gitarmac
Member
tag for outcome
Wife/Girlfriend is ANTI! What to do??
- Thread starter Ruger451
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Ruger451
Member
Alright, Round 3...
Let me start this by saying that I do appreciate everyone's input, but that I don't think it is necessary to bash each other for having an opinion. However, I do appreciate that you just care so much about me
. Just kidding. Oh, and this is not a psych experiment, though it would be a good one.
But really, as promised let me explain my story. As someone pointed out, I live in a house that is owned by my girlfirend's parents. My girlfriend, her sister, and I live in my girlfriend's grandmother's house, who passed away a few years back, and the house was then taken over by her parents. After graduating college, it was either move here (where I pay a fraction of the going market to live in a four bedroom house with my girlfriend) or move back home to northern Ca, and no longer live with her, which was not really an option for me.
I love my girlfriend, I have ever since my last year of high school. I am 23, as is she, and we have been living together a little over two years now. *Please no one bash me as being immoral for "living in sin", not really the point of the story, thanks*. My girlfriend is a great person; she is intelligent, funny, beautiful, and very similar to me in a myriad of ways. BUT, she hates guns. Why, you ask? Well if I could get a straight answer out of her on that one, I might not be asking this question in the first place. We both lean a little to the left on social issues, but more to the right on fiscal ones, although I (obviously) hold one particular conservative view that she does not.
Ever since I was a young boy shooting BB guns in the back yard with my friends, I have had an affinity for firearms. I always had lots of toy guns, even an uncle mike's holster that I bought at an army surplus store. I have always had a vision in my head that one day I would own a whole wall of guns, with every model that I ever wanted. Two years ago, my best friend from back home bought himself an XD-9 and invited me to go shooting with him. When I turned 21 I was more concerned with college than anything else, so my shooting desires had been moved to the back burner. But when I went to the range again for the first time in years (my father used to take my brother and I to shoot his 22's and I got my hunting licence when I was 16 or so, but used it very little), I was hooked again. I found a range in southern ca near my house and I started going, renting different handguns mostly. I even went down to LA (about two hours drive, one way) to shoot with my brother at a range that offered far more rental options. I've been back there twice and I frequent my local range about once a week, shooting 100-150 rounds a session.
Now I am ready to buy myself a handgun. I really want to get to know one particular firearm inside and out and really take pride in taking good care of it and in becoming proficient with it. And this is where my real trouble began. My girlfriend was not all that into me going to the range, but she knew she couldn't tell me no, so she let it go. However, she makes little snide jokes about guns or looks at me funny (those with experience in this will know the look I mean) when I say something particularly gun-nutty. But when I brought up ownership it was like I was asking to open the gates of hell in our living room. After riding a sea of NO's long enough, I usually give up and call it a day. I have tried to discuss the issue with her reasonably, but as others have rightly pointed out, emotional responses are hard to reason with. A major problem is that she can hold our living arangements over my head and she uses it to her advantage. She knows that her parents would agree with her (although thankfully she has not yet involved them) and since they own the house, its her way or no way. Convincing her is the only chance I've got to staying in the relationship without giving up something that makes me happy.
I am trying, and I am no where near close to running away just yet. She is a great woman, and I can see a future between us. We have had some issues in the past (mostly with my partying with friends a little too hard) on which we disagreed, and we have had some heated arguments, but for the most part these issues are resolved amicably between us, and on other issues (religion for one) we agree to disagree and let it rest there. But for whatever reason, this is different. I have tried the home/family defence approach and it didn't really fly, despite it's obvious truth and the fact that she and her sister were followed by a group of wanna-be thugs a few weeks back. She bought pepper spray...
I am going to try to refocus my efforts on shooting as a sport and on statistics and stories of guns being helpful. I've invited her to come to the range with me, but to no avail thus far. By the way, I loved the idea of arranging for her to get mugged, but she is one tough bitch and that might not go well for my friend/mugger. But really, I've seen a lot of good advice on this board, and I want to thank those of you who stepped up and really put some thought into your responses and to those who shared their personal history with this trying issue.
