Whoa...father shoots son, cites self-defense (Sacramento)

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esheato

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Teen held on suspicion of assault
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ELK GROVE - A 14-year-old Elk Grove boy who was shot in the leg by his father Wednesday night has been arrested on suspicion of assault with a deadly weapon.

The boy was being held at juvenile hall Thursday after being released from the hospital, Sacramento County Sheriff's Department spokesman Sgt. R.L. Davis said.

According to reports, the father shot his son in the leg when the boy came toward him with a sword. The boy was angry that his father had taken away his PlayStation as punishment for leaving the house without permission.

Davis said the father was not charged because the shooting was self-defense.

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Father takes away a VIDEO GAME...Son comes at him with a sword. Father shoots him in the leg. What's the world coming to? This is the most insane thing I've ever read.

Ed
 
I have known parents who have taken Judo/Karate and gotten carry permits because of out of control kids. Sad to say not a unknown thing. :(
 
honestly, in this age of political correctness where parents can get taken to jail for spanking their kid, i am glad to hear something like this happened.
 
Poor parental upbringing. If the boy did advance on his father with a sword, the father would certainly have the right to defend his life. To advance upon one own's parent with a weapon is nothing to be taken lightly.

I'd hate to second guess the parents but how do folks raise their kids such that the kid shows no respect?
 
Heh - i came into my gf's life when her child was 11 years old.

at 6 yrs old his dad committed suicide....

at 12 yrs old his step dad died of colon cancer....

at 15 she ended up putting her kid in the Utah Boys Ranch... for around 9 months at 3 grand a month. This was after i did a 128 mile drive in about an hour and a half after a call from her as i was leaving work... he had put a chair through his bedroom window and a candle through the living room door...

That lasted him about 2 months total before stuff started again.

He has resisted arrest, pulled his mom's emergency break while she was driving on a busy road, fought w/ me and her... this very last episode was over a phone. He didn't know how to put the phone back on the charger, so he was told that if it ran out of charge - oh well - deal w/ it. He decided he would get physical in his aquireing the phone - needless to say i'm not a small man. The gf that was on the dying phone heard it - got her mom to call the cops... they took HIM away.... his uncle in argentina managed to get him off and the gf's dad bailed him out, he went to live w/ his gf's parents... he wore out that welcome too - at this time they don't want him on thier property at all - ... the quote? "He has taken our daughter away from us and has proven that he will be an abuser of women - he needs to leave her alone" - this from the same people who "rescued him" from an "abusive household" and who's sage advice it was to my gf that "you can't control teenagers... if you try they will just rebel"....

Its a LOT more than i can go into on this post just cause its a LOT of bloody typing - but he has threatened his mom many times, and he's threatened me many times - the last episode had him moved out of the house and puting restraining orders on ME and HER! rofl - he then sued for divorce so he could "become an adult" - course - w/ the social security from his dad - he figures he doesn't have to work... (around 900 bucks a month)

THEN - things started going bad - so he started talking to his mom again (who doesn't know her butt from a hole in the ground mind you) then went to argentina w/ his savior uncle... well ... thats yet another story... he was bored so he wanted to waste his uncles 2000$ ticket and come home early... (never mind it was "boring" because his uncles dad was in the hospital in a coma).....

And now he's back in the house.....

I swear its like a abusive husband... she won't let him go.

I can perfectly see where a dad or a man of the house might end up shooting a kid - His mom wouldn't let him pass when he was gonna come at me w/ a knife... he didn't threaten her - just told her to move... there i was thinking... ok - the .357 is RIGHT there.... but is it prudent?... she had me call the cops... (which was more prudent) he went to juvi... for a lil while anyway.... then it was back to life as normal.

