SMG In Family Trunk

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Husker1911

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I'm awaiting more info on this story, but the Omaha World Herald today published a story of a family finding a Reising SMG amongst other memorabilia their late father had left behind. I hope the family isn't unwittingly in serious trouble with the Feds, the BATFE specifically.

"For decades, two sturdy trunks sat undisturbed in an Omaha basement, hidden behind cardboard boxes, covered with dusty blankets.
After Gene Helget died in December, his family found two forgotten trunks in the basement full of World War II mementos. His daughter, Patsy Kravchuk, is pictured with a photograph of the young Navy lieutenant and items found inside the trunk, including a flag that may have flown on Helget's ship during such key moments as the fight for Iwo Jima.

Children played pingpong nearby, Christmas decorations were removed and replaced, and the trunks were mostly ignored until Gene Helget died.

Last December, with Gene gone, his family decided to open them.

"I think it was curiosity that drove us to finally open them up," said Patsy Kravchuk, his daughter.

Helget's wife, Kerrie, and the children found an unexpected connection to a husband and father, a reminder of the Navy veteran's role in history.

They found a flag, torn, battered and faded, likely from months of flying on a ship in the Pacific. The trunk included an early model submachine gun, a hand-written Japanese tactical poster covered with diagrams of naval vessels, plus dozens of smaller items from Helget's daily life in World War II."

"The Helgets plan to work with museum officials to find a public home for much of the trunk's contents.

The machine gun, a Reising Model 55, is a particularly rare find, historians said. It was widely distributed to Marines early in the war but often performed poorly in the jungle conditions of the Pacific Theater. Many were discarded or destroyed as a result.

"It's certainly an exciting weapon to find," Castro said.

The Marine Corps museum, scheduled to open to the public this fall, has more than 4,000 historical weapons but only a handful of Reising Model 55s, Castro said."

http://www.omaha.com/index.php?u_pg=1638&u_sid=2179422
(Requires registration.)
 
The machine gun, a Reising Model 55, is a particularly rare find, historians said. It was widely distributed to Marines early in the war but often performed poorly in the jungle conditions of the Pacific Theater. Many were discarded or destroyed as a result.
If I understand correctly, that gun would be nontransferrable right? So it's would be either destroyed or at the best case, demilled for static display only.

What a shame...
 
Too bad they didn't have enough of an understanding of the laws and implications of their find to just close the lid and keep their mouth's shut.

I can't imagine the rage I would feel at seeing federal agents come take an heirloom like that away to be destroyed.
 
Hopefully, some brass in the Marines will see something about, pull strings to supersede BATFE, and send a Marine guard to escort the intact weapon to its rightful place in the museum with its family connections on a plaque.

If anyone knows any higher-ups in the Marines, I'd suggest spreading word about this, to make sure it happens like that?

If it was originally military property, couldn't the military literally "confiscate it" (nudge nudge wink), as official property and put it in the museum with no damage done to it? What objections could BATFE pull if the Marines literally said "It's the property of the United States Armed Forces, we're retaking possession of it?" Can't stop the military from having machine guns, can they?

I'd been thinking about that, that it would be nice if the various branches could establish a "military relic turn-in" hotline that would supersede BATFE, to preserve such history. That if someone found something that was indeed rare and historically valuable but absolutely prohibited to own by current laws, they could call and have the military take it from them, intact, for secured display with their family name, rather than BATFE's goons coming to destroy it.
 
As I understand it, MGs can be donated to museums affiliated with the state or national government. The Marine museum mentioned should qualify, as would other military museums.

It could also be dontated to a police department. If so, it could never be transferred to civilians again.
It doesn't necessarily have to be demilled in either case.

There is also the possibility that the Reising was legally registered at one time.
I've read that military papers have sometimes been accepted as registration papers. (I can't remember where I found this just somewhere on this site, www.subguns.com.)

There was also an amnesty in 1968. It may have been registered then and then put back in the trunk.
Those possiblities should at least be checked out.

(I am no lawyer, and don't even play one on TV. I have done some reading on this subject, however.)
 
