New York .50 Ban/Turn-In?

[Gunnerpalace]

I have been hearing musings of this on other sites, anybody have more info?

Basically it is a "get rid of your .50 or you go to jail" thing, with some AWB stuff too.

 

[Eightball]

If that happened........didn't Barrett develop a calibre with similar performance, out of the same platforms, to get around such crap?

 

[TexasRifleman]

I have been hearing musings of this on other sites, anybody have more info?

No such law exists today, but it has been proposed, introduced in January 09

http://assembly.state.ny.us/leg/?bn=A03211&sh=t

And yes, the bill does include some pretty drastic language, no grandfather clause and mandatory turn in.

"3. WITHIN THIRTY DAYS OF THE EFFECTIVE DATE OF THIS SECTION, ANY PERSON, INCLUDING A LICENSED FIREARM DEALER, WHO HAS IN HIS OR HER LEGAL POSSESSION A USED 50-CALIBER WEAPON SHALL PERSONALLY DELIVER SUCH WEAPON TO THE DIVISION OF STATE POLICE, AND UPON TRANSFERRING OWNERSHIP AND POSSESSION TO A DULY DESIGNATED OFFICER THEREOF, SHALL BE ENTITLED TO RECEIVE PAYMENT IN AN AMOUNT EQUAL TO THE FAIR MARKET VALUE OF SUCH WEAPON, BUT NOT TO EXCEED EIGHT THOUSAND FIVE HUNDRED DOLLARS."

Introduced by 7 Democrats, though many will be here shortly to tell you party politics has nothing to do with that, that's it's just "common sense" and it's not that big a deal.

I don't know, just citing the facts.

Also, I have no idea how NY State legislature rules work, but here is the status:

01/23/2009 referred to codes
04/16/2009 amend and recommit to codes
04/16/2009 print number 3211a
04/21/2009 reported referred to ways and means
04/21/2009 reported
04/23/2009 advanced to third reading cal.376

No idea what that means, that's a NY thing. Any NY people know what that means?

Just FYI on who to blame:

SPONSOR Eddington (MS)

COSPNSR Bing, Lifton, Bradley, Ramos, Alessi, Kavanagh

MLTSPNSR Diaz, Dinowitz, Englebright, Glick, Gottfried, Hoyt, John, Koon,
Ortiz, Paulin, Peoples, Perry, Pheffer, Scarborough, Weinstein,
Weisenberg

And this lovely stuff is all through the text of the bill:

According to a report by the Violence Policy Center, Al Qaeda, Osama bin
Laden's terrorist organization, purchased at least twenty-five 50caliber
weapons from a U.S. manufacturer.

 

[JImbothefiveth]

No problem, just change the cartridges and guns by .10 caliber and shoot your .490 sidestep . Of course, they may eventually ban the .490 sidestep.

 

[TexasRifleman]

No rpbolem, just change the cartridges and guns by .10 caliber and shoot your .490 stupid law.

Or actually call your elected officials and try to stop it.

I can NOT believe you just said "No problem".

 

[JImbothefiveth]

It's not actually "no problem", of course. I was trying to point out there may be a way to avoid turning in your (expensive) .50s. It would also show the stupidity of such laws.

 

[TexasRifleman]

I was trying to point out there may be a way to avoid turning in your (expensive) .50s. It would also show the stupidity of such laws.

30 days from signing the law or mandatory turn in.

Wouldn't be easy to get every .50BMG in NY state to a gunsmith, modified to .416 Barrett or whatever and returned to the owners in that time.

Note the law, if it's at a licensed dealer (which include gunsmiths) at the end of the 30 day period it's doomed.

Trying to figure out workarounds and dealing with the fallout of these things rather than trying to stop them cold is going to be the end of the Second Amendment.

 

[JImbothefiveth]

Of course it should try to be stopped. However, this is NY. I don't think those are good odds.

Wouldn't be easy to get every .50BMG in NY state to a gunsmith, modified to .416 Barrett or whatever and returned to the owners in that time.

I'm not a lawyer, however, if you just replace the bbl so it can't chamber .50 BMG, couldn't the rest be replaced later?

 

[kanook]

[QUOTWHO HAS IN HIS OR HER LEGAL POSSESSION A USED 50-CALIBER WEAPON SHALL PERSONALLY DELIVER SUCH WEAPON TO THE DIVISION OF STATE POLICEE][/QUOTE]sorry officer, as you can see mine is not "used", it's "like new in box"

 

[jmorris]

According to a report by the Violence Policy Center, Al Qaeda, Osama bin
Laden's terrorist organization, purchased at least twenty-five 50caliber
weapons from a U.S. manufacturer.

I don’t think they had to buy them; we slipped them a lot more than just .50’s when they were fighting the Soviet Union. I’m not one for communism taking over satellite countries and I know we wanted them to have a Vietnam too but I think we should have left that one alone.

