History Lesson

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funnybone

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History Lesson

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A Little Gun History Lesson

In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.


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In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.


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Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated


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China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

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Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

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Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

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Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million 'educated' people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
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Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.

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It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced by new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by their own government, a program costing Australiataxpayers more than $500 million dollars. The first year results are now in:

Australia-wide, homicides are up 3.2 percent

Australia-wide, assaults are up 8.6 percent

Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)!

In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now up 300 percent. Note that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals did not, and criminals still possess their guns!

It will never happen here? I bet the Aussies said that too!

While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the past 12 months, since criminals now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed.

There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of the ELDERLY. Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has decreased, after such monumental effort and expense was expended in successfully ridding Australian society of guns. The Australian experience and the other historical facts above prove it.

You won't see this data on the US evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information.

Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.

Take note my fellow Americans, before it's too late!

The next time someone talks in favor of gun control, please remind him of this history lesson.

With Guns...........We Are "Citizens".
Without Them........We Are "Subjects".

During W.W.II the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED !

Note: Admiral Yamamoto who crafted the attack on Pearl Harbor had attended Harvard U 1919-1921 & was Naval Attaché to the U. S. 1925-28. Most of our Navy was destroyed at Pearl Harbor & our Army had been deprived of funding & was ill prepared to defend the country.


It was reported that when asked why Japan did not follow up the Pearl Harbor attack with an invasion of the U. S. Mainland, his reply was that he had lived in the U. S. & knew that almost all households had guns.

If you value your freedom, Please spread this anti-gun control message to all your friends !
__________________
 
I agree with this execpt for this,
unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
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in most of these they were unwilling to do so. A great misconception is that you are defenseless with out a gun. Although they are a very effective means there are other ways. I fully suport gun ownership other wise I would not be on here but to think you are defensless with out a gun is only giving the attacker an unfair edge against yourself.
 
Is it okay if I copy that and send to my little bro at Yale? Some of his roommates are voicing their opinions about me owning guns.

...oops I meant exercising my constitutional rights.
 
The fact that this country has armed citizens has always been an issue when it comes to other countries attacking us. I think that is still an issue to this day. No country has ever been afraid of our military but they have been afraid of the citizens. I have read some Soviet info on this topic and they knew this country pretty well.
 
I believe Yamamoto's actual statement was "You cannot invade America, there would be a rifle behind every blade of grass"
 
Oh not again! :banghead:

It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia ....
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It has only been a month since the last time some minor variant of this palpable nonsense was posted here! Have a look hereAnd even then it was old and tired and just as spurious as all the other times it has been posted since roughly 1998, when it first appeared.

Breathlessly posting "facts" which are so demonstrably false just makes all of us look silly!:cuss:

The actual results of what happened in Australia are quite different, but actually about as damning of the gun buyback. The fact is that of the order of a billion dollars has been spent, with essentially no effect on crime rates at all.

BTW there are now actually rather more legally-owned firearms here than there were in the aftermath of the buyback, and a growing recognition that it is the non-legally owned firearms which are the problem, not the legally owned ones. Of course the elephant in the room is that most of the firearms which were banned actually disappeared out of the system altogether: of several million firearms of the banned types which had been imported to Australia or made in Australia only about half a million were handed in in the buyback, and there seems to be a steady flow of illegal imports keeping the gang bangers equipped with the latest handguns.
 
Daniel,

Do you have some links to data about crime rates since the buyback in Australia? Can't help it I'm the son of a mathematician.
 
i have read this before. but yours is missing something. the last one i read about 6 months ago had something in it about england too. on how the crime rate is high and people can only defend themselves with knives or bats. However you cant do much with a knife when the robber has a gun.
 
It has only been a month since the last time some minor variant of this palpable nonsense was posted here!
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I'm sorry...but are you saying that the Nazi holocaust never happened? That the Purges of Stalin were an urban myth? That Cambodia's Pol Pot didn't stage his own little purge after 1975? Are you suggesting that Kruschev's nic, "Butcher of the Ukraine" was undeserved?

Are you saying that Uganda's Idi Amin was unjustly accused of genocide...including having his shock troops turn machineguns on the students at a university because they'd snubbed his son? How about those Armenian Turks? Was that a mass suicide?

The situation in Australia is best known and understood by Australians, so that's still an unknown at this point...though reports continue to trickle from Down Under, like they do from Britain...and they don't paint a pretty picture in many instances, of life after the guns were taken.
 
