Why I don't use push feed rifles for dangerous game

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H&Hhunter

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Here's the article appearing in the ADN. . Short stroked his Remington jam-o-matic. And folks wonder why you want a CRF rifle for dangerous game.
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Hunting guide mauled by wounded brown bear
ATTACK: Scott Newman attributes incident to two cardinal errors.


By PETER PORCO
Anchorage Daily News

(Published: April 28, 2004)

Scott Newman of Petersburg says he's naturally a calm person. He proved it Monday evening as a wounded brown bear on Admiralty
Island crunched the bones of his left foot and moved up to chew on his leg while Newman methodically tried to free a jam in his rifle.

By the time the bear chomped on his inner thigh, Newman let go of the rifle and his hope for another shot and tried pushing the
animal away with his hands. The bear then began cracking the bones of his right hand and forearm.

Newman, a 39-year-old hunting and fishing guide, told the story of his mauling Tuesday by telephone from his bed at Sitka
Community Hospital. He was bandaged and in splints. Doctors had yet to close his puncture wounds, so as to let them drain. He was
in a lot of pain, he said.

Nevertheless, he spoke matter-of-factly, going over details with precision, and blaming himself for two mistakes, neither of them very
rare on guided hunts.

Newman has been guiding for 17 years, 12 of them as proprietor of his own business. He is called a "superb guide" on the Web site of
Field & Stream magazine.

Monday was the last day of a 10-day bear hunt in the vicinity of Pybus Bay in the southeast corner of Admiralty, about 75 miles
south of Juneau. His client was a textile businessman from Mexico City. Others on the trip included the client's wife; Newman's
15-year-old nephew, Levi Newman, who worked as his assistant guide; and a cook.

"We saw only 10 bears for the whole trip," Newman said. That included a decent-sized bear on the fifth day, which they let go. On
Monday, from Newman's skiff on Little Pybus Bay, they spotted a boar along the beach of the small peninsula that separates the smaller bay from the bigger one.

"I parked the skiff downwind of the bear and we did our final stalk on foot," Newman said. The bear busied itself behind a bunch of driftwood logs. They'd see a leg,
then its head. It seemed to back away.

Newman next made the first of his mistakes, he said: He left the side of his hunter and crawled toward the water for a better look. When the bear started climbing
over the logs, the client became excited and fired two or three rounds.

"I wasn't able to whisper, 'Wait 'til he turns his side,'" Newman said. He now fired several rounds of his own, big 400-grain bullets from a .416 Remington Magnum.

"I think I got a frontal shot," he said. "I thought I really hit him hard. I was pretty confident he'd be dead" in the brush where the animal ran.

Now came what Newman considers his second mistake. It was 7 p.m. and would be dark in two hours. He didn't want to wait until morning to skin the bear, not with
another hunt coming up in a few days. He decided then to follow it, to ensure it was dead and to skin the carcass while they had light.

Newman found a large pool of blood where the bear had been hit and a spoor leading away from the beach into the brush.

He zig-zagged across the trail, circling quietly. It was clear the bear was bleeding from both sides. Newman guessed it had been hit as many as half-a-dozen times.

"I was fairly concerned because he'd gone quite a ways. There was dark blood. I knew he was hurt, but I didn't think he was mortally wounded, so I probably had a
live animal on my hands."

Newman was looking at the ground when he heard a twig break. He slipped the safety off and heard a low roar.

"He was ticked off," he said. "He appeared instantaneously. He looked like a freight train coming at me. I knew I had to make the shot really count. I took an extra
split second, leaned into it and torched it off. I was fairly certain I hit him in the chest."

He worked the bolt to chamber a second round but "short-stroked it," jamming the rifle. "Damn," he said as the bear barrelled forward, knocking him down.

"Now I'm on my back kicking this bear in the head, trying to get him off me. He's biting my left foot, giving me a compound fracture, crunching the bones in my left
leg. I'm trying to get my gun to work."

Newman feared that a bad tear in his thigh could sever the femoral artery, so when the bear bit him there, he switched tactics.

After the boar chomped his hands, however, it broke off suddenly, turned to the side, turned back as if still interested in Newman, but finally walked away.

"When he dropped down, he appeared very sick," Newman said. He thinks the bear, found dead later just yards from that spot, was then only moments from dying.

"It was that frontal shot at 10 feet," Newman said. "It was a mortal shot, and he had just another 30 seconds to live, and in the meantime he chewed on me very
good."