As for PlayboyPenguin and therapy in gereral, give 'em a break guys. Yes he might have been a little presumptive about me or your actions (thinking of the guy with the gun in the glovebox), but he's right in saying that's what therapists do. And they do a lot of good for a lot of people. Also, I do try to look at this from her prospective as well. I took up shooting and gun ownership five and a half years into our relationship. I appreciate that she didn't throw a fit that I was going to the range. Her deal is mostly about having a gun anywhere near our house. I told her that I would lock it up with a trigger lock inside of a locked safe, but no. I tried the garage or even my car, but no. They actually rent lockers (at astronomical rates, I might add) at my local range, but ultimately she doesn't want me to have access to a hangun that I could take anywhere I please. Wow, writing that bothers me. It's almost like she is afraid of what I will do with a gun in my hands. :banghead:
I don't know. I'm up against a wall that I want desperately to not be in my way. It's a problem that really could be a deal-breaker and that would be heartbreaking. I know there are other women out there and that after the initial pain, things always improve, but I really want this to work with her. This could be a control issue, and if it is that would be a greater problem for me than if she genuinely has a fear or issue with guns. I don't like her telling me what I can and can't do, and we haven't really had a problem with that in the past (other than that I shouldn't party so much in college, but it really was pretty bad
). So I hope that this resolves itself in time, and I think that some time is going to be the best thing that I can give her. Time to warm up and time to really think about how important this is to her, and I am to her. Thanks again everyone. If nothing else (which isn't the case) you've shown me with the sheer number of resonses that you guys are receptive to my plight and I appreciate your support. I love you guys! "sniffle"
p.s. I can't believe this behemoth is as long as it is, but you owed me one, it took me like half an hour and almost made me late for work reading your posts this afternoon.
Also, I didn't think I made any disparraging remarcks about the quality of people on this forum (ie. "rednecks"), in fact I appreciate your knowledgable input, and I did appreciate the pictures of the girlfriend at the range. Very nice, you lucky bastard.
Let me start this by saying that I do appreciate everyone's input, but that I don't think it is necessary to bash each other for having an opinion. However, I do appreciate that you just care so much about me
. Just kidding. Oh, and this is not a psych experiment, though it would be a good one.But really, as promised let me explain my story. As someone pointed out, I live in a house that is owned by my girlfirend's parents. My girlfriend, her sister, and I live in my girlfriend's grandmother's house, who passed away a few years back, and the house was then taken over by her parents. After graduating college, it was either move here (where I pay a fraction of the going market to live in a four bedroom house with my girlfriend) or move back home to northern Ca, and no longer live with her, which was not really an option for me.
I love my girlfriend, I have ever since my last year of high school. I am 23, as is she, and we have been living together a little over two years now. *Please no one bash me as being immoral for "living in sin", not really the point of the story, thanks*. My girlfriend is a great person; she is intelligent, funny, beautiful, and very similar to me in a myriad of ways. BUT, she hates guns. Why, you ask? Well if I could get a straight answer out of her on that one, I might not be asking this question in the first place. We both lean a little to the left on social issues, but more to the right on fiscal ones, although I (obviously) hold one particular conservative view that she does not.
Ever since I was a young boy shooting BB guns in the back yard with my friends, I have had an affinity for firearms. I always had lots of toy guns, even an uncle mike's holster that I bought at an army surplus store. I have always had a vision in my head that one day I would own a whole wall of guns, with every model that I ever wanted. Two years ago, my best friend from back home bought himself an XD-9 and invited me to go shooting with him. When I turned 21 I was more concerned with college than anything else, so my shooting desires had been moved to the back burner. But when I went to the range again for the first time in years (my father used to take my brother and I to shoot his 22's and I got my hunting licence when I was 16 or so, but used it very little), I was hooked again. I found a range in southern ca near my house and I started going, renting different handguns mostly. I even went down to LA (about two hours drive, one way) to shoot with my brother at a range that offered far more rental options. I've been back there twice and I frequent my local range about once a week, shooting 100-150 rounds a session.
