What?
Would you prefer to store powder outdoors or load it and store ammo outdoors?
- Thread starter CQB45ACP
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CQB45ACP
Member
Small portable/camper type electric refrigerator/cooler on a looong extension cord in the shed is a new thought.
barnfrog
Member
Well, I'm an inveterate and incorrigible picker of nits. Unwilling and unable are two very different things to me.
Your question is whether it's better to store the powder in its original containers or to transfer it to smaller containers capped at each end with a bullet and a primer and store it that way. I don't think there is a significant difference in the outcome.
Maybe hedge your bet: load half of it and store as ammo and store the other half on original containers.
barnfrog
Member
I was going to suggest something similar, but thought if you had the option of electricity then climate control of the shed would not have been ruled out.
ETA: probably less expensive to just cool the storage cabinet (i.e. fridge) than the whole shed.
CQB45ACP
Member
Hey nit picking is also known as attention to detail and I appreciate it, thanks.
Unwilling and unable are two different things that both apply in this instance. I don’t want to blame or criticize my wife for having a different opinion on this issue—there’s too much of that in this world today—so I just leave it at unwilling and unable.
I like the hedge your bet approach and will do that along with bits and pieces of others...the smaller the refrigerator I end up needing the cheaper it’ll be to purchase and run.
Lennyjoe
Member
Don’t have a gun safe? I store in my gun safe downstairs and even have some lbs out in the open since the safe is plum full. No worries here on that…
Jim Watson
Member
My powder is at present in my attached shop.
It didn't blow up or even burn when the previous house burned out. Neither did my whisky.
I have quit worrying about it.
.
CQB45ACP
Member
One shed is about 300 feet from house thus no power after all these years. A smaller shed is 100 feet and I had an extension cord to it once but was chewed through by squirrels.
CQB45ACP
Member
Yeah we all have risk tolerances.
CQB45ACP
Member
Nope.
gwpercle
Member
Heat encourages the break down of gun powder and it realy doesn't matter if it is loaded in a case or in the original container .
I would keep it in the container so that I could inspect it for red dust and acrid smell that decomposing powder exhibits just before loading up enough ammo to see me through 3-4 months ... and when/if it starts showing signs ... stop reloading with it .
I would hate to have many thousand rounds loaded and the powder starts "going bad " in those cases .
If your shed has an electrical outlet , pick up an old refrigerator and store the powder in the refrigerator , set on low ... it will keep the powder cool .
Actually this is a safe way to store powder inside a house ... the powder is in a insulated steel container and most have a sturdy latch . I have never heard of powder igniting in a refrigerator . No electricity ... just lock the door and the insulated case should help stabilize heat & temperature swing .
For 50 years I have stored powder inside my house on a closet shelf or two , I usualy keep 15 - 1 lb. containers and have 1- 8 lb caddy in my lttle hoard and when powder is kept in it's factory container it is safe ...it will burn but will not explode like a bomb .
Gasoline and black powder are much more dangerous .
Gary
I would keep it in the container so that I could inspect it for red dust and acrid smell that decomposing powder exhibits just before loading up enough ammo to see me through 3-4 months ... and when/if it starts showing signs ... stop reloading with it .
I would hate to have many thousand rounds loaded and the powder starts "going bad " in those cases .
If your shed has an electrical outlet , pick up an old refrigerator and store the powder in the refrigerator , set on low ... it will keep the powder cool .
Actually this is a safe way to store powder inside a house ... the powder is in a insulated steel container and most have a sturdy latch . I have never heard of powder igniting in a refrigerator . No electricity ... just lock the door and the insulated case should help stabilize heat & temperature swing .
For 50 years I have stored powder inside my house on a closet shelf or two , I usualy keep 15 - 1 lb. containers and have 1- 8 lb caddy in my lttle hoard and when powder is kept in it's factory container it is safe ...it will burn but will not explode like a bomb .
Gasoline and black powder are much more dangerous .
Gary
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barnfrog
Member
If you're handy, it probably wouldn't cost that much to run a dedicated underground circuit to the shed from your panel. Would save you from repeatedly replacing lead cords. Even just burying the extension cord in conduit would thwart your neighborhood nefarious nut scroungers. Might not meet code, but....
kalielkslayer
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The suggestion to keep the powder unloaded so you can actually see/smell it is a good one.
But there were several more great ideas.
But you failed to mention your climate. Some costal climates only have a 20 degree temperature swing most days, but those are usually wet climates.
My climate has winter lows are anywhere from -20 to 40 degrees. Not a problem for powder. But in the summer my average temperature swing is 45+ degrees a day, topping out between 90-100. Not good for powder.
The storage inside an old freezer or frig will minimize the temperature swings. Some type of oxygen remover would help further.
Where I live there is a “swap shop” on the radio where people swap goods and services. There are Facebook pages too. I can get an old freezer or frig anybweek for less than $100, sometimes, “Just haul it away.” The local landfill gets old freezers/fridges. They don’t work but if they seal, that’s all you really need.
Powder in an ice chest, with oxygen remover. Then set the ice chest inside an old chest freezer. Betting the temperature swing will be less than 20 degrees a day.
But there were several more great ideas.
But you failed to mention your climate. Some costal climates only have a 20 degree temperature swing most days, but those are usually wet climates.
My climate has winter lows are anywhere from -20 to 40 degrees. Not a problem for powder. But in the summer my average temperature swing is 45+ degrees a day, topping out between 90-100. Not good for powder.
