Why does the H&K P7 have such a strong following?

[rm86]

I'm just curious, I've been reading a lot about H&K pistols and it seems that everybody raves about the P7. I'd love to hear some opinions from you THR guys who have had experience with it. It's my understanding that they are no longer made, only on occasional limited production runs. Is this correct?

 

[Steve_NEPhila]

Shoot one and you will see for yourself. Imagine a tack driver made of all steel by Germans that is damn near perfect when it comes to ergonomics and performance. Do the pepsi challenge....

 

[Balrog]

I owned one for a long time. It was very accurate. It is also bottom heavy and has a funky manual of arms. Mags are also very expensive.

It costs twice as much as a Glock 19, shoots about 10% better, and holds half the ammo. You decide if its right for you.

One thing I will tell you is the owners of the P7 are EXTREMELY sensitive to any criticism of this pistol, and will soon be by flame, defame, and otherwise abuse me. Its OK to call a P7 owner's wife ugly, but they will go ballistic if anyone suggests the P7 is anything other than the right hand of God.

 

[Ruggles]

Because you can shoot 50 rounds at the range and then heat your lunch up on the darn thing. They heat up like ovens!

They are really nice guns but to me they suck as range guns for the reason listed above.

HK still spits out limited runs now and then from what I understand. Pretty easy to find new and used on the aftermarket although they are getting more expensive.

I have owned two and sold both as they never really filled a role for me.

 

[rjrivero]

I haven't heard of any "limited production runs." The P7PSP was originally designed to meet the requirements setforth by the German Police. Then, later it was modified to the P7M8. Larger trigger guard, and heat shield along with the "American" mag release were among the changes as was the firing pin removal.

The New Jersey Police adopted it for use, as well as some other smaller police forces in the United States. The P7M13 was developed to compete for the United States Military Contract. There are other varients, developed for specific open contracts.

The gas retarded design allows for a fixed barrel to allow for greater accuracy, and for a lighter slide. It does a great job of keeping recoil at a minimum.

The big deal of the gun is that you can carry a round chambered and completely safe until it is drawn and the cocking handle "squeeze cocker" is engaged. Then it can be fired without fumbling for a safety.

I have one, but don't shoot it much. I perfer a nice wheel gun.

 

[IMTHDUKE]

They heat up like ovens

Yes, they are not for gurley men

 

[usp9]

Why does the H&K P7 have such a strong following?

They are great guns, fairly unique and easy to shoot well. They used to be more rare and that gave them some panache'.

 

[rm86]

Its OK to call a P7 owner's wife ugly, but they will go ballistic if anyone suggests the P7 is anything other than the right hand of God.

Haha I'll keep that in mind Balrog. I've heard that they do get really hot. I've also heard that because they are so heavy in the bottom that they may not sit well in some holsters. I'll have to see if there are any ranges that have one for rent around here, but I doubt it.

 

[Pizzagunner]

Simply put, it was the last H&K pistol worth its asking price. Those days went with the discontinuation of the P7.

 

[badbadtz560]

I don't have one, but I believe it's all about the "simplicity" of its usage and the very unique safety system combined together. After I graduate and get enough money for one, it's first on my list

there's no bullet in the chamber until you pick it up. Then it's ready to shoot w/ "amazing" accuracy w/ its super light trigger.

Any other firearm w/ such a light trigger requires a safety that needs to be de-activated via some means other than just pulling the gun out of its holster. Most guns nowadays just put a super heavy trigger or extra long pull and call it a day... which leads to all this preference-debating b/w when a trigger is heavy enough to be safe but still shootable... and u start running into issues w/ ppl shooting themselves in the foot or just not being able to handle the trigger pull

1911's get all the raves b/c of its awesome combat trigger right? but it loses points b/c LEOs could have trouble removing the safety. the p7 design fixed that, right?