I've read that military papers have sometimes been accepted as registration papers.
In WWII, there were "passes" issued to returning GI's for war tropies - my late father had a stack of them he used when some stateside MP REMF's (or whatever the term was in 1945) tried to appropriate some of his souvenirs . . . even so, things got tense until the stateside MPs came to realize there were only a handful of them vs. a couple of hundred increasingly irate COMBAT VETERANS that they were NOT going to intimidate or delay for long..

Dad kept his souvenirs, and so did the other guys.

Thing is, passes were not issued for things like machine guns, grenades, explosives, and other like items. Not saying a few didn't make it home, but these were strictly through unofficial channels. (Maybe things were different if you had enough rank.)

I remember Dad telling me about some Nambu machine guns shipped home which were lost in transit. He - I mean, the GI who sent them, whoever it may have been - decided it wouldn't be wise to inquire. ;)
 
I'd love to see a Marine...any Marine, officially circumvent Federal Law. When that guy shows up in his dress blues, somebody please get a pic!
 
I know the Marine Museum in Quantico has accepted and received unregistered MG's in the past that would otherwise have had to be destroyed. One of the curators there used to post on jouster.com. I don't know if he's still there or not. (Sounded liked a great job btw, most of their stuff still worked and every now and then they'd take something, like a 1917 German Maxim, out and run some rounds throught it)

My understanding is that you if you have an unregistered MG, you can't just give it to *any* museum, but only to museums that meet specific criteria. I believe most Fed museums meet that criteria, but I'm unsure about state museums or private museums. In effect, when you give up a MG to the Federal museum, you are surrendering it to the government. Heck, the ATF maintains an agency museum as well.
 
How can a Reising be considered a SMG when it cannot get throught a round or two without a malf. of some kind. :D But I digress.

Yet another piece of history that will be raped due to our stupid laws. God how I wish we would stop flipping out over things and start going after real lawbreakers.
 
There have been several instances where I know war trophy guns and other unregistered MG's have been amnestied back into the transferrable ranks.

I can count at least 7 I know of where old, collectable, and valuable firearms were "papered" 1 commercial Thompson, 2 commercial BAR's, a MG34, a M-3 Greasegun, a Vickers, and a USN marked Lewis gun. The Thompson and BAR's were bought at a hardware store in MPLS by a man who managed payroll for a large Iron Mine and during the depression decided that keeping that money under his control needed some firepower.
I believe either a private bill Act of Congress was invoked or it was just the pressure of a US senator who was the survivors friend, but they were papered and remain in private hands. I believe the Vickers and Lewis gun went to a museum of either the Coast Guard or US customs as they were involved in rum running on Superior. The Mg 34 and the M3 were as far as i know papered as war trophys.

I know the lawyer who handled those cases, If you have something like this, the best way is to shut your mouth and hire an atty on the basis he can talk and not reveal his client under atty/ client privelige. I know the same atty has handled a couple of large drug "sales" to the authorities. Someone has either found, or somehow come into possession of a quantity of drugs, being a legal minded person, and wanting to get rid of the drugs, yet being aware of the value of the drugs, has "sold" them to the authorities. Call it a reward for turning in contra band or call it selling drugs to the authorities, this happens a few times a year.
 
About 20 years ago there was a story like this from England written in the American Riflemen. A veteran of both WWI and WWII passed away. When he enlisted for WWI he was issued a Enfield and memorized the serial number. He came home a decorated slodier and raised a family. WWII breaks out. Now in his 40's he reenlists and is issued a scoped Enfiield as a sniper, it's the same serial number. He goes through the WWII and comes out a decorated soldier again. Now in the 1950's he reads a sporting magazine about hunting in Africa and see's an ad for a scoped Enfield like he had turned in after the war. He buys one and guess what it's the same serial number in the fitted wood case as he turned it in after WWII. Three times the same serial number, whats the odds of that. But laws have changed in England and the gun is outlawed.
The family wanted to keep the heirloom but they had to render it useless by demilling it.
 
