of rifle powders. If I were limited to using only one powder for all my rifle reloading my first choice would be IMR4895.
 
interlock - the partitions are rated from 1900 fps to infinity by nosler. I have heard no complaints about them not opening at 2200 fps or so in .30-30's or at 2700 fps or so from .308 wins. I am going after whitetail deer at close range so I don't need super penetration, but I do need to have the bullet open quickly and hold together mostly. I have a thread asking about the nosler ballistic tips in hunting, and didn't like what I read, but the partitions were praised pretty uniformly.

yes i agree with this. Many people that criticise ballistic tips either drive them at mega high velocities or use ballistic tip varminting bullets for the wrong application. partitions are a GREAT bullet. maybe worth a look are hornadies interlock? i have used them in 243 from a short barrelled rifle in 100 gr so its velocity is pretty low. they expanded nicely and killed well. ballistic tips are very accurate in most peoples rifles. and they look very swish with thier plastic red noses
 
I tend to favor H4895 and find it is very versatile in many of the rounds that I reload. Whether it's a gimmick or not, I do give credence to the fact that the "Extreme Rifle Powder" is supposed to be less temperature sensitive than other powders in the 4895 family.
It burns clean and gives the advertised velocity in my reloads with excellent accuracy. I like it much better than Varget.



NCsmitty
 
243winxb said:
IMR 4895 is made in Canada, H4895 in Australia. The H4895 for the USA has been made darker looking compare to what is sold to other countries. Since DuPont got out of the powder business decades ago, IMR powders have been made in Canada by Expro Tech and simply distributed by IMR Powder Co. Hodgdon's powders with the same numbers are made in Australia by Australian Defense Industries (ADI). AR2206H was released into the North American market in 1999, and is distributed by the Hodgdon Powder Co. under the brand name H4895. http://www.thalesgroup.com.au/handloaders-guide/news.asp More> http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0BQY/is_12_51/ai_n15736803/?tag=content;col1 Reduce loads with H4896 > http://www.hodgdon.com/PDF/Youth%20Loads.pdf
Click to expand...
Now thats really funny... We get our powder from two of the biggest anti-gun countries in the world... Go figure
 
I've been loading my 168 Nosler hpbt's in .308 with IMR-4895, I really like it, good velocity, great accuracy and consistency. I can do all of my rifle loading with IMR-4895, which for me, is just .223 and .308.
 
I use IMR 4895 with 55 gr Sierra Blitzkings in my .243, I have loaded some 125 gr Sierra Pro Hunters using this same powder in my 30-30 but they are still sitting in a box and I haven't tested them. I also loaded some Hornady 52 Gr AMAX with IMR 4895 for my .223 but haven't tested them yet either. I agree it is a very universal powder but in all my rifles I use other powders, reason I am testing it in the others is to see what it shoots like and maybe standardize my powder supplies.
 
Bird, that is my goal as well. 8Lbs of 1 powder is a whole lot easier to store than 8 x 1LBS of 8 different powders (I do own that many calibers... I think....yup 8, but one is a shotgun and won't use the IMR :). If I can keep it to acceptable performance (+/-1 inch groups in hunting rifles, 2 inch from my .30-30, it gets a pass as it has sentimental value, and 3 MOA for my surplus rifles) with 1 powder and for the most part 1 bullet (own 4 different .30 caliber guns, none are bench guns)... it makes life a bit easier.

Thanks for all the answers.... It has settled me a bit about keeping it simple.

Birdhunter.... Murphysboro, IL???? I had a couple of friends from my childhood who live<d> there. What a small world.
 
Who were they?

I shouldn't say I only want to get to 1 powder, but if I can get the same powder to shoot in my 30-30 and one of my .223's and this one 243 load it will be nice. I'll never be down to one powder unless I can find a load using N560 in a .223 case. Sorry but that powder with an 87 VMAX is just the cats nuts plus in my .243. The goal someday would be to only have 1 load for that gun, but that little 55 gr bullet is quite explosive and fun at times.
 
WEG - I have seen that. That is why I was wondering about the differences in them. The IMR is a little slower, but in all reality that is very close in the order... so how different are the burn rates practically.

Birdhunter1 - I knew the daughter of the Ramseys and the Burkharts.
 
The thing with burn rate charts is: 1. they tend to disagree with each other on occasion, and 2. they give you no idea as to the degree of difference. You could have 2 powders next to each other on the chart with profound differences, while 2 powders seperated by 3 or 4 other powders that are nearly identical.

Don
 
ussr and lastdayjake, there is some surplus "RG4895" military 4895 still floating around for about 100$/8LB..

and yes, 4895 is probably the most versatile rifle powder. with just 4895 and 4831 i can load just about any rifle cartridge. plus unique and that includes pistols, and alot of shot-shells.
 
ussr and lastdayjake, there is some surplus "RG4895" military 4895 still floating around for about 100$/8LB..

and yes, 4895 is probably the most versatile rifle powder. with just 4895 and 4831 i can load just about any rifle cartridge. plus unique and that includes pistols, and alot of shot-shells.


but also consider that 4895 is perfectly suited to 308 and 30-06.. that's what it was DESIGNED for.

either one would be a good choice for you. I prefer hodgdon's powders. if you read the 2010 annual magazine i'm pretty sure it states in there that hodgdon powders are held to a 5% standard, as imr is a 10%.. i'll have to double check. i read that somewhere reputable lately.
 
ussr and lastdayjake, there is some surplus "RG4895" military 4895 still floating around for about 100$/8LB.
Click to expand...

Yes, but it is not the original IMR4895 that was used in USGI cartridges for decades. It is simply surplus Brit-produced powder with a similar burn rate. From all indications, it is a bit slower burning as well.

Don
 
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