A Request: 5.7x28, FN lovers
- Thread starter SHusky57
- Start date
- Status
The problem was it didn't do the job after hitting his bicep. You can not always count on a nice frontal shot, or a shot that is not obstructed, one that doesn't hit bone or getting off multiple shots, etc. That is the point people seem to miss.
I have a PS90 and I like it but the PS90 is not a P90 and the civilian version lacks what makes the real deal what it is ie full auto and rounds that defeat body armor. The PS90 is a very fun gun, extremely accurate (my brother shot a jackrabbit from a measured 175 yds with the optical sight), and easy to shoot.
It puts a 40 grain bullet out there at 2000 FPS. My sub 2K will put a 115 grain bullet out at 1500 (and if you tune the loads uo you can do much better). These figures are based on what I have chronographed.
Based on shooting varmints I am not super impressed with the 5.7 round. I have not preformed detailed autopsies but the visual inspection indicates that other rounds are doing more damage. Their is a world of difference between what a the Ps90 does to a jackrabbit and what a .357 mag carbine does. The same can be said for the difference between a .223 and the 5.7. One kills them (although I have seen a few rabbits need a coup de grace after taking a 5.7 never seen that with a .357, 9mm or .223) the others blow them apart.
If some one were going to charge me from across the room with a knife right now I would probably opt for said lever gun or my Sub 2k over the Ps90 and I sure as heck would rather have a real rifle caliber or shotgun.
I do not doubt that the 5.7 could be used to defend ones self and has some very good attributes. However, I have even less doubt that there are much better choices for HD for most people. If the chips were really down why would you want the most marginal choice?
I own the AR-57 although I haven't done any testing with it. I shoot it because I enjoy shooting it, and because 50 rounds is nothing to sneeze at. Reloads are easy once you get used to doing them, but that's true of all of our new toys, isn't it?
Oh and 2000 rounds for 800 bucks makes for a good long weekend with ammo left over. Not much ammo, maybe a handful ..... LOL !
-K
Oh and 2000 rounds for 800 bucks makes for a good long weekend with ammo left over. Not much ammo, maybe a handful ..... LOL !
-K
SHusky57,
If you're looking for ambidexterous, the AR platform can be made plenty lefty-friendly with an ambi safety, a Norgon ambi-catch, and an extended charging handle latch. If you want a serious fighting gun (which it sounds like you do), I would steer you towards a right-handed upper from a top-tier maker (Colt, LMT, BCM, Noveske, etc.). This will get you some QC/QA procedures that you won't get from a mid-tier maker like Stag, which is piece of mind that is worth it during a zombie apocalypse. Also, should that zombie apocalypse ever happen, you're going to have a really hard time finding a replacement parts for a lefty gun if anything ever breaks. Just something to think about.
For the cost of a PS90 that you can't customize much, you can get a pretty nice AR and feed it some too.
If you're near Tulsa and want to get your hands on an AR that has been lefty-fied to see if you like it I might be able to help you out. Send me a PM if you're interested.
If you're looking for ambidexterous, the AR platform can be made plenty lefty-friendly with an ambi safety, a Norgon ambi-catch, and an extended charging handle latch. If you want a serious fighting gun (which it sounds like you do), I would steer you towards a right-handed upper from a top-tier maker (Colt, LMT, BCM, Noveske, etc.). This will get you some QC/QA procedures that you won't get from a mid-tier maker like Stag, which is piece of mind that is worth it during a zombie apocalypse. Also, should that zombie apocalypse ever happen, you're going to have a really hard time finding a replacement parts for a lefty gun if anything ever breaks. Just something to think about.
For the cost of a PS90 that you can't customize much, you can get a pretty nice AR and feed it some too.
If you're near Tulsa and want to get your hands on an AR that has been lefty-fied to see if you like it I might be able to help you out. Send me a PM if you're interested.
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Exactly! Someone at last finally realizes that I'm using humor in the form of a completely irrelevant argument! 
Truly though, even a .22lr is nothing to sneeze at as a defense round - and we all know it. No harm in stacking the odds in your favor, though!
Truly though, even a .22lr is nothing to sneeze at as a defense round - and we all know it. No harm in stacking the odds in your favor, though!
