Having the serial #'s run on your concealed carry weapon

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We did what was required and presented license and insurance and were told to go on. The one bad deputy was the one who pulled us aside for questioning. This wasn't a "real" policeman like most of ya'll would think of. It was a small town deputy in Mississippi where i assume the standards are pretty low for employment as a law enforcement officer. If one of the guys had said something like, "you guys been riding all day?" i would have said "yeah we've rode 550 miles from Texas. It's been a long day." We had nothing to hide and the idea that two old retired guys carry drugs around is ridiculous. Maybe he thought i was legally carrying a firearm to do drive bys and carjackings. If you think things like this still don't happen, look up Brookside Alabama and read about all the innocent people who got fined or arrested by the Brookside Police in the last several years.
Wasn't that Brookside something? And that Chief of Police wanted to double the size of the force. Now the state congress is writing into law that only 10% of the county's revenue can come from traffic fines. The PD doesn't get to keep the money any longer. The rest must go to poor families and schools, etc.
 
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We did what was required and presented license and insurance and were told to go on. The one bad deputy was the one who pulled us aside for questioning. This wasn't a "real" policeman like most of ya'll would think of. It was a small town deputy in Mississippi where i assume the standards are pretty low for employment as a law enforcement officer. If one of the guys had said something like, "you guys been riding all day?" i would have said "yeah we've rode 550 miles from Texas. It's been a long day." We had nothing to hide and the idea that two old retired guys carry drugs around is ridiculous. Maybe he thought i was legally carrying a firearm to do drive bys and carjackings. If you think things like this still don't happen, look up Brookside Alabama and read about all the innocent people who got fined or arrested by the Brookside Police in the last several years.
How did he know you had a firearm at DL checkpoint? Are you required to tell them in Ol' Miss?
 
Any lawyer out there will tell you "rule #1, never talk to the police without a lawyer present"
This is funny, because it's obviously so self-serving, on the part of the lawyer. And I say that being a retired lawyer myself.

Don't incriminate yourself, but be reasonable in your interactions with the police. Don't antagonize them by acting like a "sovereign citizen."

In my experience (and I'm 77 years old), the police (including the ATF!) have been my allies whenever I've had dealings with them. I don't see them as antagonists at all. But then I don't do gray-area crimes.
 
Yeah, like all cops on patrol duty have time to watch a lot of network television. Newsflash: cops are the most skeptical television and movie viewers in existence, and have been waiting 75 years for TV or motion pictures to accurately depict their jobs (not to mention the real evil that actually exists in the criminal world).

Geez. Threads such as this get me a bit worried. I'm now retired and haven't had to do traffic stops for a while anyway, but the folks that promote perpetuating an adversarial attitude toward a guy (or gal) just doing their job get me wondering. I never confronted anyone with an attitude, and always believed that if you demonstrate respect, you'll receive respect in return.
And yet, you keep making a huge deal about this. Yes, it's hard to believe that there's not more to the story...

I'm also noticing that on the internet, folks continually keep confusing NICS and NCIC (not to mention NCIS, but don't get me started).


I hate the walk a mile in my shoes thing, but I can't think of anything where it holds as much truth as in this profession. Soldier, not as much, "hose draggers" again not as much. With this every single day. If you are lucky you stop cars and that is it for a day. And to think of the people working in the real hell holes like Chicago, Detroit, really any blue city.....I don't see how they do it.

All I can say is if the general population knew even a third of what really goes on there would be real changes......REAL CHANGES.

And the advice given here, some of it.....way off in left field and it is not going to help you one bit.
 
I forgot to mention also that the last sheriff and the chief investigator of the county where i had my encounter are currently serving prison sentences for 10 different corruption, sexual assault, and firearm trafficking offenses. That might put a better perspective on what i've been saying. I'm not making this up.
 
We must have some members here who've talked themselves into more'n a few tickets. (I personally hated writing tickets, because I didn't like having to go into court for some jackwagon who was trying to prove he wasn't going twenty miles an hour over the posted speed limit, when I coulda written him for going 35 over, but was trying to save him from a reckless driving charge as well). Sheesh.

I've been pulled over twice for speeding in the last 30 years, and both times I said, essentially, "Yeah, I was over the limit and I have no excuse". And both times I deserved and expected a ticket, and was gratified when the cop lectured me and then drove off. I suspect that happens quite a bit - and I am sure that I could have easily "talked myself into a ticket" just as you say.
 
This is funny, because it's obviously so self-serving, on the part of the lawyer. And I say that being a retired lawyer myself.

Don't incriminate yourself, but be reasonable in your interactions with the police. Don't antagonize them by acting like a "sovereign citizen."

In my experience (and I'm 77 years old), the police (including the ATF!) have been my allies whenever I've had dealings with them. I don't see them as antagonists at all. But then I don't do gray-area crimes.
Let me guess. You must have been a prosecutor, not a defense laywer. And since when does asserting your rights make you a sovereign citizen. A sovereign citizen is one who thinks the law doesn't apply to them, i.e. most policemen. A citizen asserting his rights is someone who makes sure the law applies to him.
 
Yeah, sorry, but... you're wrong. If you are traveling on the public roadways and you get pulled over for a suspected violation of the traffic code, you are actually legally obligated to provide certain information. (No, no good cop is gonna ask you where you're going, so put that one to rest, your Constitutional rights are safe). Any lawyer out there will tell you "rule #1, never talk to the police without a lawyer present" applies specifically to when you are actually being apprehended/arrested with possible criminal charges to follow.

