I just want to start off with saying that I'm new to this forum and reloading in general so I already know everything, lol. But just in case I don't, I did try some win 296 powder in my 10mm and have had some good results so far and was wondering if anyone knew of a reason not to use it. I know there is no load data for the powder in this round but I did find that 12.5gr gives me around 900 +- fps. Also i guess, i use longshot too and my speed is only in the 800's with 8.5gr. the book says it should be around 1100. Any thoughts on either topic would be appreciated.
Win 296 in 10mm??
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horsemen61
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Well I say welcome to THR YOU WILL LEARN a lot here.
7mmb
Member
Win 296 operates safely at very specific pressure ranges and should not be downloaded because of the danger of squib loads. It needs magnum primers and firm roll crimps for reliable ignition and should be loaded exactly as published, no extrapolating up or down. It is one of the best powders for magnum revolver cartridges for full power loads. There is a reason there is no published data with 296 in 10mm Auto, it is neither appropriate nor safe in this cartridge. You are treading on very dangerous ground. Please do not fire your loads anywhere near me. Get a good reloading manual that contains more than just data and read it.
gamestalker
member
I'm certain you've noticed that there are many different powders, and that each has it's own range of specif applications. Such as 296 / H110 are not published for 10mm loads. Only published data can be used to reload, ever. Have you notice that typical rifle powders are not used for pistol loads, same thing, they are not suitable for those applications.
I sure hope you don't just dismiss those of us issuing a stern caution. You are on the edge of a certain, and very a serious catastrophic event if you continue to load without the use of published data, which is what you are in effect doing.
GS
I sure hope you don't just dismiss those of us issuing a stern caution. You are on the edge of a certain, and very a serious catastrophic event if you continue to load without the use of published data, which is what you are in effect doing.
GS
f4tweet
Member
10m powder
Try AA-7 or AA-9. It flows like sand and meters wonderfully. Lee's 2nd Edition has a lot of info on reloading 10mm. I use 11.0 gr of AA-7 with a 180gr Rainier @ 1200fps.
Try AA-7 or AA-9. It flows like sand and meters wonderfully. Lee's 2nd Edition has a lot of info on reloading 10mm. I use 11.0 gr of AA-7 with a 180gr Rainier @ 1200fps.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
When a powder manufacturer doesn't list a powder for loading a cartridge there is usually a very good reason. You should listen to them...
Unfortunately W571/HS-7 are no longer being made because that was the best 10mm/40 S&W powder ever made. You can safely use Longshot, AA#7, Blue Dot, Power Pistol, HS-6 and a few others in then same burn rate range. Of course you can use the faster powders for target loads but you won't achieve high velocities without pushing the SAAMI pressure limits.
It's not so much W296/H110 is so slow, it's more the powder itself. Like said above, it has a very narrow weight window that you really shouldn't stray from.
Welcome to the forum and to reloading...
Unfortunately W571/HS-7 are no longer being made because that was the best 10mm/40 S&W powder ever made. You can safely use Longshot, AA#7, Blue Dot, Power Pistol, HS-6 and a few others in then same burn rate range. Of course you can use the faster powders for target loads but you won't achieve high velocities without pushing the SAAMI pressure limits.
It's not so much W296/H110 is so slow, it's more the powder itself. Like said above, it has a very narrow weight window that you really shouldn't stray from.
Welcome to the forum and to reloading...
My thoughts on this? You are going to get spanked here for loading the "High" pressure 10mm with a powder that has no data and has a reputation. If you are looking for a pat on the back, my guess is that you will get no such thing.
Stick to published data and keep all you digits attached.
Stick to published data and keep all you digits attached.
tyeo098
Member
H110/W296 (same thing) needs to reach full pressure in order to burn properly.
Using it in loads where it will not attain that pressure will result in the powder not burning completely (if at all) and you'll end up with a bullet stuck in your barrel.
This is very dangerous if you load the next round and pull the trigger
Unfortunately you wont be able to create a load that will reach that pressure with a 40cal bullet in a 10mm case in such a short barrel. This MAY result in the situation above, it may not, but it should not be danced with.
It sucks when you have lots of powder on hand that you cant load with (ask me how much blue dot I have
) but its a sunk cost that you should be able to recover selling it locally.
Too bad you're not near VA, I'd gladly trade you my blue dot for your 296 to use in my M1 carbine!
Oh, and what gr bullet are you using?
http://www.handloads.com/loaddata/d...&Weight=All&type=Handgun&Order=Powder&Source=
Using it in loads where it will not attain that pressure will result in the powder not burning completely (if at all) and you'll end up with a bullet stuck in your barrel.
This is very dangerous if you load the next round and pull the trigger
Unfortunately you wont be able to create a load that will reach that pressure with a 40cal bullet in a 10mm case in such a short barrel. This MAY result in the situation above, it may not, but it should not be danced with.
