Worst production 1911?

[savanahsdad]

heck ,, just put Doug Turnbull in place of it ,, LOL

 

[Taurus 617 CCW]

I had the miserable experience of working on one of these and I got the impression that it was made in a hurry. The parts did not feel like quality and there were many rough edges left inside the gun that should have been removed by a respectable company.

 

[whoamiwhoareu]

My vote was definitely Llama. Attempted to shoot a friends Llama and what a terrible terrible gun. At least it made a great paperweight.

 

[kBob]

Wow. Looks like over a quarter of folk responding at this point are un impressed with Momma Llama.

Me either.


-kBob

 

[stoky]

Norinco belongs on this list.
With the exception of .38 Super, who says whatever about what's best for overblown cartridges should have nothing to do with anything IMO.

 

[Thermactor]

I put in a note on the first post asking to replace DW with Norinco to get some of you Norinco voters on the map.

 

[Zerodefect]

Who names a gun company "Llama" anyways? That's the first red flag. If I start building AR15's for sale under the name "The Great Alpaca", I'm not going to sell jack.

Might be a good brand name for my gun lube?

 

[dogtown tom]

Zerodefect Who names a gun company "Llama" anyways?

Llama= "Flame" in Spanish......a very reasonable name for a gun company.

But who names a gun company after:
Baby horseys? Colt
Large black cats? DPMS Panther Arms
Birds? Nighthawk, Phoenix
Deer? Stag
Undomesticated Native Americans? Savage
Cows? Taurus
Snakes? Bushmaster
Chipmunks? Chipmunk Rifles
Flowers? Daisy
Children's toys? Marble Arms
Large nails? Spikes
Trees? Palmetto
Rhinoceros? Rhino Arms
Fruit? Plum Crazy

 

[stoky]

I want to shoot my Llama
from Peru to Texarkana
I gonna shoot it good
in my old neighborhood
I say it's old, but it's good
like any other primitive would
<sorry Neil>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3aYTWv2rhDA

 

[Thermactor]

Or Zastava, named after the horrible car!
Same with Yugo

 

[tarosean]

A number of the choices are not even produced anymore.....

 

[Thermactor]

A lot of them aren't. But the memories remain. AMT's hardballer scarred many people for life in the 80s and 90s.

 

[bannockburn]

I voted AMT as their Hardballer was one of the worst assembled guns I have ever worked on. Llama runs a close second and Essex comes in third.

 

[Zerodefect]

Llama= "Flame" in Spanish......a very reasonable name for a gun company.

But who names a gun company after:
Baby horseys? Colt
Large black cats? DPMS Panther Arms
Birds? Nighthawk, Phoenix
Deer? Stag
Undomesticated Native Americans? Savage
Cows? Taurus
Snakes? Bushmaster
Chipmunks? Chipmunk Rifles
Flowers? Daisy
Children's toys? Marble Arms
Large nails? Spikes
Trees? Palmetto
Rhinoceros? Rhino Arms
Fruit? Plum Crazy

I guess I will market my lube as "Alpaca Arms Lube". "The Great Alpaca's Gun Lube", seems kinda long.

 

[LeonCarr]

Llama, with AMT a close second.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

 

[Coyote3855]

Llama. Never owned, but I worked on a commander sized owned by a friend. Easy choice. Had a Norinco I should have kept. Years ago, Wilson would work only on Colts and Norincos. I assumed that meant they were decent guns.

 

[Thermactor]

I have no experience with Norinco guns but what I've read about them says that they're highly desirable. There has to be a reason they are being used as race guns and are being used in competitions.

 

[george burns]

Not that I am loving Para, but they were one of the first frames used by many for hi-capacity 45 caliber guns, way back when. I believe that also have had ups and downs, as I owned a 1990's P13, in alloy, that was a great shooter and never had a problem with feeding anything.
So unless they went to crap since then, I think it can be said that most of these company's other than the more recent and more expensive ones have had their ups and downs over the years.

 

[blueskyjaunte]

Kimber is the only brand of 1911s that I have gotten rid of with prejudice (i.e., will never ever buy one again). It never ran right and my attempts to contact the factory were met with hostility and rudeness.

