.38 Special Snub + HS-6

[Airgead]

Hello all, long-time lurker...

Does anyone have any first-hand experience loading .38 Special with HS-6 for a snub-nose (Ruger LCR)? Bullets are Hornady XTP 110gr. I've tried some lighter loads for practice/plinking in 7.2gr and 7.4gr. The results were very erratic at 10-15 yards (entirely missing a standard pistol target erratic) and I had a lot of unburned powder. I've read online people speculating on everything from stronger crimps to more powder to load at the +P end of the spectrum to people saying that's just how HS-6 is and it isn't the best for .38 Special. But I don't seem to find any solid "do this" results that work, especially in a short barrel - seems like a lot of speculation without much follow-up on real results. I'm not aiming for laser-precision -- I know I'm not going to get that out of a snub-nose. But hitting a standard target in a reasonable grouping seems like a decent goal. Any thoughts?

 

[billybob44]

First steps..

Due to HS-6 being one of those powders that NEED a good 'Flash' to light up, I would start by using a Small Pistol MAGNUM prmer. If you happen?? to have any standard Small Rifle primers around, try 10 or 20 of them first.

Be sure that you have a HEAVY roll crimp to hold the projectile into case until all of that HS-6 is burned.

Last you MAY?? bump up your charge?? Hodgdons Data sheet shows 8.4gr. for +P on the 110gr XTP.

If none of this helps, go for a faster burn powder..Bill.

 

[Rule3]

I am sure ARCH will be along to add to this thread. He sprinkles HS6 on his morning cereal!

 

[gamestalker]

Hi there Airgead. I have an extensive history of loading those exact components as my exclusive load for a good number of years for 38 spcl.. I have now switched to Longshot, but not because hS6 didn't perform excellent, just that I found another powder that filled another nitch.

The data below was loaded and tested from K frame .357 mag snubs, Ruger SP101, and a few other's, all .357's. Not knowing what firearm you'll be loading for I always recommend starting with a safe reasonable start charge. The good part is HS6 has a good long load table.

110 gr. XTP's
7.0 - 7.8 - This is standard non +P data.
8.4 grs. HS6 - This load is published as a max +P load Hodgdon.

I've loaded just about every charge from the 7.0 grs. to a charge I won't state here on the forum. In this regard I find HS6 very easy to load 38 spcl with. For me, it performed best and produced most consistent velocities when worked up to the higher end, good stuff.

Use a full roll crimp, doesn't have to be excessive, just good and stout. And this isn't as much for consistent ignition, but rather to prevent the bullets from defeating the crimp and jump out of the case mouths, I've had it happen.

Good luck, and I expect you'll have some good results. Below is an example of how I work up with HS6 according to my load logs. I used the start charge of (7.0 grs. ), well the old data I had may have been different, but to continue, I used the start charge to provide me with what the lowest pressure load looked like, and performed like as a baseline. I start a load by loading just a few, 2 or 3 if your trying to conserve on testing components. Then do a couple more with 7.4 grs., a couple more with a 7.6 gr. charge, a couple more at 7.8 grs., and drop to .1 gr. increments from this point up, if going any higher is even necessary according to the results you get. And just because the above is how I do it, doesn't mean you can't decrease the increments, and definitely stop when you feel you have a good load. It just isn't necessary to continue working up if you've located a good performing load that's to your liking.

If it turns out that HS6 works well for ya, you might also like Longshot, as it also produces good jacketed performance.

GS

 

[ArchAngelCD]

IMO HS-6 is too slow a powder for use in standard pressure .38 Special ammo especially with light bullets. I use only HS-6 for making .38 Special +P ammo and IMO it's a very good choice for making an FBI replica load. I highly suggest you use a Magnum strength primer with HS-6, it will probably cure your unburnt powder problem unless you are loading extremely light charges. Like most powders HS-6 will perform better near the upper pressure limits but it's especially true with HS-6...

Hope that helps a little.

 

[USSR]

Agree with AACD, too slow of a powder for .38 Spl. I have used it in .357 Magnum loads using a SRP and it works OK for that application.

Don

 

[RealGun]

Magnum primers with same loads. Then go from there.

 

[Airgead]

Thanks for the thoughts and information. I was planning on moving up through 7.6 - 8.4 as some test rounds based on Hornady 9th Ed. so hopefully I'll see the better results as I get up to the top end. Just wasn't sure if it was worth the effort. I don't yet have the confidence to swap in magnum primers - something I need to work on. Guess .38spcl is a good round to try that on perhaps.

I bought HS-6 on a whim about 4 months ago because it was what was available but didn't have any real experience with it. I thought it would fill the "universal power" niche for my handgun calibers similar to Unique. I got discouraged after the .38spcl results and put it back on the shelf for awhile and never tried in .357mag or .40S&W.

 

[rcmodel]

I don't yet have the confidence to swap in magnum primers

It should not take any confidence to switch to Mag primers with HS-6.

I wouldn't have the confidence Not Too.

rc

 

[USSR]

Yes, magnum primers are not thermonuclear devices. And contrary to what is commonly thought, the powder used more often dictates whether their use is warranted, rather than the head stamp on the cartridge case.

Don

 

[RealGun]

Think of magnum primers as a longer burn rather than a larger detonation.

 

[Airgead]

I've always been hesitant to swap because my understanding has always been that magnum primers boost the overall cartridge pressure. I'm rarely looking to push the limits of a cartridge. But thanks for all the info and feedback, I'll give the small magnums a try.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I've always been hesitant to swap because my understanding has always been that magnum primers boost the overall cartridge pressure. I'm rarely looking to push the limits of a cartridge. But thanks for all the info and feedback, I'll give the small magnums a try.

Using a magnum primers with hard to ignite ball powders like HS-6, HS-7 and W296/H110 can sometime drop the pressures. Standard primers can "sometimes" cause pressure spikes but not always. Your ES and SD numbers will drop, sometimes to single digits and the powder will berm more completely.

A magnum primer will not cause a nuclear explosion, they only burn slightly longer and slightly hotter than standard primers. Most times you only need to drop the powder charge .1gr to achieve the same velocity as when ignited with a standard primer. (sometimes) Just remember, the name magnum is really a large bottle of champagne and and up when it comes to ammo. Safety is very good but don't let marketing throw you off...

Are you anywhere near the Scranton area on Northeast PA?

 

[Airgead]

All good information about the use of magnum vs. standard primers. Thanks all. Once I get some loads worked up and tested I'll report back.

Are you anywhere near the Scranton area on Northeast PA?

Diagonally opposite - Pittsburgh area.

 

[gamestalker]

I'm definitely am on the same page as AACD, in that, upper end charges that get into the +P range perform very well, and have not needed magnum primers. But also based on my established history with HS6, I can see where a light load, or anything well below +P may benefit with a magnum primer. It's indeed a slow burner in 38 spcl., so it needs full tilt operating pressures to consistently and completely burn.

GS

 

[ArchAngelCD]

All good information about the use of magnum vs. standard primers. Thanks all. Once I get some loads worked up and tested I'll report back.

Are you anywhere near the Scranton area on Northeast PA?

Diagonally opposite - Pittsburgh area.

That's too bad, I was going to offer some time to show you the ropes but we are too far apart, sorry...