Now I am ready to buy myself a handgun. I really want to get to know one particular firearm inside and out and really take pride in taking good care of it and in becoming proficient with it. And this is where my real trouble began. My girlfriend was not all that into me going to the range, but she knew she couldn't tell me no, so she let it go. However, she makes little snide jokes about guns or looks at me funny (those with experience in this will know the look I mean) when I say something particularly gun-nutty. But when I brought up ownership it was like I was asking to open the gates of hell in our living room. After riding a sea of NO's long enough, I usually give up and call it a day. I have tried to discuss the issue with her reasonably, but as others have rightly pointed out, emotional responses are hard to reason with. A major problem is that she can hold our living arangements over my head and she uses it to her advantage. She knows that her parents would agree with her (although thankfully she has not yet involved them) and since they own the house, its her way or no way. Convincing her is the only chance I've got to staying in the relationship without giving up something that makes me happy.
I am trying, and I am no where near close to running away just yet. She is a great woman, and I can see a future between us. We have had some issues in the past (mostly with my partying with friends a little too hard) on which we disagreed, and we have had some heated arguments, but for the most part these issues are resolved amicably between us, and on other issues (religion for one) we agree to disagree and let it rest there. But for whatever reason, this is different. I have tried the home/family defence approach and it didn't really fly, despite it's obvious truth and the fact that she and her sister were followed by a group of wanna-be thugs a few weeks back. She bought pepper spray...
I am going to try to refocus my efforts on shooting as a sport and on statistics and stories of guns being helpful. I've invited her to come to the range with me, but to no avail thus far. By the way, I loved the idea of arranging for her to get mugged, but she is one tough bitch and that might not go well for my friend/mugger.
But really, I've seen a lot of good advice on this board, and I want to thank those of you who stepped up and really put some thought into your responses and to those who shared their personal history with this trying issue. As for PlayboyPenguin and therapy in gereral, give 'em a break guys. Yes he might have been a little presumptive about me or your actions (thinking of the guy with the gun in the glovebox), but he's right in saying that's what therapists do. And they do a lot of good for a lot of people. Also, I do try to look at this from her prospective as well. I took up shooting and gun ownership five and a half years into our relationship. I appreciate that she didn't throw a fit that I was going to the range. Her deal is mostly about having a gun anywhere near our house. I told her that I would lock it up with a trigger lock inside of a locked safe, but no. I tried the garage or even my car, but no. They actually rent lockers (at astronomical rates, I might add) at my local range, but ultimately she doesn't want me to have access to a hangun that I could take anywhere I please. Wow, writing that bothers me. It's almost like she is afraid of what I will do with a gun in my hands. :banghead:
I don't know. I'm up against a wall that I want desperately to not be in my way. It's a problem that really could be a deal-breaker and that would be heartbreaking. I know there are other women out there and that after the initial pain, things always improve, but I really want this to work with her. This could be a control issue, and if it is that would be a greater problem for me than if she genuinely has a fear or issue with guns. I don't like her telling me what I can and can't do, and we haven't really had a problem with that in the past (other than that I shouldn't party so much in college, but it really was pretty bad
). So I hope that this resolves itself in time, and I think that some time is going to be the best thing that I can give her. Time to warm up and time to really think about how important this is to her, and I am to her. Thanks again everyone. If nothing else (which isn't the case) you've shown me with the sheer number of resonses that you guys are receptive to my plight and I appreciate your support. I love you guys! "sniffle" p.s. I can't believe this behemoth is as long as it is, but you owed me one, it took me like half an hour and almost made me late for work reading your posts this afternoon.
Also, I didn't think I made any disparraging remarcks about the quality of people on this forum (ie. "rednecks"), in fact I appreciate your knowledgable input, and I did appreciate the pictures of the girlfriend at the range. Very nice, you lucky bastard.
Jamie C.
Member
Hmm.... I'd go buy the gun and see what happens.
( She might accidentally get over it..... eventually... *shrug* )
Then again, I have a real mean streak.