Maverick223
Member
Not to say that it couldn't be used for HD...just not my choice...and really limited for hunting roles as well.
Beyond the ballistics and whatnot, it is most definitely a gun to handle to see if you want to own it, even if you can't shoot it at the time.
I desperately wanted a PS90 and FN2k until I handled both - they're just too small for my frame and it makes for a frustrating ergonomic experience.
I desperately wanted a PS90 and FN2k until I handled both - they're just too small for my frame and it makes for a frustrating ergonomic experience.
Terminal balistic performance of 5.7 can be found here:
http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=19913
http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=19913
Eightball
Member
IMO, the M1 Carbine is a good replacement for the M1 Carbine, and between it and my 1911, I'm set for HD
IIRC, a well-loaded .30 Carbine is somewhere between a .357 and .44 Mag in power, but in a nice semi-auto platform for which you can get 30 round mags.That being said, the PS90s handling characteristics intrigue the heck out of me. There's a couple companies out there making rounds that seem to exceed the power rating of that one "LEO-only" round, I just forget their websites at the moment.
Maverick223
Member
Eightball, I agree there is no "better" replacement for the M1 Carbine...at least that I know of, and the best substitute is something akin to a lever rifle chambered for a pistol cartridge. A .357Mag. carbine is almost identical to the .30Carbine with regards to ballistics. I find it funny that many folks will complain about the .30Carbine, but everyone seems to think that the .357Mag. is a magical round. IMO manufacturers need to chamber the .30Carbine in new rifles, not the least of which should be a PS90...other guns that would seemingly be suitable to the cartridge is the mini 14/30 (duh, did they really not think of that?), an AR upper, and perhaps even a pistol (though OAL would likely be an issue).
desidog
Member
- Joined
- Nov 21, 2008
- Messages
- 2,595
I'm a lefty, and thought about the 5.7x28 and the PS90 as well....not too hard though. I have a 9mm CX4 that is configured all lefty, and i love it. My reasoning is as follows: CX4 is cheaper than PS90, ammunition is cheaper and easier to find, the CX4 takes the same mags as my 92FS- which i already had; also the CX4 has very little felt-recoil, and with a 30rd mag i can spool off and hold the sights on target, landing all on the paper in short order.
Both the PS90 and the CX4 are good-handling guns, but if you take them down, the CX4's internals are more straightforward, IMO, and cleaning is easier.
That being said, if i didn't have the Beretta 92FS, i would've gone with the CX4 in .40SW; and if i was an AR enthusiast, i'd probably get an AR57 upper (which ejects down the mag well). I think the numbers for buying an AR and an AR57 upper (essentially 2 guns/1 lower) is commensurate with buying a PS90...not equal, but same ball park....and if you want to shoot more than bunnies at short range, you will have the ability.
That being said, as most everyone on THR can attest, it's always fun to pick up a new gun...and there's always another model to look forward to....so don't necessarily look at this purchase as the last one. Guns are not like girlfriends; you can have more than one and leave them in the same place...they won't get jealous!
I'm sure you'll enjoy whatever you pick up. -Desi
Both the PS90 and the CX4 are good-handling guns, but if you take them down, the CX4's internals are more straightforward, IMO, and cleaning is easier.
That being said, if i didn't have the Beretta 92FS, i would've gone with the CX4 in .40SW; and if i was an AR enthusiast, i'd probably get an AR57 upper (which ejects down the mag well). I think the numbers for buying an AR and an AR57 upper (essentially 2 guns/1 lower) is commensurate with buying a PS90...not equal, but same ball park....and if you want to shoot more than bunnies at short range, you will have the ability.
That being said, as most everyone on THR can attest, it's always fun to pick up a new gun...and there's always another model to look forward to....so don't necessarily look at this purchase as the last one. Guns are not like girlfriends; you can have more than one and leave them in the same place...they won't get jealous!
I'm sure you'll enjoy whatever you pick up. -Desi
Here is some of our test data. The 5.7x28 can exceed 45acp+P energy. So the 9mm comparison is irrelevant even more since the 5.7 was requested by NATO as a replacement for the 9mm being useless against armor.
