Does it matter? 9mm and 40sw?

[Stinkyshoe]

It seems that there are manner great platforms for these calibers out there. The first three that come to mind manufactured in a polymer frame are the HK, Springfield, and Glock(atleast the 3 I would consider buying) So my question, given the use of "law enforcement" ammo, is there a significant difference in the stopping power of 9 vs the 40? How did you decide what you wanted to carry(interms of caliber).

I realize handguns are weak and anaemic as weapons, but they are easier for law abiding citizens to keep close by. How significant is the capability of a handgun to hold x number of rounds to you?

For example, the Springfield Xd-40(40sw) holds 12+1. The Xd-9(9mm) holds 15+1. So does it matter which one you'd get based on capacity? To me, the Xd series is superior to the Glock because of the grip angle and extra safety (and also the supstantial rails that the slide operates on). I am impressed with how accurate the Glock I shot was. However, the grip angle just wasn't my cup of tea. I like both though. I think it has more to do with what I practice with, although initial impressions of ergonomics certainly plays a role in what I should get. I haven't shot the 9 and 40 side by side. What is the differences in either platform?

I am not interested in having a 45 acp/45gap in either configuration. I think the 45 acp is best had in a good 1911. Thats just me though So what are your thoughts?

-Ss

 

[8830]

It doesn't matter to me. I've been a cop for 10yrs and in that time have carried a 9mm, 40, 10mm, 45acp and 357sig. I currently switch between my G17 9mm and my SW610 10mm. The 9mm is easy to shoot and consistently hit your target every time you pull the trigger. The 10mm takes more control due to more recoil although I love the round. Capacity doesn't matter to me since the G17 holds 17 and my 610 holds 6. I don't worry about capacity I worry about hitting what I'm shooting at.

 

[Marcus]

IMHO the top loads in 9mm and .40S&W are similarly effective with just a slight edge going to the .40...provided the rounds work as designed. The 9mm seems to be a lot more load sensitive though and is perhaps a bit more dependent on those rounds expanding just so. The .40 being a little bigger and usually a little heavier plus having more overall energy may give a slightly bigger margin for error. I use both and feel well armed with either one. I`m just much more concious of the loads I use in the 9mms. The XD is a darn nice platform. I see myself picking one up sometime. Marcus

 

[Mulliga]

I'd say it doesn't.

Are there any situations where a 9mm hollowpoint failed where a .40S&W hollowpoint would have succeeded? Probably not many.

Are there any situations where the marginally smaller capacity of a .40S&W was a handicap? Probably not many, either.

I shoot 9mm because it's cheap, but all of the big three calibers can be effective if you know what you are doing. And 10mm, too.

 

[mete]

The 40,357sig,45acp, have an edge over the 9mm. The 9mm+p, or 9mm+p+ improve the performance as do premium bullets. But more important than anything is bullet placement. Get a gun that you can shoot well and practice, practice.

 

[Black Majik]

For me... it doesn't matter. I prefer .45 ACP and its only 7 + 1. I'm perfectly happy.

 

[victory]

Lets include all the major handgun calibers, put .45 and 357sig into the picture. The truth is, there's not much of a difference when the best load from each is being used. There may be a big difference in ballistics, but the terminal effects are about the same. All handguns are marginal.

The big move to 40 s&w for police departments came at a time when 115gr 9mm's were all the rage. We have since learned that 115gr is not the right way to go to get optimal terminal effect out of a 9mm.

I've also heared people tell me that 40s&w penetrates barriers better. A swat team medic told my impressionable new shooter roommate "You should get a 40 because 9mm's just bounce off car windows" This is just blatantly false. For god's sake, swat medics don't even carry guns!

The moral of the story is: Use a rifle, don't nitpick over handgun caliber.

 

[stans]

The best round is the round that is 100% reliable in your gun and the recoil forces are easily controlled. 10mm is a great round, so is 357 magnum, but not everyone can handle the recoil. Defend youself with what you find to be reliable and controllable. A .32 through the heart or brain is going to do more to stop an attack than a 44 magnum through launched into never never land.

 

[valor1]

Well I guess as long as your gun shoots well and yo also shoot very well, the caliber doesn't matter much. Stopping power is still quite hard to prove even with the tests being made today.

