On that "Good Neighborhood" Idea Again.

Claude's summary:

• The attacker’s car had been identified as ‘suspicious’ earlier in the evening by the POlice but was not pursued when it sped away, per the Department’s policy.
• It is a gated community.
• The attacker pushed the gate open with his car.
• He was armed with an impact weapon, to wit: a baseball bat.
• The couple confronted him when he tried to steal a vehicle parked at their house.
• After killing the man of the couple and severely injuring the woman, he made entrance to the house and killed another person.
• The first man killed was the grandfather of the boy who hid in a bathroom and called 911.
• The second man killed was the father of the boy who hid in a bathroom and called 911.
• The killer attempted to commit suicide in the house afterward by drinking bleach.
• • Going outside your home to investigate a suspected crime is, literally, ‘looking for trouble.’
  • If you go ‘looking for trouble,’ you should be prepared, both mentally and physically, in case you find it.

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I will pass on commenting on drinking Bleach. Ahem!

I say that "bad" people are not immobile nor completely nocturnal; "they" may come to the "good" place during daylight.
I encourage carrying a concealable pistol that would be preferred in hand if one had to defend themself, regardless of location.
Location nor time of day factored, no statistics, just what would be preferred in hand if one had to defend their life.
There is nowhere I'd rather defend myself with a pocket 380/38 snub rather than a Glock 19/23.
So, for me, that means carrying at least a Glock 19 (more likely Glock 23) wherever.
Those content to carry (bet their life) a 22lr / 32 when they could do better, I do not understand it. Oh well.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: burglars, robbers and home invaders are more likely to look for their targets in the nicer areas. Nobody breaks into the single-wide in the trailer-park on the edge of town (unless it's a drug den).

I've encountered on a professional basis any number of burglars and robbers, and for the most part (almost always), they were breaking into middle class or upscale homes that looked to have the nicer stuff inside. One of the two guys who broke into my house stated that they'd noticed my wife pulling her Range Rover out of the garage and that was a big reason my home was targeted (it otherwise doesn't look like much on the outside). By the way, it's almost funny how often you can see into someone's living room from the street at night and detect what show they're watching on their new 70-inch OLED television.

And the more experienced guys will look for unoccupied homes in the middle of the day. We had our door kicked in at precisely 2:22 p.m. on a weekday (that's when the alarm activated).

Don't need to tell anyone that Claude makes some very salient points.

CDW4ME said:

There is nowhere I'd rather defend myself with a pocket 380/38 snub rather than a Glock 19/23.
So, for me, that means carrying at least a Glock 19 (more likely Glock 23) wherever.
Those content to carry (bet their life) a 22lr / 32 when they could do better, I do not understand it. Oh well.

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Right. But where do you draw the line.

It may be a matter of semantics, but there are very few places I’d rather get into a gunfight with a Glock 19 or 23 than with a rifle. And there are very few places I’d rather get into a gunfight by myself than with a buddy on my side.

When I work, I carry a 17 round pistol with 2 spare magazines. When I get called to a known call that involves a criminal with a gun, I put on a plate carrier and grab a rifle, so then I have 80+ rounds of rifle ammo and an extra pistol mag added to the regular stuff on my belt.

In other words, I carry more for a dangerous situation, which by definition means I carry less for a “normal” situation.

Around town, I likely carry a 19 with a spare mag or a 365 with a spare mag. Since I’m not in uniform and not actively being sent to violent calls, I am statistically less likely to need a gun at all. I still carry the same round that I do at work, but I have less of them on my person.

I’m not saying if you live in a nice neighborhood you should go without a gun or carry a .22, I’m just saying that the fact that we don’t all walk around with a group of friends wearing plate carriers and carrying rifles means that we are all “carrying less” based on our surroundings.

I carry less all the time. That is the maximum I choose to carry.

Any more than that and I wouldn’t carry often.

I choose what’s comfortable for me to consistently carry.

waterhouse said:

1. It may be a matter of semantics, but there are very few places I’d rather get into a gunfight with a Glock 19 or 23 than with a rifle.

2. Around town, I likely carry a 19 with a spare mag or a 365 with a spare mag. Since I’m not in uniform and not actively being sent to violent calls, I am statistically .

3. we are all “carrying less” based on our surroundings.

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I was a cop for a couple years, long ago, has nothing to do with what I carry now.