S4 ULTRA RAPTOR
FiveseveN Pistol 2,600fps - 391 Ft-Lb’s
P90 3,053fps - 560 Ft-Lb’s
PS90 3,340fps - 666 Ft-Lb’s
FsN USG Pistol 15 feet
5.7x28 ULTRA RAPTOR 10% 14"x6" gel block test
Control shot: .17cal BB 4.2" penetration
8.5" penetration, with 4.5" cavity measured at widest section.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQuhudjqmiI
FsN USG Pistol 15 feet
5.7x28 ULTRA RAPTOR Level II Vest 10% 14"x6" gel block test
Control shot: .17cal BB 4.2" penetration
Level ll vest shot: 8.0" penetration, with 3.3" cavity at widest section.
Complete separation of the core from the jacket.
The jacket has completely fragmented in to fine shrapnel.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmh4vw56Pn8
ProtecTOR
FiveseveN Pistol 2,092fps - 389 Ft-Lb’s
P90 2,538 fps - 572 Ft-Lb’s
PS90 2,762 fps - 678 Ft-Lb’s
FsN USG Pistol 15 feet
5.7x28 ProtecTOR 10% 13"x6" gel block test
Control shot.17cal BB 4.5" penetration
Penetrated all 13", and created 3.3" cavity measured at widest section.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JuvKWckwg8
FsN USG Pistol 15 feet
5.7x28 ProtecTOR level II Vest 10% gel test
Control shot.17cal BB 4.5" penetration
Penetration 9.0", and created 1.7" cavity measured at widest section
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elKgG2W6_N0
S4 ULTRA RAPTOR
FiveseveN Pistol 2,600fps - 391 Ft-Lb’s
P90 3,053fps - 560 Ft-Lb’s
PS90 3,340fps - 666 Ft-Lb’s
FsN USG Pistol 15 feet
5.7x28 ULTRA RAPTOR 10% 14"x6" gel block test
Control shot: .17cal BB 4.2" penetration
8.5" penetration, with 4.5" cavity measured at widest section.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQuhudjqmiI
FsN USG Pistol 15 feet
5.7x28 ULTRA RAPTOR Level II Vest 10% 14"x6" gel block test
Control shot: .17cal BB 4.2" penetration
Level ll vest shot: 8.0" penetration, with 3.3" cavity at widest section.
Complete separation of the core from the jacket.
The jacket has completely fragmented in to fine shrapnel.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmh4vw56Pn8
ProtecTOR
FiveseveN Pistol 2,092fps - 389 Ft-Lb’s
P90 2,538 fps - 572 Ft-Lb’s
PS90 2,762 fps - 678 Ft-Lb’s
FsN USG Pistol 15 feet
5.7x28 ProtecTOR 10% 13"x6" gel block test
Control shot.17cal BB 4.5" penetration
Penetrated all 13", and created 3.3" cavity measured at widest section.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JuvKWckwg8
FsN USG Pistol 15 feet
5.7x28 ProtecTOR level II Vest 10% gel test
Control shot.17cal BB 4.5" penetration
Penetration 9.0", and created 1.7" cavity measured at widest section
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elKgG2W6_N0
browningguy
Member
Also something to note for lefties is you can put the AR57 upper on an AR lower and then it's good for you too. Ejects straight down through the mag well. Mine shoots pretty decent although it is slightly muzzle heavy with the 50 rounder on top. I don't mind that but some people might not be used to it.
While I have 4 .223 semi autos, and a .50 Beowulf AR to go to first, I wouldn't feel under-armed with the AR57 upper and its 50 round mag.
While I have 4 .223 semi autos, and a .50 Beowulf AR to go to first, I wouldn't feel under-armed with the AR57 upper and its 50 round mag.
nwilliams
Member
I love my PS90 but mostly because I'm a huge fan of the Stargate television series
Personally I don't own a PS90 with the intention of using it as a PDW, I own it because it's an interesting gun, very fun and very accurate. However I will say that if the zombie apocalypse ever comes then I'll certainly grab my PS90 before anything else
Some people say they are too expensive however if you search around you can sometimes find PS90's for a very reasonable price, I got mine NIB off gunbroker for $1350 and was able to do a local pickup so I didn't have transfer it.
