FAL or M1A?

[USSR]

If you want to scope your rifle, a FAL is a better choice.

Yep.

Don

 

[Halal Pork]

If you are not budget limited and want the penultimate .308 battle rifle get a 17s.

If the 17s is the penultimate, which rifle finished dead last?

To the OP, I'd like to have both but in the same boat as you I chose the M1A. I just felt more confident about the Springfield product versus the various FAL offerings. I'd still like a FAL though.

Edit to add:

Penultimate means second from last.

 

[briansmithwins]

If the 17s is the penultimate, which rifle finished dead last?

Chauchat.

If it's optics on a 7.62 NATO rifle you want, the SCAR 17S is the only way to fly.

BSW

 

[lhead71]

I have owned and shot both and kept this one. Keeps ball ammo under moa no problem.

 

[d2wing]

If you want a rifle you don't have to clean, get a FAL. If you like a long range rifle that is accurate and feels good in your hands get the M1A. Also the M14 style rifle is usable for hunting. The FAL is hard to resist for some. Both make good battle rifles depending on preference and type of fighting. The M14 covers a wider range of situations as it is better at long range and hand to hand with a bayonet, and is faster to point at multiple targets.

 

[303 hunter]

I think you'll find few who prefer the FAL. But those who do...really prefer them.

I REALLY prefer them!

 

[Runerock]

M1A standard here

 

[Ash]

The M14 won the trials as much because it was supposed to use existing tooling to a great extent, would allow a simpler transition of arms, and because the establishment was loathe to go radical.

The FAL would have made a better combat arm.

 

[ol' scratch]

I love my M1 Garand, but the M1A always balanced funny for me. I own an FAL and love the rifle. It is a heavy and almost unrefined beast. I have a DSA and that is what I would recommend. As one person put it, they are the Cadillac of the present day FAL world.

I also reload and the gas system on the M1A has the same problem that the gas system on the M1 has---it is ammo sensitive. Too much port pressure and the rifle is out of action. You can get an adjustable plug, but it is not like the tunable system on the FAL. The FAL doesn't care what it eats and won't get indigestion like the M1A. I also like that you can flip a switch and the rifle is a straight pull bolt action rifle. Good surplus mags are easier to find too (or at least in my area).

 

[MTMilitiaman]

90 of our allies disagreed

If it was a matter of majority rules, we'd all be using AKs and all our last names would Chin.

The crap where it eats cliche is tired and false. ARs aren't even true DI, and the gasses are directed into an in line piston formed by the tail of the bolt and the interior of the carrier. Their chamber fouling is no worse than any short or long stroke piston rifle.

In my experience this is wrong on both accounts. Saying the rifle craps where it eats means that it is blasting those hot gases and all that carbon fouling back into the receiver where the majority of the moving parts are. And my A4 most certainly did have quite a bit more fouling in the chamber than any piston rifle I've ever fired. Not only that but the damn star chamber is a PITA to clean. In fact, the whole rifle is just a bunch of tight nooks and crannies seemingly designed specifically to catch all the crud that the rifle blasts back in the receiver.

True the M1A requires tools to disassemble, but at least the parts are big enough to keep track of and the areas of the rifle that need to be cleaned are easy enough to reach. I've spent too much time combing the Southern California landscape for firing pin retaining pins and other small bits from M16s cause a gust of wind or careless step tipped over someones cover, where we were trained to keep the small parts while the rifle was being cleaned. I've never had any of these problems with my M1A.

The US FAL vs M14 trials were rigged.

No more so that the M16 trials, or the Beretta trials, or any of the other trials that have come before or after.

 

[wlewisiii]

I built a FAL & loved it. If the US had adopted it in .280 NATO, we wouldn't be having this conversation. I may someday build another and chamber it in 7mm-08 to get most of the way there.

I have no desire for the M1A or it's AR replacements.

If I could have only one semi-auto battle rifle, I'd choose the FN-49 in 7x57 That's good stuff too.

 

[fireside44]

If I could have only one semi-auto battle rifle, I'd choose the FN-49 in 7x57

Agreed but 8mm mauser FTW! Also as great a rifle as it is, it doesn't handle as nice as a FAL. Toss a synthetic stock on there and a detachable mag and I'm all over it.

 

[Girodin]

Between those two I'd rather have an FAL. If you can swing the price I'd gladly take a SCAR over either. For less money the gun pictured below is not bad at all either. This one still needs a battle comp or the like. It is much more of a project gun than any of the others though.

 

[56hawk]

If I could have only one semi-auto battle rifle, I'd choose the FN-49 in 7x57 That's good stuff too.

Agreed but 8mm mauser FTW! Also as great a rifle as it is, it doesn't handle as nice as a FAL. Toss a synthetic stock on there and a detachable mag and I'm all over it.

My FN-49 is factory original in 308 with 20 round detachable magazines.

 

[barnbwt]

Toss a synthetic stock on there and a detachable mag and I'm all over it.