It sucks when you have lots of powder on hand that you cant load with (ask me how much blue dot I have
) but its a sunk cost that you should be able to recover selling it locally.Too bad you're not near VA, I'd gladly trade you my blue dot for your 296 to use in my M1 carbine!
Oh, and what gr bullet are you using?
http://www.handloads.com/loaddata/d...&Weight=All&type=Handgun&Order=Powder&Source=
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MSgtEgress
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tyeo098 - I'll buy that blue dot from ya. Best powder I found for 357 Mag using 180g lead SWC's as well as Heavy 12ga Hunting loads
DanTheFarmer
Member
It seems like the OP is getting a pretty good spanking. I'm with everyone on sticking to published data here.
Let's add one more little bit of information though. Sometimes it is worthwhile giving the powder company a call to see if they can give a safe recommendation. I found a good load for my 7mm-08, 154 grain Hornady bullet, and Ramshot Hunter powder after calling them and following their recommendation. The load I developed wasn't listed in their on line manual but was at or below the recommended safe max the tech rep gave me. I've also got a 30TC. This isn't the most popular cartridge so if I want to try a new powder (say Alliant 2000-MR, a rather new powder) I might give them a call to see if my idea is safe. This less popular cartridge in a new-ish powder may be safe, just not tested/published yet.
Unfortunately for the OP, he is trying a well known cartridge with a very well known powder, where the powder is known to have more stringent limits than almost any other widely used powder. Stick to published data here. Don't try developing your own +P load data with Titegroup either!
Good Luck!
Dan
Let's add one more little bit of information though. Sometimes it is worthwhile giving the powder company a call to see if they can give a safe recommendation. I found a good load for my 7mm-08, 154 grain Hornady bullet, and Ramshot Hunter powder after calling them and following their recommendation. The load I developed wasn't listed in their on line manual but was at or below the recommended safe max the tech rep gave me. I've also got a 30TC. This isn't the most popular cartridge so if I want to try a new powder (say Alliant 2000-MR, a rather new powder) I might give them a call to see if my idea is safe. This less popular cartridge in a new-ish powder may be safe, just not tested/published yet.
Unfortunately for the OP, he is trying a well known cartridge with a very well known powder, where the powder is known to have more stringent limits than almost any other widely used powder. Stick to published data here. Don't try developing your own +P load data with Titegroup either!
Good Luck!
Dan
Lennyjoe
Member
Lots of good feedback above.
Take it as a lessons learned and not negative condemnation.
Welcome aboard THR and the reloading world.
Take it as a lessons learned and not negative condemnation.
Welcome aboard THR and the reloading world.
-hangs head in shame- Now that I have been thoroughly whipped i guess I'll save the rest of the winchester for my .357. I still have no idea why my loads seem to be on the slow side. With 8.2gr of longshot I should be in the neighborhood of 1150 fps but instead I'm around 800. Any thoughts? average case length of .988 and OAL of 1.25 +- .01, charge weight 8.3 +- .1gr.
gamestalker
member
Ok, so you've got some Longshot, now we can start with something to assist you with. I happen to love Longshot, for this cartridge, and a host of others.
So, what weight and type of bullet are you loading?
GS
So, what weight and type of bullet are you loading?
GS
ArchAngelCD
Member.
I agree, we need to know what bullet you are using and the weight.
Also, you said the load "should" be ~1150 fps. Where are you getting that number? If you're getting that from the load manual, forget it! They use very long test barrels under lab conditions. In the real world we never get the velocities in the books...
Also, you said the load "should" be ~1150 fps. Where are you getting that number? If you're getting that from the load manual, forget it! They use very long test barrels under lab conditions. In the real world we never get the velocities in the books...
SSN Vet
Member
welcome to the forum every man...
I like your handle.... reminds me of a Rich Mullins song.
I like your handle.... reminds me of a Rich Mullins song.
tyeo098
Member
Nonononono.
If you want to see throughly whipped, go read my thread here: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=723304
On multiple occasions I was harassed for doing something people do all the time
In this thread you were simply guided in the right direction (from what I read) nobody called you a danger to yourself and everyone within a 10 mile radius.
firefighter_emt
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As far as your velocities being lower than published, it could have a little to do with the temperature. I doubt that you have the same problem as I do being that you are in Wisconsin and I am in South Georgia.
f4tweet
Member
Published data
If you want to see how powder amounts have changed, find some reloading books from the 80's or 90's, and look at the powder amounts compared to today.
If you want to see how powder amounts have changed, find some reloading books from the 80's or 90's, and look at the powder amounts compared to today.
It's only about 70*F this time of year. I'm thinking of SLOWLY upping the charge to see if I can speed things up a bit. I have also heard not to crimp straight cased auto rounds, could that be affecting my speed and accuracy. I love PMC through my pistol because it is like a laser almost. Kinda want to match or exceed that with my own.
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