Marlin for defense?

[ugaarguy]

Please note, that you cannot "top off" a Win. 94 magazine, unless the mag. tube is completely empty. If it contains even one round, the loading gate is blocked by a cartridge.

ETX, not to argue, but I've not had that experience with my '94AE Trapper in 45 Colt. The gate is stiffer and takes a bit more effort, but it will push the round back into the tube. Does the longer OAL of the 30-30 and other rifle cartridges prevent this? Does anyone know if the Marlin design is different?

 

[Jacobus Rex]

I can top off my Winchester 94 without any trouble. I've done it a lot of times.

Standard hunting type .30/30 loads are more effective than a standard military AK-47 round. Win 94's and Marlin's are at least as accurate as an AK.

I believe that a 30/30 would be just fine for defense and very useful if you live in a rural area. I'd rather try to kill an animal attacking livestock, etc. with a .30/30 than any pistol.

The only downside would be over penetration. I wouldn't use one if that was a problem for you.

 

[AStone]

Then again, if the Alaska move isn't definite the 30-30 makes more sense. It's a good caliber to have in the battery even if you do move to Alaska. If you do move up there, or if the move looks more definite, then I'd go with the 45-70 if you want it. I think the ammo cost and availabilty you already mention also helps the leaning toward the 30-30.

UG, the AK move is a mere thought at this point, but a serious one. I've always fancied AK. Big, big, BIG country up there, with large mountains easy to get lost in (which is a good thing). Depending on what happens on Earth in the next few years (if you know what I mean ), I'm definitely looking in that direction.

And I agree: that .30/30 is looking like a good rifle, whether I go north or not. IF I do go up and want to add a .45/70, a Marlin in .30/30 will offer a nice training entry (given the same action) AND will be useful even when I get there.

Familiarity is always good. I agree that higher proficiency with what you already have trumps switching over to (and trying to get truly familiar with) a new handgun and rifle simply for caliber compatability. That again points back to the 30-30 or 45-70, beating out a hangun round in your lever gun.

Of course, I agree with that.

But I did have an interesting thought after writing my last post, while I was eating those fish & chips (which were excellent, by the way - cod is such good fish, followed by a serving of tiramisu from a local bakery...<ahem>): if I'm heading towards AK in the next few years, I'm probably going to want to add a larger caliber handgun to the mix.

.357? .44?

Still, seems like a good thing for me now to stay with a rifle caliber carbine.

Plus, I've always thought that if (no, when) a SHTF/TEOTWAWKI event occurs, having weapons in a range of calibers will increase the probability that one can find some ammo to shoot.

Earlier this year the realization that fit, and subsequent resulting accuracy, beat out caliber and modern super gun hype caused some changes for me. ...I quickly learned that getting decent with a revolver DA also really helped shooting autos.

I heard that. DAO is my path as well.

What convinced me of the importance of "fit" was trading my SW3914 in for a Kahr K9. I knew that something wasn't right with the 3914 for me. It was a fine gun, but I couldn't shoot consistently with it.

Reading some THR posts about handgun fit, I realized it was too large for me.

I tried out several other handguns at my local gunshop, and discovered that the K9 fit me like a glove.

Ever since, my groups have improved.

I have no doubt that the same will apply to rifles. It does for my CZ 452.

That's why I lean towards a Marlin 336. For me, it fits: shoulders quickly, points comfortably, carries well. I've owned one before (and should never have sold it). It feels good, like a nice pair of gloves. Ahhh...

That experience solidified for me what folks like sm always teach. Get a reliable gun, but the fit is equally important. Get an action/control layout that feels right to you. Get a good caliber that you shoot comfortably, not something bigger that leans into tolerating it and not being comfortable. Adjust grips/stocks to perfect the fit. Go shoot it a bunch and get really familiar with it. These fundamentals apply across the board to handguns rifles and shotguns...

Well said.

Nem

 

[sm]

<Raises Hand>

How did folks survive in the olden days with so few firearms choices, ammo offerings? I mean some folks only had one "gun" and that one "gun" had to put food on the table and defend the home.

I think I just figured why it took so long for Internet to come about.

 

[Marshall]

Yep, it'll stop a man.

I would never use a high power rifle in an urban home defense setting, unless it was all I had and I might die. If you want a short, easy to maneuver, 5-8 shot gun, get a short barrel shotgun. Much more versatile for HD. You can shoot various slugs, various buckshot, various birdshot or any combination thereof. And I promise, all are effective. The last thing I want to do is harm a neighbor or any innocent, a shotgun cuts down the odds. And, IMO, increases the odds of harming the intruder.