I did own a Para Super Hawg - had no problems with it, but I shot it so infrequently that I got rid of it. Para's irrelevant now, since they officially no longer exist.

 

[Old Dog]

Then again, some of us have had several perfect Kimbers ... My recently retired TLE II was one of my go-to 1911s for many years. Below is one of my favorites, a cute little CDP Pro that's never malfunctioned, has a sweet trigger and is more than acceptably accurate.


Clark's bash-list of guns not to be used as a base for customizing really has really very little to do with how well some of these pistols might function in the hands of a dedicated owner who knows how to maintain the platform and doesn't shoot huge quantities of ammo through his guns.

 

[3GunEric]

I have not really been focusing on .45acp for some time. Been working on 3 gun gear and sticking with 9mm Sigs.

I have a Kimber Custom Classic that I got way back when they first came out.

It has been great in every way. What has happened to Kimber to get the negative press?

 

[Zerodefect]

Then again, some of us have had several perfect Kimbers ... My recently retired TLE II was one of my go-to 1911s for many years. Below is one of my favorites, a cute little CDP Pro that's never malfunctioned, has a sweet trigger and is more than acceptably accurate.


Clark's bash-list of guns not to be used as a base for customizing really has really very little to do with how well some of these pistols might function in the hands of a dedicated owner who knows how to maintain the platform and doesn't shoot huge quantities of ammo through his guns.

Don't want to pick on you. Just use your post as an example. Is that pic old?

'Cause I don't see a scratch on that thing. Most of the "my Kimber/Springfield/Taurus 1911's runs fine" people hand me a gun that's a safe queen. Then we get into some real training and it's failure city.

It took a ton of work to get my Kimber CDP Custom II combat reliable. Now it's a beast. A rusty beast, but an accurate reliable 1911 now.

FP safety-removed (mine was mistimed and failed regularly)
ramp-polished (FTRTB)
barrel- throat polished (still rides hard on the lugs though)
mag- Wilson (FTRTB)
MSH -Ed Brown
MSP- EB
MS- EB
Leaf spring- Wilson
Thumb safety-EB (broken)
Pins- EB
Trigger kit- C&S

etc. etc.

 

[tipoc]

... I just lifted the poll options from the list of guns that are specifically recommended AGAINST by Clark Custom Guns.

This isn't a list of "bad guns". Others pointed it out but it's for Clark's conversions to 460 Rowland:

Q: Are there any other guns that you specifically DO NOT recommend for the 460 Rowland?
A: YES! We do not recommend this kit for installation in
Metro Arms American Classic
Dan Wesson
Armscor
STI Spartan
Tisas ZIG
IAI (Israeli Arms International) - We've found the top lugs in the slides of the Philipines produced 1911s to be soft! We've not tested the Israeli made guns but would recommend extreme caution.
Rock Island Armory
Auto Ordnance
Taurus
Llama
AMT
Charles Daly
Essex
Remington Rand
Any "GI" 1911 (pre-50s / spot heat treated)

Some of these guns the steel is not properly heat treated or the design of the frames is not for the conversion. Remington Rand has not made a gun since the Second World War, they made sewing machines and calculators. Don't confuse them with the rifle makers, Remington which make a modern 1911.

Clark's does have a list of guns they favor for the conversion. You can find those here...

http://www.clarkcustomguns.com/rowland.htm#faq

Preferred Platform List
Available for the following
government size 1911 style pistols . . .
Springfield Armory
Colt Government
Para Ordnance Expert
Remington 1911 R1
Kimber
Sig Sauer
Colt Gold Cup / Enhanced
Smith & Wesson
Norinco

Fits Government Model length only with 5" barrel
Get Yours TODAY!
If your 1911 style pistol is not on the above list, please check out our FAQs before calling.

They explain the differences on their website.

tipoc

 

[Zerodefect]

Ok, well that makes way more sense.

Kimbers have weird Swartz safeties and slimmer slides, so machining those isn't cool.

Dan Wesson is Stainless Steel, so there's that.

Remington Rands can't even be fired without crumbling in dust. Machining on them would be a nightmare.

LoLz.

 

[tipoc]

Kimber is on the list of guns accepted for the conversion. The conversion is just a drop in. No machining involved. You just need a strong slide and frame. They spell that out at the Clark website.

tipoc