( Three wives'll do that to a fella... )
J.C.
( She might accidentally get over it..... eventually... *shrug* )
Then again, I have a real mean streak.
( Three wives'll do that to a fella...
)J.C.
-----quote--------------
A major problem is that she can hold our living arangements over my head and she uses it to her advantage.
------------------------
This is a very scary statement. Do NOT marry this person.
Her problem with guns is a relatively minor problem.
Her unwillingness to re-think her position or even discuss it when you have a disagreement is a MAJOR problem. She refuses to discuss the issue seriously, but then uses it to jab at you? This is very dysfunctional behavior and this is not the last time you will see this behavior out of her.
Her willingness to use circumstances to her advantage and manipulate and control you is a MAJOR problem.
The guns issue is just the circumstance that revealed her true personality to you. There will be other such circumstances in the future, and it will get worse. This is not a person with whom you can maintain a healthy long-term relationship.
A major problem is that she can hold our living arangements over my head and she uses it to her advantage.
------------------------
This is a very scary statement. Do NOT marry this person.
Her problem with guns is a relatively minor problem.
Her unwillingness to re-think her position or even discuss it when you have a disagreement is a MAJOR problem. She refuses to discuss the issue seriously, but then uses it to jab at you? This is very dysfunctional behavior and this is not the last time you will see this behavior out of her.
Her willingness to use circumstances to her advantage and manipulate and control you is a MAJOR problem.
The guns issue is just the circumstance that revealed her true personality to you. There will be other such circumstances in the future, and it will get worse. This is not a person with whom you can maintain a healthy long-term relationship.
Jamie C.
Member
Well Antsi, quite a number of us have said it's a control issue not a gun issue...
Oh, and FWIW.... I'll bet he marries her.
Any takers?
How 'bout wagers on how it ends up once he does?
J.C.
Oh, and FWIW.... I'll bet he marries her.
Any takers?
How 'bout wagers on how it ends up once he does?
J.C.
Ruger451
Member
Thanks Jamie
Well, either way, you're gonna be waiting a long time to find out. Neither of us wants to do anything until we finish grad school. But I'll let you know in four years, ok? Enjoy your laugh
Well, either way, you're gonna be waiting a long time to find out. Neither of us wants to do anything until we finish grad school. But I'll let you know in four years, ok? Enjoy your laugh
Lobotomy Boy
Member
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2004
- Messages
- 2,449
Option #3: You grow a pair and strike out on your own, like just about every other non-retarded able bodied adult in our society has done. IE: Grow up.
Yes, please do. You have to understand where PP is coming from. He is gay, in a long-term relationship with a man. I assume he has been oriented this way all his life since he did not say he is bisexual; hence, he has probably never had a long-term relationship with a woman. I fully realize the following is a politically incorrect position to have, but nearly 18 years of marriage have led me to the conclusion that men and women differ from one another. I had no idea how true this was until I'd been married for six or seven years. How could PP fully understand this when he's devoted his life to a long-term relationship with a man? If you think about it, his lifestyle has a certain appeal (except for that part about having sex with a dude, which, if you're not hardwired that way, is a pretty tough one to get around). But I digress. My point is that before I got married, my veiws on sexual politics were much more inline with PP's than they are today. If I hadn't changed my perspective, if I hadn't accepted the politically incorrect notion that men and women are different, and that women seem to be influenced by emotion more than men are, I would not have been happily married for nearly 18 years. I'd be another bitter old divorced crank living in a filthy hovel filled with expensive toys and dirty laundry.
Nicky Santoro
Member
"....My current girlfriend and potential wife is super anti-firearm......I'm in the process of buying, and she is livid."
In the 1970s I was where you are now. The issue wasn't firearms but it was always something. The woman in question was always "livid" about one thing or another and if I didn't cave in there was no end to it. I finally decided that I wasn't about to live my life this way so I ended it. That really hurt at the time, but in retrospect, it was the right decision.
You need to get these things straight with her now or move on.