 

[jmorris]

Oh, and it's a good thing don't own one of the "little" 50's, my 50 BMG is .510

 

[rogertc1]

The Federal Government ban the Streetsweeper unless you are in a state that allows destructive devised.

 

[WNC Seabee]

Would my .50 caliber Flintlock be considered a "used .50 caliber weapon"?

 

[allank]

IANAL, but the wording sounds like it would ban any .50 caliber "weapon" (depends on NY legal definition of "weapon") regardless of method of operation, so that would include flintlocks and other muzzle loaders.

 

[WardenWolf]

You can bet that such a law is going to get challenged all the way up to the Supreme Court, in wake of Heller. Anything that actually involves confiscation or mandatory turn-in will have to pass Constitutional muster.

 

[TexasRifleman]

You can bet that such a law is going to get challenged all the way up to the Supreme Court, in wake of Heller. Anything that actually involves confiscation or mandatory turn-in will have to pass Constitutional muster.

I agree. The part that worries me is the whole "in common use" argument.

I always thought that when Scalia said that he meant as far as justifying the use of military weapons by private citizens because they were "in common use" by the military.

But, if you twist it around to mean "in common use" by private citizens you can rule out a lot of niche firearms.

Not sure how it applies, but that part of Heller always worries me.

 

[Phatty]

The part of that proposed statute most likely to fail the constitutionality test is the $8,500 limit on the amount the state will reimburse gun owners for their gun. Before the government can take your property, it must give you fair value for that property.

 

[WoofersInc]

Not that I live in New York but when I see these things I get worried because once it gets in place in 1 state it is not long before other states start looking at it.
I couldn't find anything in there that specifies rifles only. So does this also include hadguns? No more S&W 500's or Desert Eagle 50's ?

 

[Hawaiian]

The anti's chip away one rock at a time until they can tear down the whole mountain. They picked a firearm that they figure they can easily argue is not designed or necessary to defend ones home and family. If they win this one, they will move on to the next firearm.

It is the mandatory confiscation that is the most troubling. If that is upheld as being legal to do, they will attach it to an all out AWB later.

 

[briangsxr600]

This is just one more reason they want to make it mandatory to register all firearms. That way they a list to be able to go door to door to legally steal whatever weapon it is at that particular time till they have them all.

 

[chris in va]

I really don't understand what CA .gov is afraid of with the 50. It hasn't been used in any sort of shooting incident.

My friend lives in Lodi. He says it's a great state except for the cesspool of officials taxing and regulating it's residents to death.

 

[Freelance Tax Collector]

I know we wanted them to have a Vietnam too but I think we should have left that one alone.

We did exactly what needed to be done, we just didn't apply any "follow through".

 

[Foofles]

I couldn't find anything in there that specifies rifles only. So does this also include hadguns? No more S&W 500's or Desert Eagle 50's ?

According to the bill:

24. "50-CALIBER WEAPON" MEANS A RIFLE CAPABLE OF FIRING A  CENTER-FIRE
    2  CARTRIDGE  IN 50-CALIBER OR LARGER, .50 BMG CALIBER OR LARGER, ANY OTHER
    3  VARIANT OF 50-CALIBER OR LARGER, OR ANY OTHER METRIC EQUIVALENT OF  SUCH
    4  CALIBER,  PROVIDED,  HOWEVER,  THAT NOTHING IN THIS SUBDIVISION SHALL BE
    5  CONSTRUED  TO  INCLUDE ANY MUZZLE LOADING RIFLE OR SHOTGUN WITH A RIFLED
    6  BORE.

So it looks like blackpowder .50s, pistols, and shotguns are all safe from this. However it does include any other 50 calibers like .50DTC, or any dimensional (possibly ballistic) equivalent.

Anyway, I'm in NY and this bill just makes me ... . I'm reading it and the wording makes me sick, like these .50 CALIBER WEAPONS are something other than firearms and "have no acceptable purpose.... such weapons pose such an imminent threat and danger to the safety and security of the people..." Etc. Etc. They throw in all kinds of assorted buzz words. I will be writing my state representatives promptly, if it amounts to anything will be something to be seen.

You know what else gets me? The droning on about "WITH INTENT TO USE UNLAWFULLY AGAINST ANOTHER" ... Eh?

Not to mention this little gem:

[(2) such person] (4) possesses five or more firearms; or

It's also a felony to simply fire the .50, much less own it. What's with the redundant laws.... it's already illegal to kill someone, why do we need a law for "CRIMINAL USE OF a 50 CALIBER WEAPON IN THE FIRST DEGREE" ? Just to further demonize the firearm I guess...

 

[Eric F]

What about the other 50's

like 50-70 sharps or 50-90 sharps 56-50 spencer and the few winchester 50 cals? Will those get banned under this proposed 50 cal ban? They meet the 50 cla centerfire or larger clause but these are low pressure black powder rounds. Also looks like the 500 smith is out the door too.

 

[Foofles]

Yep, those are all centerfire right?