"Weird Sign at NRA Convention in Orlando" ???

[Stu Gotts]

NRA

The same type sign was there when we went to the Orange Co Convention Center for the Shot Show. I did not see any metal detectors on the entrances. I don't think they would have known if you where carrying or not! Stu

 

[benewton]

We had the same problem around here a few years back, with one of the local gun shows displaying such a sign just after the entry, although, per usual, without a metal detector.

I tend to follow the rules, of course, and had to leave the USPc in the truck, not a happy thing to do.

The local liberal rag (Concord Monitor, if interested) promptly highlighted the situation, and so, no sign since.

As a giggle, I always thought that probibiting the CCW while allowing the loaded mags in was idiot.

Anyway, if it wasn't forced by local law, it does make one question how serious the NRA really is, doesn't it?

 

[Aikibiker]

This actually made the rules here in Central Florida. The NRA representative (a pretty blonde) said that the rule was the convention center's and not the NRA's. She also said that since the convention center was private property, that it was there right to do what ever they wanted.

This sign was blatant discrimination as well.
I went to a comic book convention at the same center earlier in the year and there was no sign. I looked around for one.

Seminole, I believe the laws have changed since you have been to Florida. When I took the permit course last year we were taught that a business could place a sign forbidding carrying a weapon on their property and it would invalidate the permit. The relevant statue was also quoted, but I can't remember it right now. All of the local gunshows have signs at the entrances. Although the show I went to this weekend in St. Augustine wasn't posted.

Regards,

 

[benewton]

You know, of course, that you shouldn't attend any gathering which fails to allow you to protect yourself.

And, that would include the NRA.

I may be a member, but I wonder sometimes....

 

[Seminole]

Aikibiker wrote:

Seminole, I believe the laws have changed since you have been to Florida. When I took the permit course last year we were taught that a business could place a sign forbidding carrying a weapon on their property and it would invalidate the permit.

Nope. I haven't been gone from the Sunshine year for a year yet--at any rate, the relevent Florida statutes are on-line for your perusal at Florida Statutes. I quote from the 2002 Florida Statutes, Title XLVI, Chapter 790.06 (12)

No license issued pursuant to this section shall authorize any person to carry a concealed weapon or firearm into any place of nuisance as defined in s. 823.05 ; any police, sheriff, or highway patrol station; any detention facility, prison, or jail; any courthouse; any courtroom, except that nothing in this section would preclude a judge from carrying a concealed weapon or determining who will carry a concealed weapon in his or her courtroom; any polling place; any meeting of the governing body of a county, public school district, municipality, or special district; any meeting of the Legislature or a committee thereof; any school, college, or professional athletic event not related to firearms; any school administration building; any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose; any elementary or secondary school facility; any area technical center; any college or university facility unless the licensee is a registered student, employee, or faculty member of such college or university and the weapon is a stun gun or nonlethal electric weapon or device designed solely for defensive purposes and the weapon does not fire a dart or projectile; inside the passenger terminal and sterile area of any airport, provided that no person shall be prohibited from carrying any legal firearm into the terminal, which firearm is encased for shipment for purposes of checking such firearm as baggage to be lawfully transported on any aircraft; or any place where the carrying of firearms is prohibited by federal law. Any person who willfully violates any provision of this subsection commits a misdemeanor of the second degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083.

While it is always possible for property owners to charge you with trespassing, you must first refuse to leave WHEN ASKED. But of course, first they would have to realize you were carrying (in which case the weapon would not be concealed anyway--and Florida law frowns on such lack of concealment), then they would have to ask you to leave, and then you would have to refuse to leave. It is NOT illegal in Florida to carry concealed solely because someone has posted a sign saying "No Concealed Weapons" or something to that effect.

 

[Aikibiker]

The last gunshow I went to in Orlando had a sign listing a statute. I can't remember it though and I haven't been able to find anything in the 790 section either. Perhaps the statute is under the section of the law covering trespassing.

Sounds like a thread all in itself. Do you want to post in legal and political or shall I?

I really would like to be proved wrong on this. I don't like being disarmed because of some silly sign.

 

[Seminole]

Aikibiker,

My bet is that the statute listed at the show was Title XLVI, Chapter 790.06 (12). A hospital in Tallahassee that I know of has a sign up to the effect that "weapons are prohibited persuant to Florida law. . . " and lists that section of the statutes. Of course, nothing in that statute says that a CCL holder can't carry in a hospital, but the hospital is banking on people not knowing this.

As for trespassing, one isn't guilty of that particular offense until after refusing a direct request to leave the premises.

As for a new thread, feel free if you like.