In the 1970s I was where you are now. The issue wasn't firearms but it was always something. The woman in question was always "livid" about one thing or another and if I didn't cave in there was no end to it. I finally decided that I wasn't about to live my life this way so I ended it. That really hurt at the time, but in retrospect, it was the right decision.
You need to get these things straight with her now or move on.
Jamie C.
Member
You're welcome.
And as for the 4 years... That's not all that long.
Well, not for me anyway. Less than a tenth of my life.
J.C.
I probably should keep my big mouth shut but have never been able to soooo here goes!! The first three replies to this post were the best advice you'll ever get!!! RLH!!!! (Run Like Hell !! ) This chick may be a livin' doll but YOUR life is going to be nothing but pure HELL if you stay with her.
Lupinus
Member
dude, stand up, be a man, put your foot down, go buy yourself a gun, hell buy two to make a point, and calmly explain to her that you love her with all your heart you don't want to loose her but that doesn't mean you are going to be a whipped little boy who is controled by his wife hanging things over his head with its them or me crapola. She doesn't have to like them but they are what interests you and if she wants to keep you (thats right, turn the tables on her, ITS ME AND THEM OR NOTHING) she is going to have to get used to the idea.
Now if you want to be controled by your wife and live a life ready to be controled by your gf/wife like penguin go ahead and this advice for what to do in your life is worth what you are paying to read it (which depends on your isp
). But that is my advice. Don't let her dictate your life and interests to you, you don't want to end up one of them miserable guys becking to your wifes call and counting the days till you can be rid of her.
Now if you want to be controled by your wife and live a life ready to be controled by your gf/wife like penguin go ahead and this advice for what to do in your life is worth what you are paying to read it (which depends on your isp
). But that is my advice. Don't let her dictate your life and interests to you, you don't want to end up one of them miserable guys becking to your wifes call and counting the days till you can be rid of her.Mulliga
Member
Wow...I don't know what to say. Even you yourself realize how bad that looks on paper, especially to your fellow THRers. Locked with trigger lock inside a safe (the gun might as well be a strawberry snowcone), and she still has a problem with it?
In a way, you are lucky - if you had not been living with her, this issue may not have come up, and you might have married and had a kid before she told you to lose your guns - and then you would have capitulated, because at that point, yes, you probably would value your wife and kid more than being able to own a gun (whether the resentment and anger that results kills the marriage is another question entirely). Just count your blessings that it's happening now and not five years down the road - best to go in with both eyes open.
Whatever choice you make, just be sure you're happy with it.
madmike
Member
dodgestdshift
Member
Try this. Tell her you are going to take the NRA basic pistol course and want her to go too. If she goes, there is hope, if she won't you know what to expect. If she goes and sees how safety is stressed and that you are committed to safety, maybe she will moderate.
Young children generally lack the strength or dexterity to work a weapon, certainly to load it. A high shelf suffices.
That is flat out wrong. Not to thread hijack - but that is one of the stupidest things said here. Was it in jest? People have tested this by the way.
That is flat out wrong. Not to thread hijack - but that is one of the stupidest things said here. Was it in jest? People have tested this by the way.
madmike
Member
+1 Mulliga
She's not willing to accept the safety standards that BRADY demands as being good enough? Can't give you a reason why and is holding it over your head?
I dated a woman who was that flaky a different way. Best sex I ever had, bar none. Great time socially. Fun to talk to. Great woman. Absolutely NO possibility of developing together.
I wouldn't bother buying a gun to try to set her off or get her to debate. She doesn't want to. She wants control, as most everyone has noted. I'm not sure what your "partying too hard" entailed, but if you didn't break the law or sleep with anyone, and you were with YOUR buddies, it's not HER business, especially as you're not married. I don't dictate which friends or events my wife can have, nor her me. She hates some of my friends and I just don't bring them to the house. But she doesn't stop me seeing them. She doesn't belittle me or make snide comments about them or me. I don't like her religion, so I stand back and ignore it. She showed up for the weekend and never left, and that was 15 years ago, and that's because we were both smart enough to understand what was involved in a RELATIONSHIP, not just "Great most of the time."