Also people like to complain about the cost of the round which I don't agree with. I can find ammo online for about 37¢ a round. Considering it's Hornady V-Max that's not a bad deal. The problem with 5.7 ammo is not that it's expensive, it's that there is a limited selection to choose from and no cheap Russian plinking stuff like you find in other calibers.
As far as the round goes I know there are better alternatives out there for sure but people have also been debating the effectiveness of the .223/5.56 for decades and there are still people out there that think that round is not an adequate man stopper. Small calibers will always stir up debate when it comes to combat and personal defense.
I appreciate FN for giving us a civilian model of their P90, no matter what anyone says I love my PS90!
Personally I don't own a PS90 with the intention of using it as a PDW, I own it because it's an interesting gun, very fun and very accurate. However I will say that if the zombie apocalypse ever comes then I'll certainly grab my PS90 before anything else
Some people say they are too expensive however if you search around you can sometimes find PS90's for a very reasonable price, I got mine NIB off gunbroker for $1350 and was able to do a local pickup so I didn't have transfer it.
Also people like to complain about the cost of the round which I don't agree with. I can find ammo online for about 37¢ a round. Considering it's Hornady V-Max that's not a bad deal. The problem with 5.7 ammo is not that it's expensive, it's that there is a limited selection to choose from and no cheap Russian plinking stuff like you find in other calibers.
As far as the round goes I know there are better alternatives out there for sure but people have also been debating the effectiveness of the .223/5.56 for decades and there are still people out there that think that round is not an adequate man stopper. Small calibers will always stir up debate when it comes to combat and personal defense.
I appreciate FN for giving us a civilian model of their P90, no matter what anyone says I love my PS90!
I would take homage and point out that there are many types of 5.7x28.
Here is our current non-restricted product line and brief descriptions.
IlluminaTOR Tracer
Our IlluminaTOR Tracer cartridge is loaded with a bright red* mil-spec tracer. When shot, the bullet provides the same velocity and point of impact as our 55-grain FMJ round, allowing the shooter to accurately adjust his or her point of aim during night fire. We’re so confident in our IlluminaTOR Tracer that we back each and every round with our unconditional performance guarantee. If our tracers ever fail to ignite when fired, simply contact us about a hassle-free replacement or refund.
Elite Ammunition's tracers help keep time on your side. The pyrotechnic tracer compound in each IlluminaTOR Tracer bullet boasts an impressive shelf life of ten (10) years.
QuieTOR Subsonic
Sleek, quiet, and undeniably effective – Our QuieTOR subsonic ammunition is not just the first choice amongst suppressed 5.7x28mm enthusiasts; but also arguably the most effective choice for law enforcement and military operators. When operational conditions call for a quiet response, trust the round QuieTOR above the rest.
Our steadfast commitment to producing truly elite ammunition is reflected in every detail of the QuieTOR subsonic cartridge. Our precision manufacturing process holds individual cartridge tolerances within a mere thousandth of an inch. Such tight tolerances help provide a predictable consistency with each pull of the trigger. Platform-specific powder charges are carefully engineered to minimize recoil, maximize ballistic performance, enhance operator safety, and increase weapon reliability.
It is our strict adherence to quality control standards that allows us to guarantee true subsonic performance from every QuieTOR we sell.
Choose from QuieTOR cartridges loaded specifically for the FN Five seveN pistol, P90 PDW / PS90 SBR, or the PS90 carbine. Combined with a modern 5.7x28mm suppressor, QuieTOR subsonic ammunition
Important Note: Elite ammunition does not recommend or endorse shooting into occupied structures or in areas prohibited by law. Elite Ammunition disclaims any liability as a result of the use of our ammunition.
VarminaTOR
Elite proudly presents the VarminTOR 5.7x28mm high-performance small game round. Assembled using the renowned Barnes Varmint Grenade and propelled by a generous powder charge, the VarminTOR rockets past our chronographs at 2,100 fps* when fired from the FN Five seveN pistol!