Harve Curry said:
About 20 years ago there was a story like this from England written in the American Riflemen. A veteran of both WWI and WWII passed away. When he enlisted for WWI he was issued a Enfield and memorized the serial number. He came home a decorated slodier and raised a family. WWII breaks out. Now in his 40's he reenlists and is issued a scoped Enfiield as a sniper, it's the same serial number. He goes through the WWII and comes out a decorated soldier again. Now in the 1950's he reads a sporting magazine about hunting in Africa and see's an ad for a scoped Enfield like he had turned in after the war. He buys one and guess what it's the same serial number in the fitted wood case as he turned it in after WWII. Three times the same serial number, whats the odds of that. But laws have changed in England and the gun is outlawed.
The family wanted to keep the heirloom but they had to render it useless by demilling it.

Why would a (Long?) Lee-Enfield be illegal? You can still buy them here (And any other bolt-action rifle up to .50BMG), provided that the owner has a valid firearms license. Maybe nobody in the family had, or wanted to obtain said license.
 
I know of a similar story with a Browning .30 on a tripod. A call was made to the local army base museum, and it was "returned" to the Army to be put on display.
And that's all I can say about the subject.......................

Still trying to figure out what happened to the case of Garands that were found :banghead:
 
Hoping help is on the way

I just forwarded this thread to a buddy who is a Major in the Marine Corps. Hopefully someone from the USMC will step up and save this Reising from being destroyed...
 
Some NFA war trophies or "bring backs" were papered with
the military authorizing the owner to have it, and in some
cases have been recognised as legal and put on the NFA
registry. Plus, an heir of a properly papered NFA weapon
can have the registration transfered tax-free.

These folks need to be put in contact with someone
who knows all the ins-and-outs of NFA gun laws,.
BATF enforcement agents often do not know the fine
points of legal NFA ownership and are only interested in
"taking these guns off the streets."
 
Cromlech ,
I don't know. It was written in a American Riflemen magazine (1980's) as a true account, that a law effecting it had been passed.
I'm sorry I don't remember the man's name.
 
I am surprised that we don't see more of these type stories as the WW2 vets pass on.

I'm not. Not all deceased vets' offspring have subpar IQ's.:rolleyes:

On the other hand, a Reising isn't a particularly functional weapon. It's probably worth more in a museum than anywhere else. But some other pieces...
 
On the other hand, a Reising isn't a particularly functional weapon. It's probably worth more in a museum than anywhere else.

Actually, Reisings run just fine in Civvie hands. They weren't good in the Pacific, and won't run when they are full of sand or debris, but they work just fine on the range. If you ever get a chance to own one, don't llet their war-time rep turn you away. I wouldn't take one to war, but it would make a fine range toy.

Btw, anyone remember the story about the guy around Chicago who found a 1928 Thompson SMG in house when he knocked down a wall during renovations? I think it was posted here a year or so ago. I woulda been tempted to just put it back and plaster the wall back up.
 
Btw, anyone remember the story about the guy around Chicago who found a 1928 Thompson SMG in house when he knocked down a wall during renovations? I think it was posted here a year or so ago. I woulda been tempted to just put it back and plaster the wall back up.

My family was liberated by the allies in WW II, and I've never owned a home built before 1978. So I've never had such things in trunks, walls, or anywhere else.

But it is my understanding that many people who find such things do keep their big mouths shut, as the original owner of the Thompson in Chicago would no doubt have admonished them to do.:p
 
Why would a (Long?) Lee-Enfield be illegal? You can still buy them here (And any other bolt-action rifle up to .50BMG), provided that the owner has a valid firearms license. Maybe nobody in the family had, or wanted to obtain said license.

I suspect the story has gotten muddled with time. It would have been a Short Lee, and having it be converted to a sniper configuration before/during WWII would be unusual in the extreme. SMLEs were not used much as snipers except by the Aussies.

Could have been a P14/No. 3. Particularly if the fellow was in the Home Guard.
 
Btw, anyone remember the story about the guy around Chicago who found a 1928 Thompson SMG in house when he knocked down a wall during renovations? I think it was posted here a year or so ago. I woulda been tempted to just put it back and plaster the wall back up.

I would have been tempted to re-plaster that wall with the M1928 in my toolbox or some other suitable container.

Unless I owned the house.

Then I would have been real tempted to put it back in a place, and condition, where though it would remain operatable if retrieved, would also have nothing on it or associated with it that could be traced to me or even a time after I purchased that house (difficult, but not impossible).
 
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