Well, ours sucks sometimes. Had some serious problems. But there is nothing either of us is going to DEMAND the other HAS TO change about themselves or else. If she can't stand what you are, it's not going to get better. If it's not the guns, or the partying with your friends, it'll be something else. And if it took 6 years to find that out, you didn't do enough research 5 1/2 years ago. She wants to mold you into her ideal. I've seen both men and women do that. "You'll dress like this, groom like this, stop doing XX if you love me." Nah, bull. If SHE loves YOU she'll accept it and compromise.
It'll hurt to leave now, but it'll destroy you in another 5-10 years. And that rent you don't want to pay? (Another REALLY BAD reason to stay with someone.) Cheaper than alimony/child support/legal hassles/screaming hysterical phone calls at 0300/domestic fights/innuendos and allegations to your friends/accusations. Which are all going to come. Seen enough of them in the last 39 years.
Pack your bags. Wish her well. Part as friends with differences.
madmike
Member
Yes, at age 5 my daughter couldn't even cock her Crickett .22.
Nor can my son at age 5, even though he can do 15 milspec pushups, 20 situps and do chimney ascents while climbing.
At 8, it could seriously be an issue. But at 8 my daughter's a better shot than most adults, and thoroughly versed in safety.
Hell, most WOMEN and some men can't work the slide on a 1911.
I'm all in favor of safety. But safety is an attitude, not a device. My point was that if a lock and a safe isn't deemed good enough, you're dealing with a paranoid.
Gun safes are a relatively recent invention. The shelf by the fireplace or front door was considered adequate safety for many centuries.
Now, when they become TEENAGERS, you need a vault. To put the teenager in.
V4Vendetta
member
Here's my thoughts in case the original poster forgot the gems of my infinate wisdom:
PLAN A.
1. Use chloroform on her like Boss Spearmint in "Open Range".
2. You take your wife into a desolate place.
3. Make her exit the car.
4. Tell her that half a mile down the road you'll place a cheap .22 rifle & a box of ammo under a tarp where a fellow driver couldn't see it, but a walker would. She must then survive in the wild for a month. Tell her that she must obtain her own food, shelter & clothing. Tell her that in a month you would have somone drive by on the road & see if the gun was still there. If it wasn't, she couldn't come home & get rid of the guns since if she did, she'd be a hypocrite. If it was still there, she would obviously have have stuck to her principals & be welcome to stay out there in the wild for another month until she changed her mind.
PLAN B.
1. Realize that this woman is probably like Leah Rehmni's character from "The King of Queens". A ignorant, stuck-up, bossy, sexy control freak.
2. Dump her.
I'd go with plan A.
PLAN A.
1. Use chloroform on her like Boss Spearmint in "Open Range".
2. You take your wife into a desolate place.
3. Make her exit the car.
4. Tell her that half a mile down the road you'll place a cheap .22 rifle & a box of ammo under a tarp where a fellow driver couldn't see it, but a walker would. She must then survive in the wild for a month. Tell her that she must obtain her own food, shelter & clothing. Tell her that in a month you would have somone drive by on the road & see if the gun was still there. If it wasn't, she couldn't come home & get rid of the guns since if she did, she'd be a hypocrite. If it was still there, she would obviously have have stuck to her principals & be welcome to stay out there in the wild for another month until she changed her mind.
PLAN B.
1. Realize that this woman is probably like Leah Rehmni's character from "The King of Queens". A ignorant, stuck-up, bossy, sexy control freak.
2. Dump her.
I'd go with plan A.
<thread hijack>
As for whether kids can load & fire a handgun, my #2 son was able to load, rack the slide, and fire my Glock 26 when he was 7 years old. He might have been able to do it before then, but I didn't own it before then. His first experience with a 1911 was at age 13, and he had no difficulty whatsoever running it at that time. He commented that the Glock was harder to rack.