I've also heard all these what-if stories about ppl's guns being taken and the bad guy won't know how to get the bullet in to the chamber b/c the p7 is so so unique...

either way.. try it.. then decide for yourself. Unfortunately, my only means to try it is to buy it first then decide if I like it

 

[cdsdss]

I've owned three, and loved and sold all of them. They are exceptionally well-made guns. They are stupid accurate dur to the polygonal rifling and fixed barrel. They also have the best trigger of any gun I've ever owned.

But they were--let's face it--a failed design. The squeeze-cocking mechanism, while perfectly functional, never caught on and was an answer to a question no one asked (not unlike H&K's P9S's frame-mounted hammer-cocking lever).

They're also exotic and pretty good-looking, so that adds some cache.

There's nothing wrong with the guns, but they don't really bring a lot to the party...

 

[rjrivero]

But they were--let's face it--a failed design. The squeeze-cocking mechanism, while perfectly functional, never caught on and was an answer to a question no one asked (not unlike H&K's P9S's frame-mounted hammer-cocking lever).

The on demand cocking mechanism was requisite for the German Police Request when the gun was designed.

The P9S frame mounted cocking/de-cocking lever was not the only innovative feature of the P9S. It was the first "polymer" gun, wasn't it?

I'm not exactly an HK fanboy, but they have brought a lot of things to the table.

 

[cdsdss]

Was the P9s or the VP-70 the first polymer-framed handgun? I've heard both.

I'm not knocking H&K or slamming the P7. It's a great gun for all the reasons I mentioned in my previous post. But it's also an evolutionary dead-end.

 

[Pilot]

I have a P7M8 and a German police surplus P7 PSP which I often carry. With the rght holster (an you may be suprised at the number of generic "small auto" holsters that fit it) it carres extremely well. It is thin and compact but heavy, so a good belt is a must.

Somebod did a Pro/Con on the Cult of the P7 a while back, but the Pros far out way the cons. Two of which are irrelevant but seem to pop up as the boiggest cons.

Hot claim - yes after about 50 rounds the gun heats up. Either wear a shooting glove or put it down and shoot something else for a few ninutes. In a defensive situation, this is a non-isse.

9 round capacity - The gun is sized similarly to a .380 like a Beretta M85, Walther PPK or Sig P230/232. Its thin and compact. I have no problem with 9 rounds of anything.

The guns is a little diffferent due to its squeeze cocking mechanism and gas retarding system. That is a reason I like it. All my other semi-autos operate the same way. This is different. Its also very accurate, has low felt recoil which transfers directly back into your arm with little muzzle flip due to the lowe bore axis.

The only way your going to know if you like it is to shoot one. Most people like them, a few don't.

 

[usp9]

there's no bullet in the chamber until you pick it up. Then it's ready to shoot...

badbadtz560,
You seem to be under the inpression that the cocking mechanism also loads a round from the magazine to the chamber. It does not. The squeeze cock lever cocks the striker, (and conversely decocks the striker when released), allowing the trigger to be just a trigger without having to also to do striker cocking duty.

If there's no chambered round the gun won't fire.

 

[9mmepiphany]

Was the P9s or the VP-70 the first polymer-framed handgun? I've heard both.

the VP-70 was the first pistol with a fully polymer frame...i think that is why rjrivero placed polymer inside quotation marks. the P9S had it's skeleton frame (think automotive tube chassis) covered in ploymer at the hand interface points

besides being the safest carry gun that can be brought into action quickly...cock on draw, un-cock if you release pressure or if it falls out of your hand...it has the longest barrel in it's class, without increasing package size, which when combined with it's polygonal rifling yielded the highest bullet velocities.

for the OP: i think what you are referring to as limited runs are the release of LE trade-ins that are being imported Top Gun Supply just got some more in at a great price

 

[rcmodel]

there's no bullet in the chamber until you pick it up

Say What??

