Don't know much about ARs. But have had my first one for a few months - new Bushmaster XM15. Shot it on two occasions so far. I got some failures to feed the first round, and then figured out that the mag wasn't seated. Upon inspection, I find that it is extremely 'tight' when the mag seats, and take a LOT of force to get the mag to seat - not just a push, but a pretty hard "hit" to get it home. Should I polish/dremel the interior of the mag catch to loosen it a tad, or will this work itself out (looser) with more use? These are GI mags, BTW. The gun is flawless so far once the mag is seated. Thanks.
Will this problem I have with my AR15 likely work itself out over time?
- Thread starter GunGoBoom
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Well, the latter advice just won't cut it, I'm afraid. I want more of a sure thing with *one* firm (but not extreme) force seating of the mag. I don't want to have to 'double-tap' every time I mag change to make sure I'm seated. Sounds like an adjustment is in store - how do I do that - is this a "dremel-Dan" home thing? It is quite difficult to seat whether the bolt carrier is forward or back, but even more so (slightly) with bolt forward. We're talking about a very hard slap is required regardless. So, adjust it, or keep shooting and it will likely work itself out? Thanks!
Sam Cade
Member
What make of magazines are you useing?
Orlites tend to not function well in bushmaster lowers.
Orlites tend to not function well in bushmaster lowers.
Ohen Cepel
Member
I would try several other mags before I took a Dremel to anything.
It might just be a bur or too much finish on the mag release that could be polished off/smoothed out. However, I suspect the mag more than the rifle.
It might just be a bur or too much finish on the mag release that could be polished off/smoothed out. However, I suspect the mag more than the rifle.
Jenrick
Member
One thing to try is to down load the mags by a couple of rounds and see if that help, or see if the mag loads without trouble from an open bolt. Could just be a really strong spring on the mag.
-Jenrick
-Jenrick
Jay Kominek
Member
I have some lower quality mags which won't seat when they're fully loaded and the bolt is closed, regardless of the pounding I do. My D&H mags will go in every time. So, I'm with Ohen, try some other mags before you go applying a dremel tool to anything.
Chris Rhines
Member
First, try some other magazines.
Second, the magazine catch on an AR-15 is adjustable. No need to dremel anything. Just use a pointed tool to fully depress the mag catch button, then unthread the mag catch by a turn or two.
If neither of those does the trick, then the lower on your rifle is defective.
- Chris
Second, the magazine catch on an AR-15 is adjustable. No need to dremel anything. Just use a pointed tool to fully depress the mag catch button, then unthread the mag catch by a turn or two.
If neither of those does the trick, then the lower on your rifle is defective.
- Chris
Quintin Likely
Member
Not that it should make a huge difference, but are you jamming the mags home with the bolt open or closed?
beerslurpy
member
I'm not going to jump on the AR bashing bandwagon. I just want to say that an AR15 family gun is not the sort of thing you just "jump into without knowing anything about them." It is the kind of thing you research heavily before your purchasing decisions or you end up making a lot of expensive mistakes. They can be reliable guns, but not if you arent a highly informed buyer.
Kind of like building a race motor. You either do a ton of research and shop very carefully or you pay an arm and a leg for someone else to make all the decisions.
Kind of like building a race motor. You either do a ton of research and shop very carefully or you pay an arm and a leg for someone else to make all the decisions.
Rexrider
Member
GunGoBoom,
Before we can help you we need to know one thing. Do you need the "extra" force to seat the mag with the bolt OPEN or CLOSED?
You did not like Rockstar's answer but it could be the right one.
Do not dremel anything.
This is an easy one.
1. If you are having this problem with the bolt closed, this is normal. It takes a good firm whack with the palm of your hand to seat a mag loaded with 30 rds. It is not that big of a deal, since you are more likely to be inserting a new mag with the bolt open after you empting the previous mag.
Downloading one round will make it easier to seat the mag but it will still take a firm tap on the bottom of the mag to seat it (assuming the bolt is closed).
Don't be afraid to use a little force to seat the mag, The mags and rifle are not that fragile. They can take it.
2. If you are having this problem with the bolt open. The mag should seat very easily without any force if the bolt is open. So if you need to hammer it that hard then you have a flawed lower. DO NOT USE A DREMEL. Send it back to Bushmaster to fix it. They will make it right but not if you attack the lower first. They won't touch it if you put grinding marks all over it.
Before we can help you we need to know one thing. Do you need the "extra" force to seat the mag with the bolt OPEN or CLOSED?
You did not like Rockstar's answer but it could be the right one.
Do not dremel anything.
This is an easy one.
1. If you are having this problem with the bolt closed, this is normal. It takes a good firm whack with the palm of your hand to seat a mag loaded with 30 rds. It is not that big of a deal, since you are more likely to be inserting a new mag with the bolt open after you empting the previous mag.
Downloading one round will make it easier to seat the mag but it will still take a firm tap on the bottom of the mag to seat it (assuming the bolt is closed).
Don't be afraid to use a little force to seat the mag, The mags and rifle are not that fragile. They can take it.