Further, even if a kid can't rack the slide "properly," the fact is that because they are human beings, they are both problem-solvers and tool-users. That means that an intelligent kid might be able to solve the problem some other way. I have heard more than one person report that their kid shoved the slide against a solid object, leaning their weight into it to rack it.
A little kid who picks up a gun with one in the chamber, can nearly always pull even the heaviest trigger. If the trigger is too heavy to pull the normal way, they can turn the gun around and push against the trigger rather than pulling it.
Setting the gun on a high shelf to keep it away from the kids is ... well, stupid is the kindest word I can think of for that one. One afternoon I stepped into the kitchen and found my two-year-old balanced precariously on top of the fridge. He's not the only kid ever to have done that, even at that age.
Kids can nearly always do a lot more than their parents give them credit for. Relying on them to be slow, stupid, and unable to figure stuff out is a recipe for disaster.
</thread hijack>
pax
There is no such thing as a healthy adult who is unable to rack the slide on a 1911. There are, however, a lot of women who haven't been shown how and who believe their husbands, boyfriends, and the clerks at the gun shop when the guys all say, "That gun is too big for you, honey. It's a man's gun." But when shown how, and given a chance to practice, they can manage it just fine.
As for whether kids can load & fire a handgun, my #2 son was able to load, rack the slide, and fire my Glock 26 when he was 7 years old. He might have been able to do it before then, but I didn't own it before then.
His first experience with a 1911 was at age 13, and he had no difficulty whatsoever running it at that time. He commented that the Glock was harder to rack.Further, even if a kid can't rack the slide "properly," the fact is that because they are human beings, they are both problem-solvers and tool-users. That means that an intelligent kid might be able to solve the problem some other way. I have heard more than one person report that their kid shoved the slide against a solid object, leaning their weight into it to rack it.
A little kid who picks up a gun with one in the chamber, can nearly always pull even the heaviest trigger. If the trigger is too heavy to pull the normal way, they can turn the gun around and push against the trigger rather than pulling it.
Setting the gun on a high shelf to keep it away from the kids is ... well, stupid is the kindest word I can think of for that one. One afternoon I stepped into the kitchen and found my two-year-old balanced precariously on top of the fridge. He's not the only kid ever to have done that, even at that age.
Kids can nearly always do a lot more than their parents give them credit for. Relying on them to be slow, stupid, and unable to figure stuff out is a recipe for disaster.
</thread hijack>
pax
madmike
Member
Hmm...then I guess my wife, who IS in the US Army and CAN pass the APFT doesn't exist.
Many adults lack the strength to either push or pull that slide. Fact. It was a common problem with female officers when the 1911 was the issue sidearm.
I agree. That's not what I said.
By that standard, 99% of the people in this country, including you, I bet, are stupid with their kitchen knives. Well over half with toxic chemicals. I made that mistake ONCE. Two year old came through the living room with an 8" chef knife in best Norman Bates pose, after opening a drawer and climbing to the counter. They were then moved to a 6' shelf with no base to climb, out of line of sight. Slightly inconvenient, but far safer.
Compare the death and accident rates with those knives and chemicals, and with guns in the under 14 age group, then we'll talk.
Just did a test with a 1911, a 5 year old who's been around firearms his entire life, a magazine, a dummy round and two adult observers. He was unable to successfully insert a round in the magazine. He was unable to insert one in the chamber until being shown. He was able to insert a magazine, and eventually managed to get it to seat. He was unable to work the slide. He almost injured himself attempting to release the slide once it was locked back for him.
If it was empty, on a high shelf, with the ammo apart from it, no danger.
This does assume the adults in the house are intelligent enough to keep track of the issue. Guns don't load themselves.
My point was that that was the limit of safe practice for many centuries, is STILL one of the standard safe practices (newsflash: a lot of people can't afford safes in their budget), and if the spouse isn't happy with a weapon locked in a safe with a lock on the trigger and ammo elsewhere, the spouse has some issues that aren't easily resolvable.
madmike
Member
I'll start a new thread, "Safe Storage" in general discussions. Just did some more experiments.