 

[David]

Did any THR member attend the NRA convention in Orlando and actually see the "no guns except LEOs" sign in question?

I wonder if the convention center only puts up the sign for
gun-related events -- i.e. SHOT SHOW and NRA meeting?

 

[Captain]

I was there and I saw it. I figured it wasn't a problem since I am a sheriff's deputy in my home state. Then I went to the Heston tribute in the Convention Center on Friday night and was turned away by law enforcement. I notified them that was armed and showed my badge and ID and was told I was not permitted inside during the tribute while I was armed. This is the NRA at work here. Why the metal detectors when Heston is on stage and not during the show??? I e mailed the NRA already and am anxiously awaiting a response!

 

[4v50 Gary]

They did the same thing in the convention at Reno, NV.

 

[Jeff OTMG]

Yep, sounds like the same sign on the steel easel that was at the SHOT Show. I ignored it then since it is unenforcable and would have ignored it at the NRA Show as well.

 

[David]

Really, I still cannot believe such a "no guns except for LEOs" sign would appear at a NRA convention!

In my opinion, it's like having a Senior Citizen meeting with a sign stating "No One Over 65 Allowed."

Am I wrong?

:banghead: :banghead:

 

[thrifty7]

Gun Free NRA meetings

This situation has perplexed me for a while but I now think I understand what we are up against. The NRA meetings are just a highly ironic example....everywhere we are seeing legislatures pass shall-issue laws and then nearly negate their value by creating such a complicated set of restrictions that a person must plan his day very carefully or run the risk of winding up in jail for exercising his "right". The problem is that too many of the "average citizens" beleive that allowing their neighbors to carry is quite dangerous, but that not allowing law abiding citizens to be armed at all is even more dangerous. We have a huge public relations job to do. We must convince a large number of voters that legally armed citizens are not a bunch of accidents waiting to happen. I thought that we had done so when the states began to pass ccw permit laws, but now I am convinced that fear of crime, not trust of permit holders, is the primary reason for these laws. We need good, accurate statistics and we need to spend millions of dollars on public relations. I sure wish I knew how to make it happen.

 

[Seminole]

The NRA meetings are just a highly ironic example....everywhere we are seeing legislatures pass shall-issue laws and then nearly negate their value by creating such a complicated set of restrictions that a person must plan his day very carefully or run the risk of winding up in jail for exercising his "right".

This is most certainly NOT the case in Florida. The places one cannont carry are listed in the statute mandating Shall Issue CCL. A convention center, whether the NRA is meeting there or not, is not one of these few places. Putting up a sign cannot make CCL unlawful in Florida.

I repeat. If the sign was there--and we have at least on THR member so far who attests to it, so it seems to have been there--it was there because the NRA wanted it there even though it had no legal effect.

The long and the short of it seems to be that the NRA does not support CCL (or if it does, its attitude is "not in MY backyard."

 

[Frohickey]

I see a common occurrence here with the NO CCW sign just outside the building the NRA Annual Meeting is to be held.

Nevermind that they usually hold them in gun-friendly states. I saw the NO CCW sign in Reno, NV last year. And others here have said the same thing on other NRA Annual Meetings.

Seems that the NRA needs to own up and say if they protested that the sign NOT be put up or not. The statement about the sign being put up by the Convention Center is a cop-out.

 

[David]

Has anyone heard from the NRA about their explanation of the "no guns excerpt for LEOs" sign?

I would love to hear their side of this story!

 

[starfuryzeta]

As a Florida resident and CCW holder, I cannot find any listing of changes to FS 790 that would allow posting of a sign to invalidate the CCW (except in the already listed places). Only thing they can do is ask you to leave....and if you are stupid enough to refuse, its armed tresspassing.

I use the following as a general guideline (and a good read for Florida residents):
http://www.floridafirearmslaw.com

Here are the updates as of 01/2003:
http://www.floridafirearmslaw.com/bookupdate.shtml

 

[FTG-05]

I work security every 6 months at Knob Creek during the 3 day Machine Gun Shoot. The owners are very adament that only LEO's and security carry.

Does that make them anti-gun? No, not in my opinion.

When I went to the NRA show in Seattle several, several years ago, I carried and didn't notice any signs banning it. Same with the Nashville show about 8 years ago.

Albin

 

[Mike Irwin]

"So none of the cops that are allowed to carry might be a Anti ? As a general rule Cops are no more level headed and deserveing of trust than a normal person."

Crystal Brame could probably attest to that fact.

Could have, if her husband, chief of police of the Tacoma, Washington, police hadn't mortally wounded her before killing himself with his service weapon...