2. If you are having this problem with the bolt open. The mag should seat very easily without any force if the bolt is open. So if you need to hammer it that hard then you have a flawed lower. DO NOT USE A DREMEL. Send it back to Bushmaster to fix it. They will make it right but not if you attack the lower first. They won't touch it if you put grinding marks all over it.
Rex and Quinton, I already said in my second post above that this happens BOTH the the bolt open and closed - but moreso with the bolt closed. I did have the 20-round GIs loaded to 20 rd. capacity. Dangit, maybe I'm wrong. Maybe my CRS is setting in and *despite* what I said in my 2nd post, it did NOT happen with bolt open, even though I was quite sure in my mind that it had. Now I'm doubting myself. Well, I'll test again, of course, and if it turns out to be ONLY bolt closed, then I'll download by 1 to 19 (on the GI 20-rounders), and see if that does the trick. If not, then I'll adjust - thanks for all the info though - everyone did help, esp. C. Rhines.
Beerslurpy, c'mon now man, you're falling down on the job - here you have a perfect opportunity to bash the platform again (instead of just me), and you're purposely passing it up? What gives?
(from someone who agress with much of what you say). And I did pay an arm and a leg for the Bushmaster instead of a home build so that it would be RIGHT from the get-go, since I *didn't* know all I 'needed' to know about ARs. If I did, I wouldn't have paid the premium for the Bushy name.
Beerslurpy, c'mon now man, you're falling down on the job - here you have a perfect opportunity to bash the platform again (instead of just me), and you're purposely passing it up? What gives?
(from someone who agress with much of what you say). And I did pay an arm and a leg for the Bushmaster instead of a home build so that it would be RIGHT from the get-go, since I *didn't* know all I 'needed' to know about ARs. If I did, I wouldn't have paid the premium for the Bushy name.Download your magazines by 2 rounds if you are inserting them on a closed bolt. The follower on USGI magazines will bottom out if fully loaded and inserted on a closed bolt and it will take a lot of force to get it to lock into place. The HK high reliability magazines are long enough that you can load 30 rounds, but HK doesn't want private citizens to have them, they are heavier then the USGI ones and cost about $45.00 a piece if you can find them. You shouldn't be having any problems on an open bolt.
Push-Pull The Army teaches that you insert the magazine and slap it into place. Yes, that works, but not every time, you will think the mag is locked in, but it may not be, you may even strip the first round and then it will drop enough that it doesn't pickup the second round in the magazine and it goes click instead of BANG! when you want it to.
The Marines and most instructors in the private sector teach push-pull. Push the magazine into the magwell, and give it t little pull downward to make sure it's locked.
Jeff
Push-Pull The Army teaches that you insert the magazine and slap it into place. Yes, that works, but not every time, you will think the mag is locked in, but it may not be, you may even strip the first round and then it will drop enough that it doesn't pickup the second round in the magazine and it goes click instead of BANG! when you want it to.
The Marines and most instructors in the private sector teach push-pull. Push the magazine into the magwell, and give it t little pull downward to make sure it's locked.
Jeff
beerslurpy
member
I dont have any particular hatred for the AR, I just consider that it is a gun that demands more from a user than may be possible when the SHTF. It also demands more from a builder than most are willing to spend.
But I am not going to criticize people for spending extra money to get what they want, when I spent 550 on an arsenal AK and another 200 on optics for it.
If I were uncle sam and had unlimited money (tax money is free money!) to spend, I'm sure I wouldnt hesitate to purchase 12,000 dollar heat sensing goggles, thousands of dollars on the bestest armor and all the tacticoolest rifles and accessories. And why not throw in a few armored divisions and an air support wing just in case. Sadly, my budget does not stretch that far, and in any situation where I will need a gun to defend myself from looters and hunt/fish to acquire protein, even basic help is going to be far off.
If I could have, I would have compromised and gotten a Sig550 instead of an AR or AK. But alas, this is even less likely than me acquiring air support.
But I am not going to criticize people for spending extra money to get what they want, when I spent 550 on an arsenal AK and another 200 on optics for it.
If I were uncle sam and had unlimited money (tax money is free money!) to spend, I'm sure I wouldnt hesitate to purchase 12,000 dollar heat sensing goggles, thousands of dollars on the bestest armor and all the tacticoolest rifles and accessories. And why not throw in a few armored divisions and an air support wing just in case. Sadly, my budget does not stretch that far, and in any situation where I will need a gun to defend myself from looters and hunt/fish to acquire protein, even basic help is going to be far off.
If I could have, I would have compromised and gotten a Sig550 instead of an AR or AK. But alas, this is even less likely than me acquiring air support.
Rexrider
Member
GunGoBoom,
My apologies. In my rush to see if I could help I did miss the part where you said it happened with the bolt closed and opened.
All I saw was the "Well, the latter advice just won't cut it" and continued on through the thread.
It is very common for people to be a little freaked out over how much of a slap it can take to seat a full mag on a closed bolt and assume there is something wrong. I assumed you fell into this catagory.
But, as already stated, it should only be that way with a closed bolt. When the bolt is locked open (like on an empty mag), a mag should just slide into place and lock (no drama needed).
