who says "no lead in glocks", I see no reason not.
- Thread starter beeenbag
- Start date
- Status
barnetmill
Member
- Joined
- Jun 6, 2006
- Messages
- 1,264
Some have suggested the purchase of an aftermarket barrel. I have in the past purchased a 9 mm LW for a glock 33 for caliber conversion. It worked perfectly. But recently with another forum that I frequent a question over LW QC has arisen over LW slides that were being setup with RMR (Rugged Miniature Reflex sights). Basically they cancelled all orders for futures slides of the QC issue. What was not clear if the new lack of slide QC extended to LW barrels QC.
Anyway I have read enough here and elsewhere that I would shoot midrange lead loads in my 9mm glocks w OEM barrels but with constant cleaning and monitoring of the barrel.
PS my 9mm glocks so far have not had problems with steel ammo and the same is true of my S&W.
Relative to function the Glocks are the the AK of pistols. Simple in operation controls and they just keep going. I have a second one I picked up for RMR installation and it appears it was never cleaned. It functions flawlessly other than the trigger is gritty. I am installing a new trigger connector and I will detail clean it during the installation of the Ghost Rocket connector.
Anyway I have read enough here and elsewhere that I would shoot midrange lead loads in my 9mm glocks w OEM barrels but with constant cleaning and monitoring of the barrel.
PS my 9mm glocks so far have not had problems with steel ammo and the same is true of my S&W.
Relative to function the Glocks are the the AK of pistols. Simple in operation controls and they just keep going. I have a second one I picked up for RMR installation and it appears it was never cleaned. It functions flawlessly other than the trigger is gritty. I am installing a new trigger connector and I will detail clean it during the installation of the Ghost Rocket connector.
Harley Quinn
Member
I have felt in the past, and still feel, the best avenue, is to buy an after market barrel
Last edited:
LiveLife
Member
There are several issues with shooting lead reloads in factory Glock barrels but it can be done with proper bullet/powder/charge/inspection of fouling and leading build up.
This has been my experience:
- Glock barrels have longer leade (space the bullet jumps from the case neck to the start of rifling) than many other factory/aftermarket barrels that allows more high pressure gas to leak around the bullet. This will result in more gas cutting and likely to blow liquefied lube off the surface of the lead bullet out the barrel leaving the bullet naked. Glock barrels tolerate longer OAL rounds so you can try longer OAL that won't exceed SAAMI max and see if fouling/lead smearing at the chamber end decreases.
- Glock barrels have very smooth rounded hills/valleys rifling that will aggravate this problem and cause fouling/lead smearing at the chamber end of the barrel with certain hardness bullet/powder/charge combinations (if the bullet base don't expand/deform to seal with the barrel). I have used higher powder charges to achieve this but if the bullet hardness is high (21-24 BHN), you may need to use high to near max load data charges.
- I have gotten this fouling/lead smearing at the chamber end of the barrel with certain bullet/powder/charge combinations so now I inspect the barrel frequently to see if the particular bullet/powder charge causes fouling/lead smearing build up (typically around 200-300 rounds). If you are shooting a new bullet/powder/charge combination, inspect the barrel after about 10-15 rounds to see if you have any fouling/lead deposit in the barrel. If you do, you may need to adjust bullet/powder/charge until you don't.
- When I shoot lead reloads in my factory Glock barrels, I take a mini cleaning kit and clean out any fouling/lead smearing deposit in the barrel with my 200-300 round inspection. I now use 18 BHN Missouri Bullet in 9mm/40S&W and get none to very minimal deposit with mid to high range load data of W231/HP-38. I still inspect my barrels every 200-300 rounds out of habit as it is very easy to field strip Glocks and put the barrel back in if there is no deposit.
It is my opinion that some people take the notion "Glocks never need cleaning" too literally and allow the fouling/lead build up in the barrel that may result in over pressure/rupture of case base. After each range session, I always field strip to clean the barrel of my Glocks and lightly lube rail slide points and barrel contact areas.
If you want to shoot a lot of lead reloads with less worry, Lone Wolf barrels I use came with tight groove diameter (.355" for 9mm and .400" for 40S&W), shorter leade, traditional land/groove rifling and fully supported chambers. They have just about the tightest chambers I know that prevent/minimize case bulges and allow easier resizing of spent cases.
Be safe but do enjoy your Glocks, even with lead reloads.
This has been my experience:
- Glock barrels have longer leade (space the bullet jumps from the case neck to the start of rifling) than many other factory/aftermarket barrels that allows more high pressure gas to leak around the bullet. This will result in more gas cutting and likely to blow liquefied lube off the surface of the lead bullet out the barrel leaving the bullet naked. Glock barrels tolerate longer OAL rounds so you can try longer OAL that won't exceed SAAMI max and see if fouling/lead smearing at the chamber end decreases.