The VarminTOR’s unique design balances high speed with match-grade accuracy and remarkable expansion properties. Upon impact, the bullet expands dramatically into small fragments, typically resulting in instant incapacitation. It is also important to note that these bullet fragments rarely exit the animal, avoiding damage to the game’s valuable pelt. Whether varmint hunting is your hobby, your profession, or simply your contribution to pest control, you can depend on the VarminTOR to get the job done!
*Velocity is quoted for the 5" Five seven pistol barrel, add 50 fps per additional inch of barrel
ProtecTOR Personal Defense
When fired from the FN Five seveN pistol, the ProtecTOR reaches 2,400 feet per second and able to impart more than 350 foot-pounds of energy on target. With the use of an FN P90 or PS90, bullet speeds increase by several hundreds of feet per second, outperforming many similarly sized 5.56x45mm weapons.
Astounding ballistic performance makes the ProtecTOR one of Elite’s most popular offerings. The cartridge design delivers the optimal level of penetration against a would-be attacker--while significantly reducing the risk of over-penetration when fired indoors. Gelatin tests conducted with a Five seveN handgun generated overwhelming hydrostatic shock effects and stunning elastic wound channels. The results revealed our ProtecTOR rivaled the stopping power of larger rifle calibers, while remaining safer than most pistol rounds in terms of material penetration and potential for ricochets.
When your family’s safety depends on you, depend on the ProtecTOR from Elite Ammunition.
Important Note: Elite ammunition does not recommend or endorse shooting into occupied structures or on areas prohibited by law. Elite Ammunition disclaims any liability as a result of the use of our ammunition
PenetraTOR Tac-Op
The PenetraTOR is heaviest supersonic 5.7x28mm round commercially available. Loaded with our special 55-grain FMJ. The PenetraTOR has been extensively tested, in the lab and in the field.
Our standard PenetraTOR is the most accurate cartridge in our catalog, capable of sub-1-inch groups at 25 yards out of the Five seveN’s 5-inch barrel*! Out of the P90 or PS90, the 2300+ feet-per-second bullet is more actually than most ever thought the platform was capable of.
Ideal for law enforcement, military personnel, varmint shooters, mid-sized game hunters, and even competition shooters–the PenetraTOR’s performance and versatility will surely leave you questioning how you ever got along without! **
* Accuracy was measured by averaging 3-10 shot groups from a Five-seveN pistol at 25 yards, held in a machine rest. Your results may vary.
** Shot-placement is the most important variable when confronted with dangerous situations and you should not rely solely on the performance of ammunition for your safety. As with all shootings, shot placement is the most important aspect of wound ballistics; far above projectile choice.
X-TerminaTOR Hunting Cartridge
ou asked for it, and we've delivered.
Our most popular "Off Catalogue" cartridge is now available for purchase without placing a special order. The Elite Ammunition X-TerminaTOR.
This cartridges pushes a 45 grain Barnes TSX FB bullet at more than 1,900 fps from the pistol (375 Ft.Lbs of energy), and 2,500 fps from the PS90, which equates to 625 Ft.Lbs or kinetic energy at the muzzle.
Capitalizing on Barnes legendary bullet design, quality control, and terminal expansion, Elite Ammunition has reached another milestone in the war on wildlife with the X-TerminaTOR.
Penetration through 15% ballistics gellatin exceeds 14", from the pistol, and bullet expansion is greater than 50% of the original diameter. From the PS90, the bullet penetrates a full 21" of 15% ballistics gellatin while expanding more than 75% of the original diameter. Weight retention is more than 99.5%, even after passing through bone and connective tissue.
The X-TerminaTOR comes shipped in a 50 round plastic Berry's Bullet box, at no additional charge, protecting the X-TerminaTOR during even the most gruelling of hunts.
Never before has a more effective small to medium game hunting round been developed in 5.7x28mm; again proving that Elite Ammunition truly is "The Result of Perfection."
S4 UltraRapTOR Tac-Op Cartridge VIRGIN BRASS ONLY
Our UltraRapTOR can be described as a hybrid of magnum-power hollow-point and high-speed rifle-caliber FMJ. The UltraRapTOR’s 28-grain hollow-point reaches speeds of 2600 feet-per-second when fired from a Five seveN pistol and match the proven abilities the Colt M4 when fired from a P90 merely half the size.