I'm sorry...but are you saying that the Nazi holocaust never happened? That the Purges of Stalin were an urban myth? That Cambodia's Pol Pot didn't stage his own little purge after 1975? Are you suggesting that Kruschev's nic, "Butcher of the Ukraine" was undeserved?

Are you saying that Uganda's Idi Amin was unjustly accused of genocide...including having his shock troops turn machineguns on the students at a university because they'd snubbed his son? How about those Armenian Turks? Was that a mass suicide?
Click to expand...

No. :rolleyes:

If you read my post again, more carefully this time, you'll see that I am saying "nonsense" of that part from "It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia .... " - the part I extracted.

The situation in Australia is best known and understood by Australians, so that's still an unknown at this point...
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So it would seem, unfortunately:rolleyes:. However there is in fact any amount of publicly available information, even here on THR if you look, which should enable anyone to understand the situation here - and it aint anything like that spurious "Ed Chenel" letter, from which the claims about Australia in the OP are directly lifted.

...reports continue to trickle from Down Under, like they do from Britain...and they don't paint a pretty picture in many instances, of life after the guns were taken.
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The situation in the UK and the situation here are very different. The picture here is essentially that large amounts of money were spent, and large numbers of law-abiding citizens forced to hand in firearms (which they then replaced with new ones, by and large) but the crime rates and trends showed no changes. In other words the whole thing was a complete waste of time and money, and there is increasing recognition of that fact outside the ranks of gun owners, especially in the criminological community.

The point remains though, that we need to avoid relying on rubbish like that spurious "Ed Chenel" letter. This stuff is so easily debunked it undermines any credibility our position might have had:banghead:.
 
Babarsac

A peer-reviewed paper published in British Journal Of Criminology showing no significant effect on murder rates can be found here http://www.c-l-a-s-s.net/Baker-McPhedran.htm

The Australian Institute of Criminology www.aic.gov.au is also a good source of papers on firearms and crime. There was a period around the Buyback when some of this stuff hovered close to cheerleading for the new laws. The more recent papers are far more measured. The source data for these papers is from the Australian Bureau of Statistics www.abs.gov.au

Somewhat tellingly Dr Don Weatherburn, the head of the NSW Bureau of Crime Statistics and Research, came out a couple of years back in the Sydney Morning Herald, a major Australian paper, to say

"It may come as a surprise to Simon Chapman (Letters, October 31) but, like him, I too strongly supported the introduction of tougher gun laws after the Port Arthur massacre.

The fact is, however, that the introduction of those laws did not result in any acceleration of the downward trend in gun homicide. They may have reduced the risk of mass shootings but we cannot be sure because no one has done the rigorous statistical work required to verify this possibility.

It is always unpleasant to acknowledge facts that are inconsistent with your own point of view. But I thought that was what distinguished science from popular prejudice."
Click to expand...
 
During W.W.II the Japanese decided not to invade America because they knew most Americans were ARMED !
Click to expand...

I think that would come out to a minor concern, and rather less imperative than the mass populations and land mass differences of the US, how it would essentially undo the japanese military. The every blade of grass statement is a good way to compress that.
It would be like germany invading russia. (it worked awfully well I hear.) Two front wars never really turn out the way that one would hope.

Either way,
these "facts" are old news. outdated. Remember too: 90% of statistics are misreported or falsely contrived 50% of the time.

The point is here:
WE do not rob people, WE do not kill fellow citizens, WE are not the murderers and rapists and robbers that run rampant with guns.
Why are WE under threat of punishment for the crimes that others have committed, and that WE are being convicted of just by the evidence of chance, rather than by any due process supported by evidence.
We are not criminals and do not deserve to be punished as such.
 
If you read my post again, more carefully this time, you'll see that I am saying "nonsense" of that part from "It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia .... " - the part I extracted.
Click to expand...

Oh, I saw it. I just wanted to get it refocused on the meat of the OP's post, because it's not just about Australia. It's about almost a hundred years of history and the lessons that we can take from it.

I appreciate and respect that you leap to the defense of your homeland, but...are you sure of all the crime stats? Australia is a big place...a country and a continent.

I live less than an hour from Charlotte, and I don't know what the crime situation is like there, except what I occasionally read in the paper or hear on the 11:00 news. I don't know if the authorities pad the statistics to make their fair city appear safer than it is...or if they're completely honest about it. I can probably bet that it's spun toward the former...like all large cities do to some degree.