- Glock barrels have very smooth rounded hills/valleys rifling that will aggravate this problem and cause fouling/lead smearing at the chamber end of the barrel with certain hardness bullet/powder/charge combinations (if the bullet base don't expand/deform to seal with the barrel). I have used higher powder charges to achieve this but if the bullet hardness is high (21-24 BHN), you may need to use high to near max load data charges.
- I have gotten this fouling/lead smearing at the chamber end of the barrel with certain bullet/powder/charge combinations so now I inspect the barrel frequently to see if the particular bullet/powder charge causes fouling/lead smearing build up (typically around 200-300 rounds). If you are shooting a new bullet/powder/charge combination, inspect the barrel after about 10-15 rounds to see if you have any fouling/lead deposit in the barrel. If you do, you may need to adjust bullet/powder/charge until you don't.
- When I shoot lead reloads in my factory Glock barrels, I take a mini cleaning kit and clean out any fouling/lead smearing deposit in the barrel with my 200-300 round inspection. I now use 18 BHN Missouri Bullet in 9mm/40S&W and get none to very minimal deposit with mid to high range load data of W231/HP-38. I still inspect my barrels every 200-300 rounds out of habit as it is very easy to field strip Glocks and put the barrel back in if there is no deposit.
It is my opinion that some people take the notion "Glocks never need cleaning" too literally and allow the fouling/lead build up in the barrel that may result in over pressure/rupture of case base. After each range session, I always field strip to clean the barrel of my Glocks and lightly lube rail slide points and barrel contact areas.
If you want to shoot a lot of lead reloads with less worry, Lone Wolf barrels I use came with tight groove diameter (.355" for 9mm and .400" for 40S&W), shorter leade, traditional land/groove rifling and fully supported chambers. They have just about the tightest chambers I know that prevent/minimize case bulges and allow easier resizing of spent cases.
Be safe but do enjoy your Glocks, even with lead reloads.
Last edited:
dwhite
Member
I shoot lead. Never had a problem. Matter of fact any lead that does remain in the barrel cleans out easier that lead in any of my cut rifling barrels. Works in mine and I'll continue to do so.
All the Best,
D. White
All the Best,
D. White
stonecutter2
Member
Having shot 22LR through my Walther TPH, and seeing that little barrel look "okay" until I shove a patch through with a jag and get lines of lead out, I don't trust my eyes to see lead buildup. For the little TPH barrel, the grooves are pretty small. But the "grooves" in a Glock barrel are very, very small. There is not a large margin of error there. Once you're about to smooth bore with lead buildup, the next deposit may be enough to build up too much pressure. That will bulge the barrel and bad things can happen. Just because it might not have happened to someone doesn't mean it's safe. It can just be luck. Sometimes luck runs out.
I decided to just buy plated bullets for reloading, or if I really want to shoot lead, I'll buy a Lone Wolf barrel and drop it into the Glock. I'd rather spend $99 and feel a bit safer than blow up my $450 Glock. My hands/face/arms/etc are worth far more than $99.
I decided to just buy plated bullets for reloading, or if I really want to shoot lead, I'll buy a Lone Wolf barrel and drop it into the Glock. I'd rather spend $99 and feel a bit safer than blow up my $450 Glock. My hands/face/arms/etc are worth far more than $99.
R.W.Dale
Member
Plated bullets are equally dangerous as cast in a glock so you're not gaining anything with through their use.
Why? Because the manual says so recommending against ANY "un jacketed" bullets and plated definitely aren't jacketed.
Tapatalk post via IPhone.
Why? Because the manual says so recommending against ANY "un jacketed" bullets and plated definitely aren't jacketed.
Tapatalk post via IPhone.
Skylerbone
Member
I always get a chuckle out of that signature line. Maybe for this thread it should be "I don't always risk my fingers and eyes with my Glock but when I do I prefer LSWCs."
OP
OP
beeenbag
Member
I prefer CN thank you very much!
But the manual says......
How are they not jacketed? Is it because the word 'jacket' doesn't appear in their description?
So no Gold Dots or Speer TMJ's either?
No handloading?
No Blazer?
Maybe it's best to just not shoot it at all.
Wow.
SharpsDressedMan
member
Take a good, sharp knife, and shave a jacketed bullet. Then take a plated bullet, and shave it. Then take a lead bullet and shave it. You will quickly see WHY a plated bullet might be just as likly to chip, flake, scrape, and otherwise deposit copper flaked lead chips and shards inside a weapon ALMOST as much as a lead bullet sheds lead. Copper plated bullets are PRETTIER than lead bullets, and do REDUCE leading in most guns, and maybe even prevent it in some guns (with the higher end plated bullets). You sometimes get what you pay for, though, and the people that buy true jacketed bullets usually get better results (re. avoiding leading, accuracy) than plated bullet users.