 

[victory]

assuming you can hit your target, quality loads 9mm, 40, 45, 357 (sig or mag), and 10mm all provide enough penetration and expansion to get the job done.

 

[Preacherman]

IMHO, there is a difference, and this is based on JHP non-performance under certain circumstances.

If the hollow point of JHP ammo gets plugged up (e.g. by clothing, building material such as sheetrock [while shooting through cover, for example], etc.), the bullet will basically perform like hardball. 9mm. hardball is notoriously ineffective in stopping power, producing "theoretical" results in the 50% range. Back in the '80's, I saw at first hand several stopping failures with 9mm. JHP (the earlier-generation rounds such as Winchester Silvertip), where even half-a-dozen rounds in the chest cavity failed to stop an attacker. These bullets did not expand as efficiently as modern hollowpoints, and thus performed more like hardball.

On the other hand, .40 S&W hardball has a street performance similar to .45 ACP hardball - both are in the 65% to 70% "stopping" range. This means that even if the hollow-point bullet fails to perform as advertised, you're still putting a more effective round into the attacker than you would be with 9mm.

For this reason (and because, having personally witnessed failures, I still have a visceral distrust of 9mm. as a "stopping" round - even though I know that modern JHP designs have made this cartridge more effective), I prefer to carry a .40 or .45 round for self-defence.

 

[tbeb]

I like calibers that start with a "4". One of my house guns is a Springfield .45 ACP that has 1 in the chamber and 7 in the magazine. I just ordered a new pistol, and one of it's uses will be for a house gun. Caliber is 9mm and capacity is 1 in the chamber and 15 in the magazine. I feel well armed with either, so capacity doesn't matter that much to me. I recently shot a Glock 24C which is a long slide, ported barrel, .40 S&W. I loved it maybe more than anything, but I don't pay $500-$600 for a used gun.

I use hollowpoint ammunition that I think will usually expand in human tissue. So, for me, 9mm would be almost as good as .40 S&W (or .45 ACP). If the Springfield XD fits you better than the Glock then buy it. That's one reason the new pistol I mentioned above will be a CZ instead of a Glock or whatever. I'd choose 9mm because with good ammunition I think it is a good manstopper. I like Speer's Gold Dot 124 gr. JHP+P. In an XD I think recoil will be less with the 9mm (versus .40 S&W), so you can get your sights back on target faster. Another plus for the 9mm is practice ammunition is fairly cheap. The 9mm XD holds 15+1 which could help in certain situations.

 

[saddlebum]

Amen, precherman. the light 9mms are too light and the heavy 9mms are to slow. saddlebum

 

[TheEgg]

Back in the '80's

Preacherman, this may be the crux, right here.

I too used to demand a .45. Had little to no trust in the smaller ones.

But with the developments in recent years in JHP technology, and carefully examining all the information I could get my hands on, I now carry a 9mm without worry.

(Take this personal opinion for what it is worth, from someone who has never shot anyone! Hope not to, either!)

 

[Stinkyshoe]

Thanks for all the responses. The origin of my question stems from a discussion I read in the TFs. Frogman in the NS forum said that if they are limited to hardball ammo, they like the 45. Otherwise with "good" (I assume lawman ammo) 9mm works fine. (I feel kinda sick for even talking about what best stops(a.k.a. kills) a badguy trying to kill me....ummm well maybe I don't, but it is kind of a morbid discussion .)

At any rate, I am still not sure if there is an ultimate caliber or platform. I do have a question about the Glock though. For me it requires a grip that is more off to the side. The grip it takes for me isn't like a revolver, a 1911 or the XD where your arm is directly behind the slide. If I grip a Glock that way, it is quite uncomfortable, so instead it requires an off to the side grip, with very little hand on the backside. The Xds however, ohhhh, it is like I squeezed a piece of modeling clay in my hand, and then they built the gun off of that. Does anyone have a similar experience? I wonder if it is a matter of hand size. My hand hangs off the bottom of a Gov't size 1911 1/2 of an inch with high ride EB beavertail and with am Smith&Alexander main spring/mag funnel.