 

[AStone]

How did folks survive in the olden days with so few firearms choices, ammo offerings? I mean some folks only had one "gun" and that one "gun" had to put food on the table and defend the home.

Steve,

I have no doubt that
you make a good point.

When all's we got is all's we got,
we use what we got.

Then again, diversity is a good thing.
(Just look at the role of species diversity
in stabilizing ecosystems
{says the ecologist}...)

Tiramisu calls.

(I could be stuck on chocolate chip cookies
or apple pie for the remainder of eternity,
but diversity in desserts is good ... )

 

[fungusmunkey]

I can top off all of the lever actions that i have, no problem.
Maybe there was some type of issue what that particular gun?

Nema:

The 45/70 is a fine round but if AK is still a possibility and not definate i would look toward something that would fit better in your current environment. Just cause you are where you are right now!
You can always trade up if necessary in the future.

One other consideration is price of ammo, and 30-30 routinely goes on sale in most shops around here, and can be found in every gunshop in north america*
Aim surplus also has some good serbian stuff for pretty cheap as well, if stocking up is something you'd like to do.


*There are of course exceptions to every rule.

 

[ugaarguy]

I have a question about the caliber itself, though: I understand there are great hollowpoint ammo choices for hunting and self-defense, but is the 30-30 round capable of more penetration than the .357 against barriers like solid-core doors, automobile glass, etc.? I'm not a TEOTWAWKI kind of guy...just wondering

DouglasW, I'll have to do a little searching for specific rounds. Some of the heavier stuff, like the 170gr. soft points are a little better than the lighter 150s and 135s. I know several folks of my dad and grandad's generation that used the 30-30 as their only rifle in central and SE Ga. Those old leverguns have taken many a deer and hog. The feral hogs in Ga and other parts of the SE US do have some Russian Boar in their bloodlines. It's not unusual for them to weigh well in excess of 200 lbs. They're thick skinned, grisly muscled, heavy boned beast. I'm sure many others can attest that they're quite a tough critter. Trajectory may not be laser flat like many typical bolt gun chamberings, but if it'll stop a hog it'll penetrate just fine in my opinion.

 

[AStone]

Trajectory may not be laser flat like many typical bolt gun chamberings,
but if it'll stop a hog it'll penetrate just fine in my opinion.

Hog = BBQ.

Amen?

Amen.

Please pass the slaw & sauce.

 

[ETXhiker]

I can top off all of the lever actions that i have, no problem.
Maybe there was some type of issue what that particular gun?

Wow, you guys have me wondering now. I've had an old ('60's) Win. 94 .30-30 and a 94 "Big Bore" in.356 Win. Both guns, the cartidge that was next for the chamber was directly behind the loading gate, so that the gate would barely push in if anything was in the tube. When loading, it was necessary to have the nose of each shell follow the base of the one going in, without letting the gate close. If the gate closed, the mag. spring pushed the last shell into position behind the gate and you couldn't open it. Maybe I have missed something major, but it seemed like a physical impossibility to open that gate once it was closed with ammo in the tube. I've sold both of those guns, but I'm curious about this now. Anybody have any ideas?

Jacobus Rex, what caliber is your '94?

 

[danang]

For what it is worth...got a long time friend who is a long time gunsmith. I asked him some questions about Win 94 v/s the Marlin. The old .30-30 has been popular down here in Mississippi for all it's long life. He said that if you want a scope, the Marlin is the only one. If you want absolute reliability, the Winchester was his pick. He made the statement that in 20 years of working on neglected and somewhat abused guns, he had replaced dozens of Marlin extractors and 1 Winchester. And it was the fault of the gunowner. Just my two cents.

 

[ndh87]

A levergun is also more effective than a pistol after you run out of ammo.

Unless you forget to load it you shouldnt have to worry about this point. But then again, if you miss 6 times at HD distances, maybe you'd be better off using it as a club afterall.

 

[roscoe]

Please note, that you cannot "top off" a Win. 94 magazine, unless the mag. tube is completely empty. If it contains even one round, the loading gate is blocked by a cartridge.

I have Winchester 1894 rifles in .45 Colt and 30-30. You can load them whenever there is space in the magazine. I would have that one checked.

 

[1973]

For the record the Winchester 1894 in 30-30 (vintage unknown) I used to own did the same thing as ETXhiker's. I think I also had a problem getting in the last round in the tube at times.

 

[ryoushi]

I have a 336 in 30-30 and I love it, but the one time I felt the need to grab a longgun for social purposes it was a 12 guage shotgun. You could make many worse choices than the 336 but if you are dead set on just one gun that wouldn't be my choice.