Well, after many thousands of plated bullets through my Glocks and other guns, the only problem I've had is one stuck bullet in the bore from using too light a starting charge with a .357 plated DEWC. Other than that, no leading, clean shooting, and good accuracy in revolvers and auto's. 9mm, .38 Super, .357/.38, 10, 10mm, 45 Colt & 45 auto.
Try the new hollow base, thick plated bullets from Berry's. Good stuff in my Glocks, especially with land and groove conversion barrels.
Try the new hollow base, thick plated bullets from Berry's. Good stuff in my Glocks, especially with land and groove conversion barrels.
I suspect based off speaking with a Glock Factory tech and the evidence that is out there, however sporadic that Glock went with the no reload/lead bullets for the liability factor out there, particularly with their early Generation 1, and 2 Pistols. (Also the unsupported chambers, remember those? Hence why lots of us have a bulge remover for our reloading kits) I think that there was instances of pistols blowing up early on due to the perfect storm of lead hardness, powder, velocity, cleaning and the barrels that came off the assembly line that day. That being said talking with one of their factory techs again, stating that jacked loads are fine so long as they are in spec, but any lead munitions, Factory or otherwise are not to be used in a glock barrel. Is it overkill? Yep. Is it probably CYA? Yep, but I also did several years as an Armorer/Direct Support Repairman for the Army. There are things that I was saying or advising that I would contend with, however there also was significant issues or things I mentioned that were indeed a concern and there was reasons why you did something in a specific way, or not do in a specific way.
Me? I dropped the hundred bucks on an aftermarket barrel. I considered it cheap insurance for lead usage, vs the cost of a 500 pistol, plus the use of my right hand, arm, left hand, arm, and eyes/ears/face.
Again, this could be a matter of some barrels exhibit leading to dangerously unsafe levels. It may not be all of them, or only due to a particular set of circumstances. Shoot Lead or any reloads at your own risk. While there is a lot of "google" reports out there and google information sages I have seen what others have in accurate reports. Some barrels will lead unusually and in a potentially dangerous way. It may not be your barrel. Do what you feel comfortable with, but its you that has to live with it if something goes wrong. Like it is with anything else out there.
Me? I dropped the hundred bucks on an aftermarket barrel. I considered it cheap insurance for lead usage, vs the cost of a 500 pistol, plus the use of my right hand, arm, left hand, arm, and eyes/ears/face.
Again, this could be a matter of some barrels exhibit leading to dangerously unsafe levels. It may not be all of them, or only due to a particular set of circumstances. Shoot Lead or any reloads at your own risk. While there is a lot of "google" reports out there and google information sages I have seen what others have in accurate reports. Some barrels will lead unusually and in a potentially dangerous way. It may not be your barrel. Do what you feel comfortable with, but its you that has to live with it if something goes wrong. Like it is with anything else out there.
WinThePennant
Member
I'm always confounded by people who want to use something as expensive and important as a gun in ways that are in direct contradiction from the maker's suggestions.
I wouldn't shoot lead bullets out of a Glock for the same reason why I don't stick butter knives into light sockets.
I wouldn't shoot lead bullets out of a Glock for the same reason why I don't stick butter knives into light sockets.
Six
Member
So you never shoot reloaded ammo or cheapo surplus ammo?
You never carry it in the ready to fire condition?
You never store or carry the gun loaded?
Because the manual posted on page 1 says that you mustn't do any of those things.
Unlike the unjacketed thing, which is only a recommendation.
You never carry it in the ready to fire condition?
You never store or carry the gun loaded?
Because the manual posted on page 1 says that you mustn't do any of those things.
Unlike the unjacketed thing, which is only a recommendation.
nofishbob
Member
Again, remember that Glock, along with most other manufacturers, also recommends against using ANY reloaded ammunition.
I see a disconnect with the posters who say "Glock prohibits lead bullets and they know best, so no lead bullets for me" but then reload jacketed bullets and shoot them in their Glock.
Either you believe all of what the manufacturer says or you really don't have a very good argument against shooting lead bullets beyond personal preference.
Like I stated in an earlier post, people who don't want to shoot lead bullets in a Glock barrel should not do so. Many others, myself included, do so safely, and have for years, in many different Glocks, shooting thousands of rounds, with no problems. We are not mis-informed or careless or irresponsible. We have taken steps to ensure that our methods are safe.
Can every Glock owner across the entire spectrum of abilities and experience levels shoot all types of lead bullets safely in their Glock? NO! That is why Glock is correct in issuing their prohibition.
Bob
I see a disconnect with the posters who say "Glock prohibits lead bullets and they know best, so no lead bullets for me" but then reload jacketed bullets and shoot them in their Glock.
Either you believe all of what the manufacturer says or you really don't have a very good argument against shooting lead bullets beyond personal preference.