The bullet’s speed and shape practically guarantee instant target neutralization. When every hit counts, this round delivers. Against soft targets, blunt impact trauma and brutal tissue damage simply can't be found in a similarly sized cartridge. Furthermore, LEO and military specialists may request private copies of our test data regarding effectiveness against body armor.
The S4 UltraRapTOR is quite possibly the fastest and most-effective anti-personnel round ever chambered in 5.7x28mm.
Here is our current non-restricted product line and brief descriptions.
IlluminaTOR Tracer
Our IlluminaTOR Tracer cartridge is loaded with a bright red* mil-spec tracer. When shot, the bullet provides the same velocity and point of impact as our 55-grain FMJ round, allowing the shooter to accurately adjust his or her point of aim during night fire. We’re so confident in our IlluminaTOR Tracer that we back each and every round with our unconditional performance guarantee. If our tracers ever fail to ignite when fired, simply contact us about a hassle-free replacement or refund.
Elite Ammunition's tracers help keep time on your side. The pyrotechnic tracer compound in each IlluminaTOR Tracer bullet boasts an impressive shelf life of ten (10) years.
QuieTOR Subsonic
Sleek, quiet, and undeniably effective – Our QuieTOR subsonic ammunition is not just the first choice amongst suppressed 5.7x28mm enthusiasts; but also arguably the most effective choice for law enforcement and military operators. When operational conditions call for a quiet response, trust the round QuieTOR above the rest.
Our steadfast commitment to producing truly elite ammunition is reflected in every detail of the QuieTOR subsonic cartridge. Our precision manufacturing process holds individual cartridge tolerances within a mere thousandth of an inch. Such tight tolerances help provide a predictable consistency with each pull of the trigger. Platform-specific powder charges are carefully engineered to minimize recoil, maximize ballistic performance, enhance operator safety, and increase weapon reliability.
It is our strict adherence to quality control standards that allows us to guarantee true subsonic performance from every QuieTOR we sell.
Choose from QuieTOR cartridges loaded specifically for the FN Five seveN pistol, P90 PDW / PS90 SBR, or the PS90 carbine. Combined with a modern 5.7x28mm suppressor, QuieTOR subsonic ammunition
Important Note: Elite ammunition does not recommend or endorse shooting into occupied structures or in areas prohibited by law. Elite Ammunition disclaims any liability as a result of the use of our ammunition.
VarminaTOR
Elite proudly presents the VarminTOR 5.7x28mm high-performance small game round. Assembled using the renowned Barnes Varmint Grenade and propelled by a generous powder charge, the VarminTOR rockets past our chronographs at 2,100 fps* when fired from the FN Five seveN pistol!
The VarminTOR’s unique design balances high speed with match-grade accuracy and remarkable expansion properties. Upon impact, the bullet expands dramatically into small fragments, typically resulting in instant incapacitation. It is also important to note that these bullet fragments rarely exit the animal, avoiding damage to the game’s valuable pelt. Whether varmint hunting is your hobby, your profession, or simply your contribution to pest control, you can depend on the VarminTOR to get the job done!
*Velocity is quoted for the 5" Five seven pistol barrel, add 50 fps per additional inch of barrel
ProtecTOR Personal Defense
When fired from the FN Five seveN pistol, the ProtecTOR reaches 2,400 feet per second and able to impart more than 350 foot-pounds of energy on target. With the use of an FN P90 or PS90, bullet speeds increase by several hundreds of feet per second, outperforming many similarly sized 5.56x45mm weapons.
Astounding ballistic performance makes the ProtecTOR one of Elite’s most popular offerings. The cartridge design delivers the optimal level of penetration against a would-be attacker--while significantly reducing the risk of over-penetration when fired indoors. Gelatin tests conducted with a Five seveN handgun generated overwhelming hydrostatic shock effects and stunning elastic wound channels. The results revealed our ProtecTOR rivaled the stopping power of larger rifle calibers, while remaining safer than most pistol rounds in terms of material penetration and potential for ricochets.
When your family’s safety depends on you, depend on the ProtecTOR from Elite Ammunition.