It's not just guns...
A strong segment of the wife population is going to be against anything you like just because you like it. Enthusiasms detract from time and money that they believe should be devoted entirely to them.
I remember one woman who advised her daughter to go over and visit any perspective husband and " If his hobby is !GUNZ!, don't have anything to do with him!"
This is because her husband liked guns and she had a natural and abiding disregard for her husband. If he had collected cupie dolls, she would have had the same hatred of them.
So she married a guy who'se hobby was sexual intercourse and bimeby,he left her for a woman who shared the same interest.
A strong segment of the wife population is going to be against anything you like just because you like it. Enthusiasms detract from time and money that they believe should be devoted entirely to them.
I remember one woman who advised her daughter to go over and visit any perspective husband and " If his hobby is !GUNZ!, don't have anything to do with him!"
This is because her husband liked guns and she had a natural and abiding disregard for her husband. If he had collected cupie dolls, she would have had the same hatred of them.
So she married a guy who'se hobby was sexual intercourse and bimeby,he left her for a woman who shared the same interest.
rayra
member
Therapist, laughing at your arrogance.
You preen about your "qualifications" yet completely missed the 'Control issue' this topic is about. You unjustly place the burden on teh poster and not the fiance, when it is not the poster trying to force another person to bend to their will. THAT is the wrongful act here, and you've missed it utterly.
Then the rest of your posts are nothing but sparring and seeking petty points, couched in couch-speak. You play games with words to position the 'burden of guilt' on each person you are attacking.
And all from an opening post where you voice disdain (unspecifically) for many folks here, AND completely fail to recognize that for many people gun ownership is the exercising of a Constitutional Right, and not just any other hobby that can be flushed out the door at the demand of a spouse.
Speaking of that, your very willingness to do so tells us all we need to know about your mindset, even before your self-identification as an "ex-therapist".
To the original poster: Attempt to educate. Her reactions, ability or (I strongly expect) INability to alter her viewpoint to incorporate that new information will tell you everything you need to know about her psyche and your future together. If she is that inflexible, that selfishly determined to remain unmoved and to DEMAND that you conform to HER desires at teh sacrifice of you own, then you should end the engagement and start looking elsewhere.
And you should do so without regret, instead do so with RELIEF that you discovered such gross personality flaws before you were wed to them.
You preen about your "qualifications" yet completely missed the 'Control issue' this topic is about. You unjustly place the burden on teh poster and not the fiance, when it is not the poster trying to force another person to bend to their will. THAT is the wrongful act here, and you've missed it utterly.
Then the rest of your posts are nothing but sparring and seeking petty points, couched in couch-speak. You play games with words to position the 'burden of guilt' on each person you are attacking.
And all from an opening post where you voice disdain (unspecifically) for many folks here, AND completely fail to recognize that for many people gun ownership is the exercising of a Constitutional Right, and not just any other hobby that can be flushed out the door at the demand of a spouse.
Speaking of that, your very willingness to do so tells us all we need to know about your mindset, even before your self-identification as an "ex-therapist".
To the original poster: Attempt to educate. Her reactions, ability or (I strongly expect) INability to alter her viewpoint to incorporate that new information will tell you everything you need to know about her psyche and your future together. If she is that inflexible, that selfishly determined to remain unmoved and to DEMAND that you conform to HER desires at teh sacrifice of you own, then you should end the engagement and start looking elsewhere.
And you should do so without regret, instead do so with RELIEF that you discovered such gross personality flaws before you were wed to them.
rayra
member
Bullfrogken said it all much better than I. And I think this sentence point directly to the therapist's worldview - the original poster changed the fixed status quo, ergo he is the guilty party. Therapist flat out stated he should 'bear the burden' - the guilt - of the situation.
That's a seriously screwed-up position for a THERAPIST to take. It is judgement-free, a reflexive assignemnt of blame that DOES NOT BELONG in therapy or any problem-solving environment.
This isn't a personal attack, but an honest inquiry - PlayboyPenguin, why are you an EX-therapist?
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