Like I stated in an earlier post, people who don't want to shoot lead bullets in a Glock barrel should not do so. Many others, myself included, do so safely, and have for years, in many different Glocks, shooting thousands of rounds, with no problems. We are not mis-informed or careless or irresponsible. We have taken steps to ensure that our methods are safe.
Can every Glock owner across the entire spectrum of abilities and experience levels shoot all types of lead bullets safely in their Glock? NO! That is why Glock is correct in issuing their prohibition.
Bob
Harley Quinn
Member
Exactly
It is something to consider, with any/all firearms and ammo
O.P.
It is your gun.
You want to fire lead bullets in the gun go ahead.
Bear in mind that decision goes against the specific recommendations of the manufacturer.
If you damage the firearm or yourself, please don't post a thread here whining and complaining about the event.
It is your gun.
You want to fire lead bullets in the gun go ahead.
Bear in mind that decision goes against the specific recommendations of the manufacturer.
If you damage the firearm or yourself, please don't post a thread here whining and complaining about the event.
OP
OP
beeenbag
Member
Buddy I swear if I have ANY and I mean ANY problems I will post it and detail exactly what happened. I plan on posting after a couple hundred lead rounds anyways letting everyone know MY experiences.
Maybe if I have a kaboom, I will be one of none that have posted so far, that have actual experience with it. You all may be in luck, or I may be one of some that posted that shoots thousands without any problems. Who knows? We will see.
R.W.Dale
Member
there I fixed it
Essentially what glock telling folks is they can only shoot winchester white box from a glock otherwize you can jump off a pier with regards to the warranty.
Otherwise you can't pick and choose what parts of the manual's ammunition warnings you want to ignore and still speak down to the rest of us from on high atop your pure white stallion
One of the main advantages to using an after-market barrel is it helps prolong the life of your brass.
Not only does does the polygonal rifling seal tighter creating higher pressure but the Glock factory chambers are rather loose to help with feeding and extraction.
This means the brass stretchs more then has to be sized back down, then stretches out there everytime it's fired. I used to have trouble with 10mm reloads with cases fired from my G20 hanging up in my Witness and not allowing it to fully return to battery.
Plus I really didn't feel comfortable using lead in the factory barrel so I invested in a KKM barrel.
Is it absolutely positively vital to get an after-market barrel?
Probably not if you are confident nothing will ever go wrong with reloads or lead buulets, but I prefer the peace of mind I get from using a normal lands and grooves barrels that give me a better margin for error.
And if it does you can always say, "oops guess I was wrong".
As far as I know no one has ever died from a KB.
Not only does does the polygonal rifling seal tighter creating higher pressure but the Glock factory chambers are rather loose to help with feeding and extraction.
This means the brass stretchs more then has to be sized back down, then stretches out there everytime it's fired. I used to have trouble with 10mm reloads with cases fired from my G20 hanging up in my Witness and not allowing it to fully return to battery.
Plus I really didn't feel comfortable using lead in the factory barrel so I invested in a KKM barrel.
Is it absolutely positively vital to get an after-market barrel?
Probably not if you are confident nothing will ever go wrong with reloads or lead buulets, but I prefer the peace of mind I get from using a normal lands and grooves barrels that give me a better margin for error.
And if it does you can always say, "oops guess I was wrong".
As far as I know no one has ever died from a KB.
R.W.Dale
Member
Yeah I wonder what the folks at glocks CS dept will think about warranty work on a gun that's been shot with an aftermarket barrel? Besides the manual says NO lead PERIOD not "no lead except for when you use another bbl"
Another warranty voider
It might be best just to not shoot the things that way you wont run afoul of glocks warranty
Another warranty voider
It might be best just to not shoot the things that way you wont run afoul of glocks warranty
Meh.....if I blow the thing up using reloads or lead I'll just take responsibilty and take my losses.
Unless you're gonna try and stick Glock for the bill if you blow it up, you can do whatever you want with it, it's your pistol.
But do us all a favor and don't expect somebody else to cover your mistakes for you.
Unless you're gonna try and stick Glock for the bill if you blow it up, you can do whatever you want with it, it's your pistol.
But do us all a favor and don't expect somebody else to cover your mistakes for you.
Last edited:
Why no steel cased ammo? I've shot hundreds of rounds through my G19 with zero issues.
rscalzo
Member
No, the manual in Section 26 Recommends No Lead. It does not Prohibit the use of lead so therefor, lead can be an acceptable ammo. Many smaller Type 6 FFL's are making custom loads for match work. One is located here and has used lead bullets. Therefor, it is a factory loaded ammo using new components. So therefor, the warranty is not voided in the least.
To say that the Glock system and lead do not work is simply ignoring the thousands of competitor shooting the system using exactly they type of bullet.
- Status