Important Note: Elite ammunition does not recommend or endorse shooting into occupied structures or on areas prohibited by law. Elite Ammunition disclaims any liability as a result of the use of our ammunition
PenetraTOR Tac-Op
The PenetraTOR is heaviest supersonic 5.7x28mm round commercially available. Loaded with our special 55-grain FMJ. The PenetraTOR has been extensively tested, in the lab and in the field.
Our standard PenetraTOR is the most accurate cartridge in our catalog, capable of sub-1-inch groups at 25 yards out of the Five seveN’s 5-inch barrel*! Out of the P90 or PS90, the 2300+ feet-per-second bullet is more actually than most ever thought the platform was capable of.
Ideal for law enforcement, military personnel, varmint shooters, mid-sized game hunters, and even competition shooters–the PenetraTOR’s performance and versatility will surely leave you questioning how you ever got along without! **
* Accuracy was measured by averaging 3-10 shot groups from a Five-seveN pistol at 25 yards, held in a machine rest. Your results may vary.
** Shot-placement is the most important variable when confronted with dangerous situations and you should not rely solely on the performance of ammunition for your safety. As with all shootings, shot placement is the most important aspect of wound ballistics; far above projectile choice.
X-TerminaTOR Hunting Cartridge
ou asked for it, and we've delivered.
Our most popular "Off Catalogue" cartridge is now available for purchase without placing a special order. The Elite Ammunition X-TerminaTOR.
This cartridges pushes a 45 grain Barnes TSX FB bullet at more than 1,900 fps from the pistol (375 Ft.Lbs of energy), and 2,500 fps from the PS90, which equates to 625 Ft.Lbs or kinetic energy at the muzzle.
Capitalizing on Barnes legendary bullet design, quality control, and terminal expansion, Elite Ammunition has reached another milestone in the war on wildlife with the X-TerminaTOR.
Penetration through 15% ballistics gellatin exceeds 14", from the pistol, and bullet expansion is greater than 50% of the original diameter. From the PS90, the bullet penetrates a full 21" of 15% ballistics gellatin while expanding more than 75% of the original diameter. Weight retention is more than 99.5%, even after passing through bone and connective tissue.
The X-TerminaTOR comes shipped in a 50 round plastic Berry's Bullet box, at no additional charge, protecting the X-TerminaTOR during even the most gruelling of hunts.
Never before has a more effective small to medium game hunting round been developed in 5.7x28mm; again proving that Elite Ammunition truly is "The Result of Perfection."
S4 UltraRapTOR Tac-Op Cartridge VIRGIN BRASS ONLY
Our UltraRapTOR can be described as a hybrid of magnum-power hollow-point and high-speed rifle-caliber FMJ. The UltraRapTOR’s 28-grain hollow-point reaches speeds of 2600 feet-per-second when fired from a Five seveN pistol and match the proven abilities the Colt M4 when fired from a P90 merely half the size.
The bullet’s speed and shape practically guarantee instant target neutralization. When every hit counts, this round delivers. Against soft targets, blunt impact trauma and brutal tissue damage simply can't be found in a similarly sized cartridge. Furthermore, LEO and military specialists may request private copies of our test data regarding effectiveness against body armor.
The S4 UltraRapTOR is quite possibly the fastest and most-effective anti-personnel round ever chambered in 5.7x28mm.
Eightball
Member
Ah. Mr. panzermk2, and the websites in his signature, are the things I was referring to in my prior post where the 5.7 performance was spectacular.
I'd be interested in testing some of these supped up 5.7 loads. I'd like to shoot them over my chrono and test them on game. I went to the the website and it says the personal defense stuff is back ordered and 8-10 weeks out.
I'd also be real interested to know what the bullet weight is on these loads. Knowing the velocity doesn't really mean much to me with out knowing the how heavy the bullet it is pushing is.
Maybe in ten weeks I'll try to test some of this ammo. I am still of the opinion that there are much better choices for most people for defensive uses. I love my PS90 but it is not very likely to become my go to gun.
As for out performing short barreled 5.56 weapons. M855 will do 2600+FPS out of 10.5" barrel XM193 can do nearly 2800 FPS. If you go to a bull pup with a 16" barrel that is roughly the same size as the PS90 they are going to be over 3000 FPS. If you use optimized loads you can do better as well.