As soon as the bear turned away, Newman grabbed his rifle and ran 25 yards away -- on adrenalin, he said.

"I sat down and started yelling for help, then realized I had my hand-held (radio) and called the Coast Guard. ... 'I need a helicopter now,' " he told them, worried still
about the femoral artery.

The artery was intact, although Newman did lose a lot of blood. But he never lost consciousness.

"I had a definite sense of calmness. I was very calm about the whole thing. I don't know where it came from. That's just the way I am. I was never freaked out about
it. I just knew what I had to do to get out of that situation."

Levi Newman and a man from a nearby lodge helped stabilize him until he was evacuated by Coast Guard helicopter 90 minutes after the mauling.

Levi also worked to skin the bear and get the hide and the others back to Petersburg on Tuesday evening.
 
Thanks for sharing

Good read and re-affirms the need to follow the rules - rules established by the experience and mistakes of others...I concur with CRF. Remarkable calm and composure , I too hope him the best in recovery.
 
I was told today by one person that the rifle was a new Winchester, by another that it was a Mauser.

If true, so much for Remington bashing based on this story

WildwillpostewhenifindoutAlaska
 
Doesnt Winchester have that new Controled round push feed design? I know they still make controled feed for some of their rifles though
Anyone messed with this new design?
 
Idon't know. If it were a push feed of a CRF, the same outcome would have happened if he shortstroked it- the bolt would have ridden over the cartridge in the magazine. The only way I can see jamming or misfeeding a push feed is if you are upside down and moving the bolt very slowly- this is where a CRF would really shine:p

I own a few dozen bolt action rifles, both push feed and CRF and can tell you that the only rifles that seem to get finnicky are mausers especially if the receiver rails and feed ramp aren't quite right for the length of the cartridge or shape of the bullet.
 
Please help educate me. What is a CRF?

Larryect

CRF stands for controlled round feed. There are many more "experts" on this subject than I. However in a nut shell CRF was designed to controll the round from the time the bolt picks it up from the follower to the time it is extracted. It should not allow you to double feed that was the primary reason the militaries of the world adapted this design with the mauser 98 as a platform (yes I know there were lots of others.) The other thing a CRF allows you to do is feed from any position such as upside down ETC.

It is however possible to short stroke and jam any bolt action rifle if your really trying hard. Like when a bear is about to eat you!!!That is why I've gone to a double rifle for really serious work. They don't jam and they don't have feeding problems and they don't short stroke. This situation is what a double rifle was built for. A double would have been perfect in this situation.

A good lever gun would have been pretty usefull too.

This really isn't about REMINGTON bashing I just couldn't resist that little kick. Sorry.....(So I guess there was a little Rem bashing on my part)

Wildalaska. I was told the rifle was a M-700 let us know when you find what it really was....
 
I've gone to a double rifle for really serious work. They don't jam and they don't have feeding problems and they don't short stroke.
Bolt actions don't short-stoke either . . . it's the people who use them who screw up. And though it might happen tomorrow, I've yet to have a jam with either my push-feed M70 .30/06 or my push-feed Browning Safari .375.

I would really like a double myself, but I realize that doubles can sometimes have their own problems . . . not long ago, one of THR's prominent proponents of double rifles posted
Just last week I doubled my .470 quite by accident
:uhoh:


(Quote look familar, H&H? ;) )
 
H&Hhunter

Thanks for the reply. I am really quite new to high power rifles and farily new to center fired pistols as well. I helped my son buy his first 30-06. It is a ruger (don't remeber model). We were told the action was based on the Mauser design. I like the Ruger warranty and felt 30-06 was probably a good all-around caliber. Never heard of a double rifle. Sounds interesting. My sons have this idea of Bear hunting. I am not so sure. One has the 30-06 the other has a 7mm remington Magnum. The only good thing is they would have to go a long way to find Grizzly. We only have the black bear in Califonia.
 
big-bore leverguns can have operator induced malfunctions too. It can happen to any type of gun, really. And the idea of a backup gun is great, but I had a ruger stupidblackhawk lock up tight on me shooting 300 grain bullets heavily loaded and heavily crimped, but they still budged forward in the cylinders from recoil. Test your loads and guns and practice practice practice. And sometimes still the bear'll get you. Maybe it's just this guy's number was up, ya know? Even the greatest white hunters in Africa got mauled or trampled eventually in most cases, even if they lived through it to write a book or two.
 