The storage inside an old freezer or frig will minimize the temperature swings. Some type of oxygen remover would help further.
Where I live there is a “swap shop” on the radio where people swap goods and services. There are Facebook pages too. I can get an old freezer or frig anybweek for less than $100, sometimes, “Just haul it away.” The local landfill gets old freezers/fridges. They don’t work but if they seal, that’s all you really need.
Powder in an ice chest, with oxygen remover. Then set the ice chest inside an old chest freezer. Betting the temperature swing will be less than 20 degrees a day.
This implies that storing powder in a house in another method is unsafe. But then adding a sturdy latch turns your refrigerator into an unsafe storage container (same as with a safe that is latched/locked)
Remember powder burns really fast, it doesn't explode, its need containment to build up pressure, that is how it propels the bullet down the barrel, the pressure build up behind it. So storing powder in a latched container or gun safe would allow it to build up pressure to possibly unsafe levels.
But go to the source: https://saami.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/Info-Doc-Smokeless-Powder.pdf
Anyway for my two cents on the original question, storing it outdoors either in the container or loaded will most likely require being placed inside another container which is sealed/latched which could then allow pressure build up and rupture the container with explosive force. The safest place is, as the saami.org document from the manufacturers indoors in 1" thick wood container which is allowed to open to allow pressure to escape so it will only burn and not build pressure. If your most worried about fire put your powder box near an outer wall/corner where it can burn somewhat outward should the house catch fire.
barnfrog
Member
Propane powered fridge?
shoobe01
Member
First recommendation I'd give to a friend:
You don't get to reload anymore. At least not for now.
Seriously. Seen it happen for several hobbies. Maybe it comes back later. Maybe sometime you can find a friend (or business) who can loan you space, you store all there, go load every few weeks or months (seen that also, again not just for firearms related stuff like loading).
(Also seen people reload in things like storage units, but that's very against their rules so not a great suggestion as violating the rules can have pretty bad consequences, but as an example of how far afield people go to pursue their hobbies when kicked out of the house or... whatever is up with "unwilling").
Not environmentally controlled is a very broad range. Also saying that it cannot be changed is... a weird limit. Put the shed under trees (or add trees around it. Add a second roof (attics are there for a reason, sheds don't have them but can). Add roof venting (solar ones are cheap to add on), add actual air conditioning (dehumidifier plus avoiding full sun is likely enough) or heating, and don't say you can't because you can trench, add solar, etc. Change from shed to dig an underground next to it. Cellars for storage existed for a reason and for all we know you are rural enough you can get a neighbor to scoop out a hole, dump an old panel van in there and fill it back over. Environmental control!
You don't get to reload anymore. At least not for now.
Seriously. Seen it happen for several hobbies. Maybe it comes back later. Maybe sometime you can find a friend (or business) who can loan you space, you store all there, go load every few weeks or months (seen that also, again not just for firearms related stuff like loading).
(Also seen people reload in things like storage units, but that's very against their rules so not a great suggestion as violating the rules can have pretty bad consequences, but as an example of how far afield people go to pursue their hobbies when kicked out of the house or... whatever is up with "unwilling").
Not environmentally controlled is a very broad range. Also saying that it cannot be changed is... a weird limit. Put the shed under trees (or add trees around it. Add a second roof (attics are there for a reason, sheds don't have them but can). Add roof venting (solar ones are cheap to add on), add actual air conditioning (dehumidifier plus avoiding full sun is likely enough) or heating, and don't say you can't because you can trench, add solar, etc. Change from shed to dig an underground next to it. Cellars for storage existed for a reason and for all we know you are rural enough you can get a neighbor to scoop out a hole, dump an old panel van in there and fill it back over. Environmental control!
AJC1
Member
Given that senerio I would burry the powder container to try and moderate as much as possible. Bullets are expensive so ruining them and primers is a non option to me.
Bazoo
Member
I’d store powder and not ammo. No reason it cannot be reasonably comfortable. A cooler, on the ground, away from the wall, out of sunlight, would be sufficient I’d think. Add some extra insulation around it. Maybe a plywood box that also was insulated, so to give the most gradual temperature changes.
Better would be a hole in the ground for the cooler, with plywood over it. That would really control the temperature.
Better would be a hole in the ground for the cooler, with plywood over it. That would really control the temperature.
redcon1
member
Could you put it underground somehow? In some kind of a secure hole? It sounds stupid but it seems like it would be better than a garden shed that might regularly see temperatures in the hundreds at least from the perspective of maximizing the shelf life of the powder. I think in the winter, you might be all right in the garden shed but the summer heat would promote decomposition. Animals burrow into the ground for a reason. As far as ammo vs bottles, I don't think it will matter if the temperature is regularly high but that's a guess.
CQB45ACP
Member
Not sure why you’re saying I don’t currently do it right. I reload in my work shop in the basement and as of recently keep just one pound of powder in the house at a time. My new powder storage dilemma doesn’t change anything other than useful life of the powder.
CQB45ACP
Member
Makes little sense.
nettlle
Contributing Member
Heat and humidity is bad for primers and powder. I reload in my garage but keep my primers and powder in the house. I understand your reasoning for not wanting to keep the powder in the house. There is really no easy alternative.
shoobe01
Member
Ah, we're all stupid. Noted.
I'm out.
I'm out.
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