Loading a Mosin

[twinhairdryers]

So I just picked up a cool M44 Mosin Nagant that is in remarkably good shape. I have read everywhere that they have a 5round magazine. Does this really mean that the mag holds 4 and 1 in the chamber means 5 for a 4 round mag capacity? If I hand load them from the top, there is about 0.1 inch of the top round and rim on the 5th round that won't let allow the bolt to be closed. I even tried loading them from the bottom with a closed bolt through the bottom of the magwell. Won't close. Is this normal, is it really a 4round mag?

Also. it appears that to adjust the windage on these takes a screwdriver, hammer, and some finess to bend the front sight pin (similar to a WASR or AK style blunt force method). Is this how everyone does it? I'm not going to buy a 30 dollar tool to use once on a 130.00 gun.

 

[Clipper]

The magazine was built to be loaded in battle with a stripper clip containing 5 rounds. There isn't time in such circumstances to add a round by hand, so there was no room provided to drop an extra in. Also, there is an added function of the ejector to block the following rounds in the magazine from rising beneath the ready round until the bolt is closed, making for a lot of stuff happening in that little magazine, and if there were more room designed in, they couldn't make the magazine in such a sexy shape...

 

[grimjaw]

Many of the older fixed magazine rifles seem to be made to hold N + 1 rounds. Mausers are similar, as is the SKS. I haven't tried closing the bolt on a full mag without chambering a round in the FN49 but I'm sure it would also be difficult. So you're planning to keep the magazine loaded without one in the pipe, four rounds will probably be your limit.

You should not have to bend the front pin. A hammer and punch (or screwdriver if you don't care about scratching it up) will work. In some cases the front sight might have rusted up a bit or be exceptionally tight. You could try some penetrating oil if yours doesn't budge with some stout whacks, or perhaps the application of heat.

jm

 

[Koobuh]

Okay, my brain just about melted.

You're saying you want to load the magazine, then close the bolt without stripping a round, right?
I can't think of a single military bolt action (my experience is limited, ymmv)that allows you to close the bolt on a full magazine without stripping a round. That's a Good Thing (tm), because you want feeding to be reliable.

This is not a sporting rifle, it doesn't have the 'features' you might expect on a remington whatever.
Mag capacity is 5; load, chamber a round, shoot. That's how Mosins work.

For adjusting windage, you need a large brass punch and a mallet. Remember, you want the sight to move left if you want impact to move right, and vice versa. Draw a little diagram if that helps you to remember, I know it helped me.
Adjusting vertical impact is trickier, but doable. Check out the surplusrifle.com site for info on this.
My suggestion is to find a current make cartridge (surplus runs out, after all) that shoots accurately from that rifle, and make any sight adjustements to accomodate that load.

 

[RecoilRob]

Well, actually mag capacity IS four rounds + one in chamber. Mine won't accept five deep enough to close the bolt on them.

Maybe the proper term should be 'Rifle has 5 round capacity', meaning fully loaded.

 

[Rodgerp]

Hmmmm.
I have owned several M44's and one Sako M39.

All of them would allow 5 rounds into the mag.

?????

 

[MilsurpShooter]

I think what he's asking Rodger is if you can load 5 in the mag +1 in the chamber. I actually did try this with my M48 when I first got it, curiosity. I can load in 5 but can't close the bolt without loading a bullet, bolt doesn't have enough clearence to pass over that 5th one.

 

[Yute]

I can't think of a single military bolt action (my experience is limited, ymmv)that allows you to close the bolt on a full magazine without stripping a round

Mausers can do it just fine? Just hold down the top cartridge while pushing the bolt over it. Same deal with an enfield. Or chamber a round, pop out the mag load one round in then you have 10+1 cartridges.

 

[foghornl]

Things that make ya go "...Hmmmmmmmmmm." ***

Never tried 5+1 in my M-44. Hafta give that a whirl in a couple of days. I can do 10+1 with my Yugo SKS, though.


