Winchester White Box LC 5.56 M193 not crimped?

[westernrover]

I've started processing some Winchester White Box LC 5.56 M193 that I bought new and fired. This was the WWB that came on the stripper clips and that I bought new last summer. I bought a Lee primer swaging die to remove the crimps I was expecting to find. I don't see staked primers, but I do see a ring that assumed was a ring crimp. However, my Lee die didn't seem to be doing anything (the press lever had no resistance), so I tried priming a case and the primer went right in. Then I tried priming a case that I had not swaged, and it popped right in too.

I've never dealt with crimped primers before. I suspect if these cases were crimped, priming the case would be very difficult. Since it is not at all, is it safe to conclude that these cases are not crimped?

I post pics in a little bit.

 

[Blue68f100]

You may have some ammo that failed to meet mil spec the reason it was sold to the public. The ring is the crimp, if not enough, it will not hold the primer in, so it's easy to install new ones. You confirmed it's not needed to swage back out so it saves you a step in the brass prep.

 

[westernrover]

Here's some examples. The ring is pretty distinct, but doesn't seem to interfere with inserting new primers.

I wonder how much resistance I should feel or how much force I should use with the Lee Ram Swage die on my press. Like I wrote earlier, it just feels like I'm doing nothing.

 

[9mmepiphany]

Here's some examples. The ring is pretty distinct, but doesn't seem to interfere with inserting new primers.

I wonder how much resistance I should feel or how much force I should use with the Lee Ram Swage die on my press. Like I wrote earlier, it just feels like I'm doing nothing.

It doesn't look like you've even touched the crimp ring. Usually a swaging rod will have pressed the metal smooth.

Do you have a primer pocket Go-No Go gauge?

If you don't, another avenue you could try is to adjust the swage rod further and further into the primer pocket until the ring disappears or you bottom out.
Disclaimer: I don't have a Lee Swaging die, but the swaging setup on my Lee APP is adjustable for depth of swage as are the swaging systems of my Apex-10 and my Hornady LNL AP

 

[tmd16556]

Those crimps don’t take a lot of force to swage out, but I suspect under crimping is how those ended up in Winchester boxes.

 

[Heir Kommt Die Sonne]

Here is my experience with loading crimped primers;
Yes you can do it. My first batch of .308 was like this. Didn't figure I had a means to decrimp them (now I just use the chamfer tool and it works just as well) so I went ahead and primed them anyway. There was alot of resistance as the primer went in. Felt like the ends of the primer were cut off as it seated, and on a few of them yes it was cut off. Most of them I was careful enough they seated. Just alot of firm resistance (in context of what seating a primer usually has).
It doesn't sound like yours were properly crimped. And possibly the pockets are out of spec for normal primer pockets. What do you mean when you say 'it feels like I'm doing nothing'? Seating a primer has a small amount of force to it, and you give some pressure to seat it. A small amount, but there is some pressure to be felt. If you feel none at all then something else may be wrong with them.

 

[westernrover]

I finished prepping about 100 cases and eventually I ran into a few that wouldn't take primers. At a certain point, I just ram-swaged the rest of them. I found that I had to adjust my Lee ram-swage die down a lot farther than the instructions say. I think they say 1/4 turn past the backing rod contact. Maybe I misunderstand it.

Anyway, after I swaged the pockets pretty good, I could see some fine brass shaved off and the primers slip right in. There's no crunch or pop, but the slide in smooth. Now I worry they're too loose. I won't fret too much. I'm moving on to charging cases tomorrow.

 

[westernrover]

...What do you mean when you say 'it feels like I'm doing nothing'? Seating a primer has a small amount of force to it, and you give some pressure to seat it. A small amount, but there is some pressure to be felt. If you feel none at all then something else may be wrong with them.

I meant when I was using the Lee Ram Swage die it felt like it was doing nothing. There was no resistance. It turns out that was either because the brass wasn't crimped sufficiently (most of the pieces) or because I hadn't screwed the die down hard enough.

My press cams over. I think I might need to adjust this die so it doesn't cam over but pushes the spring down on the little swaging base instead.

 

[Charlie98]

You may have some ammo that failed to meet mil spec the reason it was sold to the public. The ring is the crimp, if not enough, it will not hold the primer in, so it's easy to install new ones. You confirmed it's not needed to swage back out so it saves you a step in the brass prep.

At a certain point, I just ram-swaged the rest of them.

I would opine that most of the LC ammo on the market today is product that was rejected for one reason or another... that it did not meet contractual requirements. Improperly applied primer crimp would be one of those, I'm sure.

While the temptation is to not waste the time removing the crimp... you might as well just do it so it will be done, and avoid any surprises on the press when you are trying to load.

 

[Palladan44]

View attachment 1192670
Here's some examples. The ring is pretty distinct, but doesn't seem to interfere with inserting new primers.

I wonder how much resistance I should feel or how much force I should use with the Lee Ram Swage die on my press. Like I wrote earlier, it just feels like I'm doing nothing.

My experience is quite different, and even if 1 out of 100 has a chance of folding a primer, I'll ream them all anyways.