1. Glock 19/23 is easily concealable a rifle is not. Of the concealable pistols that I own would I prefer this in hand if I had to defend myself?
2. I've carried a Glock 19 and spare mag (don't have a 365) and consider it an acceptable preferred minimum. Statistics are not a factor.
Preferred in hand is independent of location, time of day, or anticipated risk; a Glock 19 is preferred over a pocket 380/38 snub - no statistics needed.
3. "Carrying less" is those that carry a Glock 19 + spare mag in area of perceived higher risk, but pocket 380 a quick trip to the store. Nope, No thanks.

I think we are on the same page.

I will not go outside to confront someone who's stealing it as not many good things will come from that, especially since my car is insured and the money I'll be out if it is stolen is not enough to make it worth the legal issues I'll most likely face after confronting the thief. I'd also possibly be risking the life of my youngest son, who lives with me most of the time as well as my oldest son and daughter in law, who are here a couple of weekends a month. Sadly the homeowners in this case learned that. I'll call the police and let them handle it.

Old Dog said:

I've said it before, and I'll say it again: burglars, robbers and home invaders are more likely to look for their targets in the nicer areas. Nobody breaks into the single-wide in the trailer-park on the edge of town (unless it's a drug den).

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Having lived in a single-wide and had neighbors in both single- and double-wides, I beg to differ. This wasn't a "trailer park" per se as we also owned the lots, not rented. It was at the edge of town (back then, not now) but there were probably around 100 homes in this subdivision. We had our share of break-ins mainly because the "trailers" were easier to break into than a site-built home !

JTHunter said:

Having lived in a single-wide and had neighbors in both single- and double-wides, I beg to differ. This wasn't a "trailer park" per se as we also owned the lots, not rented. It was at the edge of town (back then, not now) but there were probably around 100 homes in this subdivision. We had our share of break-ins mainly because the "trailers" were easier to break into than a site-built home !

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Good points, and my apologies for the broad stereotype. I was referring the the sleazier variety, not one of the established "mobile home communities" typically populated by law-abiding citizens.

earlthegoat2 said:

I carry less all the time. That is the maximum I choose to carry.

Any more than that and I wouldn’t carry often.

I choose what’s comfortable for me to consistently carry.

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Y' know, I can respect that. I can respect that a lot more than delusions that b/c you're "only" going to [insert your favorite fantasy "safe" place] that you'll somehow end up less dead....

No place is safe; some places are less safe than others. And, generally, people are horrible at assessing risk/probability.

On the topic of accessing risk/probability there was a Home invasion across the street from me on 08/07.

The news report didn't give a lot of details but one thing that did stand out was that the family was sitting in the house with the front door not only unlocked but STANDING OPEN

CDW4ME said:

I say that "bad" people are not immobile nor completely nocturnal; "they" may come to the "good" place during daylight.
I encourage carrying a concealable pistol that would be preferred in hand if one had to defend themself, regardless of location.
Location nor time of day factored, no statistics, just what would be preferred in hand if one had to defend their life.
There is nowhere I'd rather defend myself with a pocket 380/38 snub rather than a Glock 19/23.
So, for me, that means carrying at least a Glock 19 (more likely Glock 23) wherever.
Those content to carry (bet their life) a 22lr / 32 when they could do better, I do not understand it. Oh well.

Click to expand...

Here we go again, seems not a thread goes by that you do not want to turn it in a caliber war. It gets old fast.Now here is the thing. In my home I have a full security system.I also have Duty size guns, Shotguns in all gauges, pocket guns and revolvers including Snubbies. And I am competent with all of them. And if I did use any including the smaller calibers, I could stop the threat.
Now may folks cannot handle the small guns well. And if you cannot then I understand, you need a larger gun. But that is a personal problem not a caliber issue.

Now getting back to the crime. Yes, in my many decades in the Alarm Industry, I saw many rapes, murders, break-ins etc. in high scale Homes. It is a huge myth that it does not happen in them.

CDW4ME said:

I say that "bad" people are not immobile nor completely nocturnal; "they" may come to the "good" place during daylight.
I encourage carrying a concealable pistol that would be preferred in hand if one had to defend themself, regardless of location.
Location nor time of day factored, no statistics, just what would be preferred in hand if one had to defend their life.
There is nowhere I'd rather defend myself with a pocket 380/38 snub rather than a Glock 19/23.
So, for me, that means carrying at least a Glock 19 (more likely Glock 23) wherever.
Those content to carry (bet their life) a 22lr / 32 when they could do better, I do not understand it. Oh well.