There are more choices than just a 5.56 as well. An 11" barreled 7.62x39 only loses a few hundred FPS off of a 16" barreled rifle and is harder hitting by a very good margin over the 5.7 rounds listed. It can make roughly 1400 Ft/lbs, over 600 more than the personal defense round listed above (presuming a 55 grain bullet at 2600 fps) Even if we pretend that thing is shooting a 70 grain bullet there is more than 400 Ft lbs difference. Energy only tells part of the story but the numbers are a useful starting point. I love my PS90 but the 5.7 will never match a 5.56 load at the limits of each cartridge. If I were to carry something the size of a five seven pistol i would just as soon have a 10mm to be honest.
Further if one really really wants a pistol that can penetrate a vest a $200 Tokarev will do it with ammo that is a fraction of the price of these 5.7 loads. No need for a $1K pistol and ammo that is $1 a shot.
I'd also be real interested to know what the bullet weight is on these loads. Knowing the velocity doesn't really mean much to me with out knowing the how heavy the bullet it is pushing is.
Maybe in ten weeks I'll try to test some of this ammo. I am still of the opinion that there are much better choices for most people for defensive uses. I love my PS90 but it is not very likely to become my go to gun.
As for out performing short barreled 5.56 weapons. M855 will do 2600+FPS out of 10.5" barrel XM193 can do nearly 2800 FPS. If you go to a bull pup with a 16" barrel that is roughly the same size as the PS90 they are going to be over 3000 FPS. If you use optimized loads you can do better as well.
There are more choices than just a 5.56 as well. An 11" barreled 7.62x39 only loses a few hundred FPS off of a 16" barreled rifle and is harder hitting by a very good margin over the 5.7 rounds listed. It can make roughly 1400 Ft/lbs, over 600 more than the personal defense round listed above (presuming a 55 grain bullet at 2600 fps) Even if we pretend that thing is shooting a 70 grain bullet there is more than 400 Ft lbs difference. Energy only tells part of the story but the numbers are a useful starting point. I love my PS90 but the 5.7 will never match a 5.56 load at the limits of each cartridge. If I were to carry something the size of a five seven pistol i would just as soon have a 10mm to be honest.
Further if one really really wants a pistol that can penetrate a vest a $200 Tokarev will do it with ammo that is a fraction of the price of these 5.7 loads. No need for a $1K pistol and ammo that is $1 a shot.
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browningguy
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The only problem with your ad panzermk2 is that none of the ammunition is actually available. Everyone I looked at was either not in stock or not accepting orders at this time.
My AR 57 is for plinking and having fun. There are other better choices, IMHO, for self defense. Not that a 50 round mag full of 5.7 anything would not be lethal, there are just better choices for me. I have tried a couple of different optics. Right now it has a cheapo 4X NcStar that is actually pretty clear.
AR 57 & latest plinker load - Use that load at your own risk, it has not been tested yet.
AR 57 & latest plinker load - Use that load at your own risk, it has not been tested yet.
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Well you can thank Bama for the back order.
Supplies are just as BO as assembled ammunition. A problem everyone here has had to deal with for months now. Bare shelves at WallyWorld and when they do have ammo it's 30 buck for white box 9mm.
Grafs, Midway are back ordered even longer on many types of ammo and primers.
Bullets weights and greater detail can be found at the other link. I may have my web guy in the future remove some of the marketing BS and replace it technical specs.
Supplies are just as BO as assembled ammunition. A problem everyone here has had to deal with for months now. Bare shelves at WallyWorld and when they do have ammo it's 30 buck for white box 9mm.
Grafs, Midway are back ordered even longer on many types of ammo and primers.
Bullets weights and greater detail can be found at the other link. I may have my web guy in the future remove some of the marketing BS and replace it technical specs.
I'll look further, but I checked the link and looked for a while, twice, and didn't see the bullet weight on the self defense ammo. That velocity is much more or less impressive based on whether it is firing a 55 grain bullet or 28 grain one.
It is nice to see someone offering alternate loads for the 5.7 though.
It is nice to see someone offering alternate loads for the 5.7 though.
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