***Line shamelessly stolen from 'The Arsenio Hall SHow'

 

[Spiggy]

nope, I tried... the bolt will still try to pick up the rim of the 5th cartridge

 

[Hoppy590]

the rim of 7.62X54r will block the bolt. iv tried it.

the mosin nagant will hold 5 rounds in the magazine, but the bolt will not close even if the rounds are pushed down. sure maybe your rifle has a sloppy latch, or slightly muffed magazine spring. maybe its possible that it can be done. but for the other 99% of the rifles it can not.

I can't think of a single military bolt action (my experience is limited, ymmv)that allows you to close the bolt on a full magazine without stripping a round

Mauser, SMLE, M1917. many others
only ones i can think of that dont are MN and k31

 

[Cosmoline]

It can be done, you just press down on the top round as the bolt passes over it. You can also release the floorplate and ease it down a notch, then reclick it, though this can cause rimlock issues with older magazine springs.

But in practice it's a lot easier to strip one off and lock the safety on.

 

[twinhairdryers]

I think I now see the light. It is a 5round cap gun with

a 4 round cap mag. Thus I can't load 5 into the mag and close the bolt on an empty chamber. Just interesting since a lot of literature out there says it has a 5round mag capacity. My glock 17 holds 17 rounds in a magazine and is 17+1 if I load one in the pipe and insert a full mag . I just wanted to make sure it wasn't something mechanical I was missing or screwing up in loading it.

I took it out today and put 50rounds through the pipe. Got my elevation at 50yards down well. Drifting the rear sight until I adjust it got some decent groups. I was impressed as hell for this old of a gun. Fun shooting also. Not much of a recoil as I had read at all (used to shooting a lot of 12gauge slugs). I'm going to try to extend the bayo. I heard from some it could move the pattern 5-10inches to the right (no idea how), which is about the adjustment I need before I try to whack the front pin.

I did have a few rounds that I couldn't open the bolt without a hard hit or hammer. It seemed to be locked up pretty good. I think this can be common and a common fix, but what is the common fix for this??

 

[Cosmoline]

Certain ammo tends to bind the bolt more than others, though it varies from rifle to rifle. I have some that hate Albanian, and some that never lock with it. Likewise with laquered cases--some love it, others get sticky almost at once. I usually keep a brass hammer to thwack the thing open. Worst case scenario the claw hops over the rim, but then you can just remove the bolt, unload the magazine and throw the cleaning rod back down the barrel to knock out the brass. It works.

It has more to do with the low quality and wide divergence of specs in 54R surplus. You should NOT have binding with modern production brass boxer primed ammo or good handloads.

 

[07Lway]

I have heard that The Russians kept the bayonet out most of the time, and so they were sighted with it extended. It is smart of you not to go banging on sites until you check it with it extended. You probably will find it is almost spot on (well for a 60+ year old rifle).

 

[dfaugh]

I think I now see the light. It is a 5 round cap gun with 4 round cap mag.

Huh? I mean, I see what you're trying to say, but strictly speaking the mag capacity is 5 rounds.

 

[glimmerman]

The sticky bolt is a common problem with mosins, there is brobobly old dirt or cosmoline in the chamber. Take a bore brush wraped with 0000 steel wool and 1 section of a cleaning rod and chuck it in a cordless drill and polish out the chamber. Keep the steel wool soaked with bore cleaner. This will clean out and get rid of any burrs in the chamber.

 

[Spiggy]

BRONZE BRUSH! BRONZE BRUSH!

steel can damage the gun! especially when attached to a drill! :banghead:

 

[B yond]

+1 steel wool

Although I also put a little bore paste on it to give it a little more friction. What you're trying to do here is scrub off the old cosmoline and polish the chamber to a very smooth finish so lacquered shells won't stick in the future.

Also a good idea to oil the chamber well after each trip out.

And don't forget to clean with ammonia when using corrosive ammo.

 

[George S.]

I can't think of a single military bolt action (my experience is limited, ymmv)that allows you to close the bolt on a full magazine without stripping a round. That's a Good Thing (tm), because you want feeding to be reliable.

My 1903A3 allows for a full 5 rounds in the magwell from a stripper clip and by pushing down on the top cartridge, I can close the bolt without feeding a round into the chamber.

I can add a additional single round in the chamber after loading from a stripper clip by pushing down on the top cartridge and sliding the bolt just over the top of the top cartridge and then insert another round into the chamber and closing the bolt.