Click to expand...

Ernie Bass said:

Here we go again, seems not a thread goes by that you do not want to turn it in a caliber war. It gets old fast.Now here is the thing. In my home I have a full security system.I also have Duty size guns, Shotguns in all gauges, pocket guns and revolvers including Snubbies. And I am competent with all of them. And if I did use any including the smaller calibers, I could stop the threat.
Now may folks cannot handle the small guns well. And if you cannot then I understand, you need a larger gun. But that is a personal problem not a caliber issue.

Now getting back to the crime. Yes, in my many decades in the Alarm Industry, I saw many rapes, murders, break-ins etc. in high scale Homes. It is a huge myth that it does not happen in them.

Click to expand...

"Here we go again". What?
I posted my preference, stating that I prefer a Glock 19/23 over something "lesser" is not me turning a thread into a "caliber war".
Most certainly I'd rather have a Glock 19/23 in hand rather than a pocket 380/38 snub if I had to defend myself and I carry accordingly.
Critique what I wrote and begin with "Here we go again". A case of ...

Ernie Bass said:

Here we go again, seems not a thread goes by that you do not want to turn it in a caliber war. It gets old fast.Now here is the thing. In my home I have a full security system.I also have Duty size guns, Shotguns in all gauges, pocket guns and revolvers including Snubbies. And I am competent with all of them. And if I did use any including the smaller calibers, I could stop the threat.
Now may folks cannot handle the small guns well. And if you cannot then I understand, you need a larger gun. But that is a personal problem not a caliber issue.

Now getting back to the crime. Yes, in my many decades in the Alarm Industry, I saw many rapes, murders, break-ins etc. in high scale Homes. It is a huge myth that it does not happen in them.

Click to expand...

Retied cop with 26 years on that job,a few more on an Armored truck and also armed security with patrol duty in HOUSING project.

I have responded to more burglarys that I can possibly remember,and a few 'home invasions" too.

I carry a 'combat pistol' 99% of the time !.

But there are a few times I leave the front door with a wheel gun & 5 or 6 rounds in her,and of course a reload.

Do I feel as comfortable as when I am heeled with the G-19 = NO.

But I have only recently seen any incidents were a 5 shot 'J' frame would not have settled it ,as well as any other tool.

If you so inclined,check out Wiley Clapps recent article about the wheel gun.

I think you will allow he has real knowledge and is spot on.

btw = my BUG is a S&W 360PD.

Trunk Monkey said:

On the topic of accessing risk/probability there was a Home invasion across the street from me on 08/07.

The news report didn't give a lot of details but one thing that did stand out was that the family was sitting in the house with the front door not only unlocked but STANDING OPEN

Click to expand...

Never discount opportunity-motivated attacks. Run of the mill criminals (as opposed to guys planning a heist on an art museum or similar) do not do delayed gratification but rather generally function on the level of "Ooh, I see something I want that looks easy to get, OK I'm gonna take it!". Moral: Don't put anything that looks easy to get (including yourself) within the field of view of such people.

Kleanbore said:

No, but it certainly didn't have anything to do with he topic at hand.

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I disagree. Stating that a person should carry the gun they feel most competent with is directly related to the topic at hand.

scaatylobo said:

Retied cop with 26 years on that job,a few more on an Armored truck and also armed security with patrol duty in HOUSING project.

I have responded to more burglarys that I can possibly remember,and a few 'home invasions" too.

I carry a 'combat pistol' 99% of the time !.

But there are a few times I leave the front door with a wheel gun & 5 or 6 rounds in her,and of course a reload.

Do I feel as comfortable as when I am heeled with the G-19 = NO.

But I have only recently seen any incidents were a 5 shot 'J' frame would not have settled it ,as well as any other tool.

If you so inclined,check out Wiley Clapps recent article about the wheel gun.

I think you will allow he has real knowledge and is spot on.

btw = my BUG is a S&W 360PD.

Click to expand...

Personally I cannot shoot the teeny-tiny ones well enough to feel comfortable carrying one. I bought a Model 36 from a friend in another state a couple years ago thinking it would be great as a carry gun due to the size. Visiting the range with it disabused me of the idea pretty quickly. I now carry a King Cobra.

Kleanbore said:

The OP is not about carrying a gun.

The essence is that one should not go looking for trouble.

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Of course a person should not go looking for trouble. But because you don't know when or where trouble might come looking for you, it's prudent to be prepared to defend yourself.