I don't pass judgement on this fellow... The law has made it to where they tell you to control your children - but if the kid has it in his mind to not do anything - they've got the law to say the parent is wrong. *MY* father would have beat my ass and that would have been the end of it... today that would land him in jail.

bleh

For the record - she has tried ... the kid has had counselors and psych's since he was 6 yrs old... (he's 17 now, 18 on dec 25th.... the antichrist i tell you) Its not like she had a blind eye to what was going on - it just came down to the law has just about always been on his side... even when he's wrong... we must do whats right for the children... (that last very sarcastic) I don't believe in psychs at all(just a personal thing) - and not but one ever saw the "real" kid... and then he wouldn't see her anymore....

J/Tharg!
 
It all starts the day you let a 2yr-old's tantrum dictate your behaviour.
'Spare the Rod and Spoil the Child' is a cliche because it's true.
 
in total agreement.

Course - the day your seemingly normal kid hits puberty - and the school is telling them they have all sorts of rights can't help...

in Texas... try to tell a 17 year old he can't do something... according to family law... he's still a minor... and according to criminal law - he's an adult... so when he doesn't go to school and tells you to F off... you can go to jail for failing to make him/her go to school.

Its true... been through that route....

the mere mention of F off to my dad OR mom would have had me through a wall - oh wait... thats now assault....

Getting my drift on where we are these days?

gonna save those kids... those poor needy kids.... the children... they are our future.... (/e proceeds to gag) More likely they are a easy scapegoat to further someone elses goals....

Spare the rod cliche worked for my dad's dad, my dad's dad's dad and everyone before him - but we are wrong today... and our children prove it every bloody day. (bleh) Thankfully i can say i ain't got one nor will ever have one of those poor children, i'll leave it to the uneducated to have more and more children when they can't afford to have one - and then blame it on the government that they can't afford to raise em. And then have the same government tell me why i gotta pay taxes to support those same people and try to make it sound like its right - for the children.

heh - guess i sound pretty bitter.... oh well, to think i'm only in my 30's....

J/Tharg!
 
Father and Son

Defense is defense. I knew two parties personally in a similar situation.
Surname Duggins...Forsyth County, NC around 1990. (?)

Dad caught 20 year-old Junior for the dozenth or so time with drugs in the house. (Is dozenth a word? lol) Flushes the stash and calls the cops to have the lad removed... cites reasons. Junior vows revenge in front
of the cops, goes to jail. Mama...not married to dad, posts bond.

Two nights later, at around midnight, junior comes kickin' on the door,
shotgun in hand. Papa, unaware of shotgun, calls cops and opens door, revolver in hand.

Junior, obviously stewed to the gills, raises shotgun. Papa tags him twice.
Once in the hip and once in the upper chest. Junior piles up like so much wet laundry. Papa initiates first aid. Cops arrive and call an ambulance. Advise Papa of his Miranda Rights, and take him to jail.

Investigation the next day brings about Papa's release without charges filed. Junior recovers and vows revenge...Oh well.:rolleyes:

A 14 year-old can kill you just as dead as 30 year-old...son or not.

Luck!

Tuner
 
When I was 15 I told my Dad to go to hell one Sunday. At 6' 180lbs against his 5'10 170lbs I thought it was a good bet. When I went to school the next day the Vice Principle noticed my really impressive shiner and asked what happened. I told him, half expecting some sympathy and maybe even some little bit of trouble for Dad. He just chuckled a little and said "Bet that don't happen again" By the end of the day half of the teaching staff had heard and most had a cute joke about it.
Fast forward about 20 years. I had hired my 16 year old son to do some manual labor for me and paid him in advance. Instead of doing the work he went whereever to spend the money. When he came home at 8pm I handed him a hammer and told him to get his lazy butt to work or give me my money back. I saw his grip tighten on the hammer as he gave me "the look". All I said was " Try me"
This was on Saturday, on Monday DCS was at my door to investigate a claim of child abuse

Times have changed

Then theres the 14 year old girl in custody in Fl
After stabbing her father 100 times somewhere up north she was put on house arrest. She glued the tracking bracelet to a cat and took off for Fla
 
Tharg

I swear its like a abusive husband... she won't let him go.
Click to expand...

Guilt plays a big part in these abnormal families. The kids learn how to play the guilt guitar and manipulate their parents any way they please. It's tough to admit one has screwed up his or her kids beyond all means of repair.