Might as well add rails and a buffer tube while you're at it

j/k, I like the old school, personally, but if the OP wants a beater rifle, such a fate is beneath the elegant FN 49 (though it is certaintly capable, of course). It's "unrefined" decendant, the FAL, would be a wiser choice for rough play. I can't speak to the M1A as I have no experience, other than that I find the mechanism more interesting

The Argentine (?) Navy contract FN 49s had a 20rnd detachable mag in .308. And a wood stock is all the better for bustin' heads with . My Luxembourg 30-06 is easily topped off with stripper clips (not sure if the other chamberings do that) so the detachable mag is less of, if not a non-issue.

Also, call me crazy, but it feels like the FN 49's reciever isn't as overbuilt as the FALs I've handled; those almost feel ungainly to me. The FN 49 balances "like a rifle" in my hands. Granted, most of my rifle experience is with the portly FNAR, so keep that in mind...

TCB

Girodin; for a second there, I thought that flashlight on the side was some sorta crazy muzzle device

 

[fastest45ever]

How does the FAL compare in full auto to the M14?
Sort of on topic;-)

 

[kBob]

I guess some of the military FALs I shot in the way back that were in European military and police service turned me off to them. I fired a couple of the built up guns in the US and they were OK. I most liked Springfield Armory's SAR-48 (I think that was what it was called when it first came out) of the FALs I have shot. Played with it over about a month and enjoyed it.

Still if you placed a non military FAL and a Springfield M-1A on a table and said "Hey kBob! Pick one up and take it home! Free! It's yours!" I wouold not hesitate a split second to pick up the M-1 A.

Mind you I was teethed on Garands, flurted with M-14s and stuck with M-16A1s and as I say my earliest FAL experience was not with nice new guns, but the M-1a does it for me of the two choices offered.

-kBob

 

[MJ]

I shot SLR back in '68 and it just didn't light my fire. The guys with the SLR were always trying to steal our M14's. I just didn't get on the wagon when they were cheap in the 80's and I don't need a clone.

Also I not sure about it being easy to scope the SLR when the G3 and M14 dedicated military tested scope mounts. So I'm good with my pick at the time.

'83 and '86



..MJ..

 

[kBob]

MJ,

Does that rubber baby buggy bumper on the HK actually prevent HK ding?

A buddy of mine used to reload recoverd HK fired brass for his M-1A and he often cursed the dinged brass. Despite what the experts had to say he thought the chamber fluting ingraving was not a problem for reloading and usig in the M-1A. I always wondered if it made for odd pressure or a weird speed for extracting. Firing in the M-1A ironed out most of the HK brasses lines but not all of it. Never did find out if the case life for reloading was much altered as he died of cancer before we thought to start keeping track rather than just inspecting brass.

Got my SHutzen snuer (German Army qualification Shooting Knot) twice with the G3.

If an HK 51/91 and an FAL were on the table I would have to dither for a bit.

-kBob

 

[kBob]

Anyone know how many natios adopted the HK 51/91?

-kBob

 

[aubie515]

Man, these threads can get sidetricked. To the OP, of the two you listed...FAL all the way.

ETA:I've owned both.

 

[MJ]

KBob The bumper deflects the case down and forward making it less visible to any spotter the side effect of retrieving brass and less case denting is a free side effect. I have 200 CAVIM cases with 11~15 reloads and some LC cases with eight reloads no problems. Even without the bumper the cases are reformed and have no side effects I have seen. They have been fired is several other rifles with no ill effects. Now I also have 500 HXP and LC cases from the FN-SLR that are a bear to reload because there is no primary extraction and the rims are bent from the the violent extraction. Lots of trimming and removing of burs with a file before they will even chamber is a case gauge.

 

[mortablunt]

I vote for FAL, thinking it vastly preferable over the M1A. The FAL has been upgraded and changed significantly over its long history. It is still a popular rifle around the world. The thing is known for its incredible reliability. It's also known for being highly accurate, controllable, and user-friendly. The FAL is lighter than the M1A. M1A's have a reputation of not really being worth it unless you go for match grade one. I've had time with the FAL, and I honestly have to say that I love it. It's easily one of my favorite rifles. The controls, design, inclusion of a pistol grip, as well as a rainbow of different variants really make it standout. You can find an FAL built to be anything from a short range carbine to a long distance rifle. An M1A is just an M1A. Pretty much all the choice you get is barrel length, the colours of the paint and wood stain, and whether or not you want to have rails put on it.

_____
Rant: The M14 became the weapon for the United States because of politics and the extremely close ties between ordnance and Springfield Armory. It was also politics which got the M16 into service, and is responsible for the incumbency of the obviously subpar M4. The USA hasn't produced a genuinely good infantry rifle since the M1 Garand. About 10 times as many nations have adopted the FAL versus the M14, which says wonders about the quality of the two as weapons. And nobody but us actually took the M14 as their standard infantry rifle when presented with FAL, G3, and AKM. Essentially every other country to use the M14 employs it exclusively as a specialist sniper rifle.
_____

It's interesting to note that the M1A replicates the controls of a Kalashnikov almost exactly, save for its safety switch. It's funny because nobody ever complains about how horribly unergonomic and awkward the M1A's controls are. The FAL uses a left side charging handle on the side of the receiver and it uses the same rocking motion to insert and remove magazines. However, there's a kind of guide that makes it easier to do correctly and reliability. The FAL is vastly cheaper than the M1A and comes with much greater choice. Spare parts and accessories are also currently cheap. I'd pick the FAL.