Top Gun Supply just got some more in at a great price

Now, if they would just get some surplus magazines in at great prices too!
M13 mags = $90 bucks
P7 mags = $60 bucks
PSP mags = $70 bucks

rc

 

[armoredman]

We had a P7M8 at the range. Unlike the other HKs, it was a tank, ran forever, still got $600 out of it after all that abuse. I shot it several times, and I could not get used to it at all. I kept going back due to the raves, (and the free rental to range employees), but it never felt right to me.

 

[9mmepiphany]

posted by rcmodel
Now, if they would just get some surplus magazines in at great prices too!
M13 mags = $90 bucks
P7 mags = $60 bucks
PSP mags = $70 bucks

if it goes much higher, i might be convinced to sell some of my extras.

i gather you meant P7M8 mags were $60, as the official name of what we generally refer to as the PSP is really P7, while PSP pre-dated the P7 nomenclature

 

[Storm]

After reading this I went and did a quick inventory on how many P7 mags I have. I found five and am doing a happy dance as I tought I only had four. Need to get at least one more.

The P7 stands in a league of it's own. Innovative, dead accurate, a great trigger, low recoil, concealable, adequate capacity of 9mm, and dead sexy in an uber German way.

 

[maximus2161]

I have a nice P7 PSP i picked up that is in great condition. Came with a really nice Kramer Horsehide holster and spare mag, box, manual, tools, etc. I got it because I just wanted one. Its a great design, well made, and unique and it just works. No its not a range gun. But I do like it. Who knows one day I may part with it but right now I really am fond of it.

I like HKs. I have a HK P30 that is just excellent and my favorite carry gun. I also like Glocks too. I like them both different reasons. But they both work.

 

[RhinoDefense]

Trigger is excellent. Very accurate. Mild shooter due to weight. Great ergonomics. 9mm is cheap to shoot. Thin for concealment. User friendly operation. Solid engineering.

I bought mine recently as an heirloom for my son. When he gets old enough, I'm going to pass it on to him.

 

[steven58]

I own a P7 that I got from CDNN over a year ago. At just about $500 out the door, I felt it was a great bargain for the quality and history and it was virtually new in box.

The magazines are expensive but built like tanks, they will last forever.

Very accurate and easy to hit with under stress. Nice single action trigger.

For me, a great point shooting gun.

Cleaning it takes some getting used to as the insides do get dirty due to the blowback action. I just foam the whole thing scrub, flush and re lube.

Manual of arms is not that hard to acclimate to. I usually carry a compact 1911 and I'm able to use both. Hell, I can even shoot revolvers if I pay attention!

It's not a compact gun, it's a "condensed" gun. You get a full length barrel, a full size grip and all steel construction that while full weight, fits in a PPKS size box.

Mine has 3 actual uses for me:
1) It's my carry gun when I fly and don't want to risk checking my expensive compact 1911.

2) I use it with a Nemesis pocket holster in my ski jacket so I don't have to leave my pistol unattended while skiing. Only auto I'd feel safe doing that with it loaded.

3) In a Nemesis Cargo pocket holster it makes a great cold weather coat pocket gun. slim no snag and safe.

one last thing, when I first got it I showed it off to 6 friends who are avid shooters one is a LEO firearms training Sargent with 25 years in, another is a transit officer with 2 years and the rest a mix of prior military or not etc from my gun club.

With each one I did the same drill: Had one come up to the line with me, pistol is loaded and on the bench. I say "watch carefully" then I picked up the gun and fired 3 rounds, put it back on the bench and said "fire the gun" and started a stopwatch in my pocket. only one of them was able to get the pistol to fire without instruction and it took her over 2 minutes...

 

[Dobe]

for the OP: i think what you are referring to as limited runs are the release of LE trade-ins that are being imported Top Gun Supply just got some more in at a great price

HK made two limited runs of 500 after they discontinued the P7M8. During the first limited run, the slides were stamped 1 of 500, etc. I'm not sure if the same were true of the second run.

 

[jmorris]

It has no where near the quantity of followers that say the 1911, glocks or even the relatively new XD has. It is unique and somewhat rare, that is the allure.