I am "grandpa" to a number of kids who are products of the foster care system and who their foster mother decided to adopt. Eight in all. The oldest I helped put away in a group home until he became an adult because he made terrorist threats to his younger brothers and sisters. His mother had a hard time accepting that decision was the right one, but she had the other children to protect.

All of my "grandkids" are products of abusive homes. Sexual abuse, neglect, and a couple were born addicted to drugs. One is an Alcohol Fetal Syndrome child. You can't believe what a mess her life has turned into after leaving her adopted mother's household.

From what I can see of my "grandkids", they are all starved for attention and want very much something they can call their own, most importantly a personal relationship with someone they admire. It looks to me like your girlfriend's boy had those taken from him at some pretty critical ages with the death of his father and then his stepfather.

I'm afraid in your girlfriend's case she has "lost" her son. It will be best to get him out of the household as quickly as is humanly possible. The son is dangerous now. Perhaps if she is lucky, as my friend was, the boy will commit a crime that will cause him to become a ward of the state and put in a group home or juvenile detention facility until he is legally an adult. Of course, if she chooses to let him back into her life and home after that, I suggest you find a new girlfriend.

Pilgrim
 
"he should of taken away the sword instead of the playstation."

Both?

___________

I know a couple who have tried everything for the past 20 years since junior was 5. The boy/youngman/adult simply doesn't think sometimes and he's done the time to prove it.

Yeah, his dad has thumped him a time or three, but he didn't learn. Once when he was 19 or so and 200 pounds plus of muscle he challenged his dad to fist fight and then pulled a butcher knife on him. Dad took the knife away from him and then whupped him, but it didn't sink in.

There are no simple solutions. Even the judges feel sorry for him and his stupid impulsive ideas. Not the bomb threat extortion to the food store though - he phoned them about a hundred times from the front yard and could have done about 65 years. Duh. No, he's not mentally retarded, just impulsive.

It's funny how he gets by most of the time on his handsome charming ways.
 
honestly, in this age of political correctness where parents can get taken to jail for spanking their kid, i am glad to hear something like this happened.
Click to expand...

Hmm. I've seen physical abuse cases that were downright insane. When I was in high school, my friends and I helped a girl deal with an abusive father. Took her to the cops, got child services involved. She got adopted by a friend's parents. She's doing better, still has nightmares though...

I'm not saying that all discipline is bad, but there are many many honest abuse cases out there...
 
Thanks Pilgrim =)

Altho i must say i'm much the same way - i should have gotten a new GF ages ago... just can't seem to let go o' this one <grin>

Not quite sure how this latest bit will turn out. She wants him back in the house cause she was going nuts w/ worry about how he was doing "out there" ... now he's back and she's ok - till she starts to go nuts w/ angst about what he isn't doing around the house/job wise etc etc... <rofl>

I've watched the roller coaster before - I just try to stay out of it now since its more trouble for me to try to help one way OR the other =)

J/Tharg!

EDIT: That is... until i have to get in the middle of it again if only because i'm not as easily manipulated as she is. :p :neener: :p
 
Not healthy

Tharg,

Having been in relationships with needy, spineless women, I cannot urge you strongly enough to GET OUT NOW!! It probably makes you feel good to be there for her, but if things go south, you will get caught in the middle-and no matter who's at fault, the mother and son will turn against you. You cannot win in a situation like this.

Cut your losses and chalk it up to experience. you will truly sorry if you don't.
 
THE -

going on 7 years now - we been through many ups and downs... i'm not cuttin out now. =)

Thanks for the advice tho - i'd prolly give the same to someone else having read the things i've posted =)

Your correct... i will get caught in the middle. Its already happened a bunch... not something i'm not used to by now.

The point was tho - this ain't the same country i grew up in... and i'm only 32... its not like i'm ancient or anything.... how sad is it that parents arent' even allowed to BE parents any more... how hard is it to blame the parent (based on our experiences being raised) when those ain't the rules any more....