If adjusting the mag catch and trying different mags does not help when the bolt is open, you will probably need to send it back to Bushmaster.
Sadly, I had to send my Bushy back as well to have the "gas system sealed" (their words). Actually the gas key was not stacked in correctly.
The good news is it has run flawlessly since I got it back. Turn around time was 4 weeks and that was over the Holidays last year.
Let us know what happens on the 2nd test. Good luck.
My apologies. In my rush to see if I could help I did miss the part where you said it happened with the bolt closed and opened.
All I saw was the "Well, the latter advice just won't cut it" and continued on through the thread.
It is very common for people to be a little freaked out over how much of a slap it can take to seat a full mag on a closed bolt and assume there is something wrong. I assumed you fell into this catagory.
But, as already stated, it should only be that way with a closed bolt. When the bolt is locked open (like on an empty mag), a mag should just slide into place and lock (no drama needed).
If adjusting the mag catch and trying different mags does not help when the bolt is open, you will probably need to send it back to Bushmaster.
Sadly, I had to send my Bushy back as well to have the "gas system sealed" (their words). Actually the gas key was not stacked in correctly.
The good news is it has run flawlessly since I got it back. Turn around time was 4 weeks and that was over the Holidays last year.
Let us know what happens on the 2nd test. Good luck.
demusn1979
Member
not impressed
i thought bushmasters we all supposed to go back for inspection,tightening straightening of fsb,and resealing of gas systems.
but look at how many they make right.
they don't even test fire all there weapons!
i thought bushmasters we all supposed to go back for inspection,tightening straightening of fsb,and resealing of gas systems.
but look at how many they make right.
they don't even test fire all there weapons!
beerslurpy
member
Simplicity of user interface does not equal simplicity of implementation. Something can be both complicated and easy to use. The complication is built into the back end of the process, in the maintenance and manufacturing side of the equation. Additionally, the design of a gun (or any product) can be made to favor certain areas over others so that acheiving certain characteristics is very easy while others become difficult.
The AR15 was made with a focus on accuracy, ergonomics and advanced materials. It is designed to be accurate, lightweight and pleasant to shoot. It was not designed to be easy to manufacture, to be maintenance free or to be cheap. Quality of build affects reliability.
The AK47 actually sacrifices a lot of ease of use features (no bolt hold open, rock-to-click mag insertions, clunky safety lever, overly forceful non-adjustable gas system) in favor of simplicity of implementation and reliability. It also sacrifices accuracy (which itself is an ease of use feature) in favor of additional reliability. The gun is designed to be easy to manufacture and easy to keep running. Quality of uild mostly affects accuracy.
The AR15 was made with a focus on accuracy, ergonomics and advanced materials. It is designed to be accurate, lightweight and pleasant to shoot. It was not designed to be easy to manufacture, to be maintenance free or to be cheap. Quality of build affects reliability.
The AK47 actually sacrifices a lot of ease of use features (no bolt hold open, rock-to-click mag insertions, clunky safety lever, overly forceful non-adjustable gas system) in favor of simplicity of implementation and reliability. It also sacrifices accuracy (which itself is an ease of use feature) in favor of additional reliability. The gun is designed to be easy to manufacture and easy to keep running. Quality of uild mostly affects accuracy.
Rexrider
Member
Rockstar,
You know, I am not even sure of what the status is on the bolt being closed or open. I took GunGoBoom's last response to mean he was second-guessing himself and was going back to check.
demusn1979,
Your last post did not make much sense. I am not sure what you where trying to say. I think you where commenting on Bushmaster's quality control, or lack thereof.
All I can say is I really like my Bushy. Yes, I was disappointed it had to go back. But they did make it right and has not had one hiccup since then. If I were going to buy another complete AR, I would buy it from Bushmaster without a second thought.
You know, I am not even sure of what the status is on the bolt being closed or open. I took GunGoBoom's last response to mean he was second-guessing himself and was going back to check.
demusn1979,
Your last post did not make much sense. I am not sure what you where trying to say. I think you where commenting on Bushmaster's quality control, or lack thereof.
All I can say is I really like my Bushy. Yes, I was disappointed it had to go back. But they did make it right and has not had one hiccup since then. If I were going to buy another complete AR, I would buy it from Bushmaster without a second thought.
They are pretty hard to positively lock in a full mag with the bolt forward. I have read where some bushies had tight mag wells that wouldn't accept a standard aluminum magazine. I didn't see the guns myself so it may be bogus. But I have seen purple parkerizing on Bushmasters so I have some doubts about their attention to detail. YMMV
GGB - How many magazines have you tested with? Do let us know when you test the bolt open/closed again.
I believe the jury is still out on whether the bolt was open or closed at the time...
If GGB has the problem with the bolt open AND closed, and is unable to fix it by adjusting the mag catch, AND has the same issue with a half-dozen magazines, THEN you can bash his rifle.
Did you bother to read ALL the posts before you decided to jump on this bandwagon?
I believe the jury is still out on whether the bolt was open or closed at the time...
If GGB has the problem with the bolt open AND closed, and is unable to fix it by adjusting the mag catch, AND has the same issue with a half-dozen magazines, THEN you can bash his rifle.
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