Australia's gun ban is far too recent to know what it will ultimately bring about. That'll take a little more time.

And...Like comparing Charlotte or Raleigh and the rural area where I live...I can't say that everywhere in the state is as peaceful and quiet...and as safe...as it is here, only 60 miles away. In some parts of the state, people haven't bothered to lock their doors at night for years. In others...iron bars on the windows aren't enough...and there's often only a dozen miles or less between the two areas.

One more thing...

Excessive eye-rolling will give you a headache.

:)
 
Oh, I saw it. I just wanted to get it refocused on the meat of the OP's post, because it's not just about Australia. It's about almost a hundred years of history and the lessons that we can take from it.
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Yeah, right...

I appreciate and respect that you leap to the defense of your homeland, but...are you sure of all the crime stats? Australia is a big place...a country and a continent.
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Actually, I am not leaping to the defence of anything, except the facts. What happened here was a collossal waste of time and money and both an inconvenience and insult to people like me. However, the situation is not helped by the posting of this tired old nonsense all the time. The facts on crime rates here are readily available, from sources no one has any reason to doubt. You can check them yourself.

Australia's gun ban is far too recent to know what it will ultimately bring about. That'll take a little more time.
Click to expand...

The gun buyback took place over ten years ago. How long d'you think it will be?

Excessive eye-rolling will give you a headache
Click to expand...

Actually emoticons only take a point and click. Useful things they are too, to convey in such shorthand what one thinks

Keep digging...:p
 
The gun buyback took place over ten years ago. How long d'you think it will be?
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Well, it took Britain about 20 years to really hit the wall...but when they hit it...they hit it hard.

Again...I responded the way that I did in order to keep it from focused on Australia. I'm sure that things are nice there, and I wish you all well. That's probably not the way to bet, however...if history is any indication.

Your response also hinted at an underlying message. That being: "A nationwide gun grab ain't so bad. We had one here and we're all just ducky...so you Yanks shouldn't get your knickers in a such a knot"...and I guess that's what raised my hackles more than anything else.

We take our liberties and our Bill of Rights seriously, because we are not subjects. On a practical level, your gun-free utopia is of no consequence to us. Politically, it's a travesty...the end result which remains to be seen. It may take awhile, and it will be of great interest to see how it plays out...and if it goes the way it did in Great Britain. You have our condolences, our prayers, and our heartfelt best wishes.
 
A good discussion and a great cartoon, 1911Tuner.

I've downloaded the cartoon and am about to send it off to my liberal friends....

Jim H.
 
I'm tryin' to keep it in the road, jfh...but I tend to get a little prickly whenever I hear or read somethin' that suggests supporting or even accepting a gun-grab action...no matter how insignifigant. They're never satisfied with just a little, and won't stop until they get'em all...because it's not about gun control. It's about control...period...and they don't care if it takes 20 years or 50 or a hundred. Ours had been an ongoing battle for over 40 years. If we'd rolled over and allowed it to go on without a fight...we'd be in the same shape as Britain is now...or worse.

If our Australian friends believe that what's happened there is the end of it...they could live to regret their acceptance of the status quo, as an ever-increasingly empowered Parlaiment enacts bans on toys and articles of clothing in order to create a safe haven.
 
The fundamental importance of the 2nd Amendment is a hard one, I suspect, for anyone not born in the US, save for those few who emigrate and "get it."

"The English" don't get it, because of their historical lack of a written Bill of Rights and the fundamental and historical role of them as subjects. Australians might well get it, given their settlement of a continent much as white Europeans did here--but their historical tie to British History prevents that. Canadians sometimes get it--but the cultural impact of the US is far more dominant there.

In short, what is esstentially a truism--factually and rationally based, but held as a belief as well--is the underlying assumption for us as US Citizens; for the others, it is an overlay.

Given the nature of the (nominal) three Governments of these nations, it is ours to lose, and theirs to gain--but probably only through revolution and a written Constitution that would enshrine the Right to Keep and Bear Arms, along with a impractical process to modify that Constitution.

Meanwhile, the history lesson needs to be continually repeated.

Jim H.
 
Funderb:" 90% of statistics are misreported or falsely contrived 50% of the time.''

I wonder which side this statistic falls?
 
This history lesson truly slices through the layers of dissembling and obfuscation and gets right to the heart of the matter.

It is a sad fact that American students are entering and even graduating college without a proficient understanding of it.

As Thomas Jefferson noted, Americans need to know where this country came from in order to know where it should go.
 
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