I draw from my own experiences... and the current gf isn't the only one - the gf before her had to grow a spine too... she did ... and i think her kids are better for it now... but the point is that my dad would have beat the fear of GOD in me... and i'd have deserved it if i went there.

Now everyone is telling the kids that yer parents can't DO that... and so they don't care... they have an advantage to use against you... instead of the old days when dad WAS god.... (you know what i mean)

i say old days... and shake my head again ... this is from a 32 yr old.... not some seasoned salty dog 60+.... but a stupid kid (still) in a way....

makes ya wonder where we are headed.... =(

J/Tharg!
 
Tharg

A good number of years ago I did some extensive reading of Eric Berne, Robert Harris, etc., all therapists and psychologists who backed a method of analysis and therapy called Transactional Analysis. Eric Berne wrote a book titled "Games People Play." There were follow on books such as "Scripts People Live."

"Scripting" is based on the premise that people identify with fairy tales and attempt to live them out. Popular fairy tales were dissected in the book and common to every fairy tale was a "victim", a "persecutor", and a "rescuer". Unlike fairy tales, real life scripts never have a happy ending because roles often get switched. Rescuers become persecutors, victims become rescuers, and persecutors become victims. Very often it is the original victim who determines roles in the script/game because they are the most experienced in the relationships that make up the script. The original victim has a stake in the script/game and will do whatever possible to maintain a status quo and continue the script.

A rescuer becomes a persecutor because he puts too many demands on the victim in order that she save herself. The victim then becomes a rescuer to protect her original persecutor because she has an interest in keeping that person around. Without her persecutor, there will be no more Prince Charmings to come save her from her misery. If the original persecutor, or Wicked Witch or Troll, is driven off, then the victim, Cinderella, will have to turn her Prince Charming into a troll so she can attract more Prince Charmings.

If you are turned off to the concept of scripting because it uses fairy tales as examples, you are invited to pick up a Louis L'Amour novel and use those characters.

Pilgrim
 
Don't much care for westerns...

and while interesting to read about - and prolly true in a way - this is the way of everything... (rescuer/victim/persecuter) There are a few like myself who usually live as mushrooms w/o a persecutor or a rescuer in sight <grin> altho even then it just gets mutated into soemthing else - via the internet or the government....

the psychobable really amounts to nothing since there isn't any way people are gonna be changed unless they want to be changed. That and you can make a SAR that equates this tidy formula w/ just about any 3 things.... (Situation Action Result)

I make these comments while at the same time understanding what you are saying - to put it into a non fairy tale story....

the gf (victim of the son) is rescued (by me) and the persecutor (the son) ends up getting persecuted by me (now the persecutor of the son<victim>) which leads the gf to become the rescuer of the son (victim) and reacts at the persecutor (now me) and so on an so forth. I don't have any degree's and i have already mentioned that tidy lil circle to her. =)

The only problem w/ this whole story is i can understand where she is comming from. Mothers are like that. If they weren't then they'd be more like dads and the few well adjusted of us that managed to have both and grew up healthy with both a compasionate side and the no BS side the father usually passes down. If this were just some kid - and she were just some girl - then i'd have to say that you couldn't keep me around for the fireworks. Unfortunately this IS her son... and guilt is gonna play into it since she IS a girl more attuned to such things... He (the son) once complained to his counselor that i started yelling after the 3rd time asking him to do something, and his mom took a lot longer. She sagely looked at him and said something to the effect of how much would I have "yelled" if he had just done it...

That or yer telling me that times haven't changed, and children don't grow up to learn that respect isn't needed. I know there ARE parents out there w/ respectful kids.... but i've seen a LOT more kids that could care less, and know thier parents are powerless (victims?) in these days of Dr. Spock and liberal BS about how yer supposed to time out the kids. (ya - like the multi year "time outs" we put criminals through -that seems to help a lot too) Not to mention the laws that could land you in jail not for abuse... but for (trying) keeping that sack of raging hormones and emotions in check.

heh

J/Tharg!
 
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