I don't mean to second guess this guy, but if he had carried even just a 10mm or .45 on his hip, the scenario might have played out differently, right? The gun jams, drops the rifle, draws the pistol and he empties a mag into the charging bear, no mauling, right? Or am I oversimplifying it a lot?:confused:
 
You're oversimplifying alot:) Bottom line is this: If you get as close as this guy did to any wounded (but not crippled) dangerous game species...odds are you're going to get nailed no matter what you're shooting.

Have you seen the lion video? Imagine a lone hunter in heavier brush tracking that lion after it was wounded. Imagine him finding the lion ten feet away and closing. At that point it doesn't really matter what you've got.

After using pushfeeds and having problems from the bench with reliable feeding, I'll use controlled feed for dangerous game.

I'll also practice assiduously before the hunt so I don't screw up like the guide's client did.
 
I figured as much...shows what I know about bear hunting. So, in the interests of furthering my bear hunting knowledge, what kind of rifle would you use to kill a big ole grizzly? (Make, model and caliber)

Oh yeah, which lion video? I've read a lot of bear books and the one thing that always surprises me is how fast they move for their size.
 
I would really like a double myself, but I realize that doubles can sometimes have their own problems . . . not long ago, one of THR's prominent proponents of double rifles posted


Just last week I doubled my .470 quite by accident


Hank.....

Just a thought....What affect do you think two 500gr X bullets would have had on that bear at close range?



;)
 
"So, in the interests of furthering my bear hunting knowledge, what kind of rifle would you use to kill a big ole grizzly? (Make, model and caliber)"

What make and model may depend on the caliber you choose. As far as calilber, the largest/powerful one you can handle accurately and proficiently. It's no use buying a .375H&H or .458WinMag if you're scared of shooting it. Doesn't do you any good if you can't hit with it.

I have a friend in AK who says that the .338Winmag is very popular for an all around gun. He shoots a 7mmMag though. Wildalaska should be able to shed some light on this.
 
His rifle was a SAKO, rebarreled to 416 remington mag, and in his last interview, he has stated that from now on when in the bush fter bear he will carry a 454 for back up
 
Oh great I have a Sako! A 338 too...

Guess I will retire it for the Pre 64 300 H&H...

I daresay we have more bear hunters popping in our shop from all over the US then any other place in AK...that being said, informally, I dont think there is a "dominant caliber", although 375 is probably the most prevelant, along with 338, 300Win, 300 Ultra, 338 Ultra, 457/45-70...

I think in the annual range survey in Anchorage 30-06 is the most prevelant, followed by 338, 300, 375....

If I was to go to hunt real big bear like in Kodiak or on the Penninsula (which I aint) Id use 338, since I am familiar with it and can shoot it reasonably well up to 150 +/- yards...I have bad vision, so I try not to shhot at critters past that, although I will shoot paper as far as I can..


Wildwhateveritisshootitgoodandknowyourlimitations
 
I'm not "afraid" of shooting any make, model or caliber. My shoulder can take it...or will pretend that it can. There sure are a lot of different ones to choose from, though. My bear hunting knowledge would fit inside a dixie cup, so all the information I can get is appreciated.
 
It's no use buying a .375H&H or .458WinMag if you're scared of shooting it. Doesn't do you any good if you can't hit with it.


Slydlok,

I'd like to submit that if you can shoot a .338 the .375H&H should not be a problem for you. The .375H&H is very simular in recoil to the .338.

My bear rig is a stainless synthetic .375H&H M-70 CRF (of course). It also accompanies me just about everywhere else in the world that I happen to be hunting.

The rifle is as accurate as one can expect from a sporting arm. My .375H&H will cut under a half inch at 100 yards and I've killed big game past 400 yards with it on occasion. I truely believe that the .375H&H in the correct platform is the ultimate big game all around hunting rifle.

I find it an absolute pussy cat to shoot.

Try it you'll like it!!!:)
 
No matter how bad the recoil, if the sight picture was correct when the gun went off, the bullets are downrange before the shoulder knows anything about the problem.
- Art :D

Ain't that the damn truth.
Doubling a 12 bore SxS, 10 ga single shot with 20" bbl ( no shirt, no recoil pad). Other life lessons that stuck ( stung, bruised...) the first time. I learn some stuff - right quick. :D
 
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