We must have some members here who've talked themselves into more'n a few tickets. (I personally hated writing tickets, because I didn't like having to go into court for some jackwagon who was trying to prove he wasn't going twenty miles an hour over the posted speed limit, when I coulda written him for going 35 over, but was trying to save him from a reckless driving charge as well). Sheesh.
I think every time I have been pulled over they asked me albeit politely where I am going, Most important here is he wasn’t pulled over for a traffic infraction. It was a “check your papers” stop. Nope I can’t respect a 4th amendment fudd policemen during this type of encounter. Cherish your constitutional rights and always be polite to police when they honor their OATH.

This this the oath police police take in Texas (according to what I found) sounds pretty good to me.

IN THE NAME AND BY THE AUTHORITY OF THE STATE OF TEXAS, I, , do solemnly swear (or affirm), that I will faithfully execute the duties of the office of of the State of Texas, and will to the best of my ability preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States and of this State, so help me God.
 
I live in rural Pennsylvania, and while not Mississippi, PA has been described an Philadelphia on one end, Pittsburgh on the other and Alabama in between, and I'd be deep in the Alabama part. (As an aside, I can only imagine that Alabama is great, because I love where I am.) All the law enforcement around here is small town, and I actually did buy (and carry) a stolen gun. My experience with law enforcement was very different (the officer was friendly and helpful). I'm not particularly concerned with checkpoints or meticulous records saved to my phone, but that's just my perspective.
 
I live in rural Pennsylvania, and while not Mississippi, PA has been described an Philadelphia on one end, Pittsburgh on the other and Alabama in between, and I'd be deep in the Alabama part. (As an aside, I can only imagine that Alabama is great, because I love where I am.) All the law enforcement around here is small town, and I actually did buy (and carry) a stolen gun. My experience with law enforcement was very different (the officer was friendly and helpful). I'm not particularly concerned with checkpoints or meticulous records saved to my phone, but that's just my perspective.

ok just don’t try and infringe on my rights. They are not for sale at any price.

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety- B. Franklin
 
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I always like when they go to their computer to check a firearm and in 30 seconds say, "It's registered to XXXXXXXX" LOL
 
Until policing in our country operates from a set of behavior standards that sees citizens of this country not as enemies immediately but as equal and fellow citizens to those doing the policing and until every Police department the nation over has stricter standards on police conduct I think it's pretty one-sided to ask citizens to be cooperative with police. Perhaps we should be asking police to be cooperative with us because most of us aren't criminals.
The citizens are the ones voting in the city councils, the county commissions, the state reps and senators, no? If you want to change the style of policing in your area, your representatives in office are the ones to be communicating with... and if your cops aren't being "cooperative" with you, you certainly have numerous avenues of redress.

Apparently, some here haven't figured out that when the nice man standing next to your window asks where you're going, it's not because he (or she) is actually interested or has the need to know where you're going, nor is it some government plot to infringe on your Constitutional rights.

Asking simple questions is a really effective way to (1) gauge someone's compliance level, (2) get an initial indication of whether an individual is under the influence of a controlled substance and/or alcohol, and most importantly (3) get a read on someone's demeanor and possible threat level. Are they visibly nervous? Fidgety? Appear to be concealing something? Should go without saying that if it's 0230 in the morning and you're out in an industrial area that isn't on the way to anywhere and there's no residences or open businesses in the area, you might get asked where you're headed... Do you have a constitutional right to be there? Absolutely. Should you be there? Especially if you're in an area known for drug trafficking or prostitution, you betcha you'll get asked. Is the cop profiling? Heck yeah, but not because the color of your skin or your sexual preference. Is this legal? Yep.

Not sure what a "DL checkpoint" is because we don't have those up here. I've worked in states with agricultural inspection stations and immigration checkpoints but we don't even do DUI checkpoints here anymore. Guarantee you ask anyone who's worked in any aspect of law enforcement for more'n a minute, none would be in favor of any kind of checkpoints or tell you they wanna work 'em.

A checkpoint where:
We were told if we didn't want to answer questions we could pull to the side and were subjected to a criminal investigation with hands on the head, pat down, more questioning, drug dog and everything
Not buying it.

The OP was asked in his first thread what probable cause the deputy had for "running the serial number" on his firearm and unless I missed something, never really explained how this transpired. Dismissed without having to even get an attorney? There's gotta be more to this story.
 
It happened absolutely like i said. I know some of you just don't want to believe things like this still happen. We were riding motorcycles and one guy apparently thinks all motorcycle riders are criminals. I asked several times to get a copy of my arrest report to see what they listed as PC but they absolutely refused to provide me with one. I would have had to have filed a subpoena to get it. It was dismissed because there was overwhelming evidence to prove i did not "willingly and knowingly" possess a stolen firearm. Remember guys, the last Sheriff and Chief Investigator of this county are serving ten year prison sentences now.
 
It happened absolutely like i said. I know some of you just don't want to believe things like this still happen. We were riding motorcycles and one guy apparently thinks all motorcycle riders are criminals. I asked several times to get a copy of my arrest report to see what they listed as PC but they absolutely refused to provide me with one. I would have had to have filed a subpoena to get it. It was dismissed because there was overwhelming evidence to prove i did not "willingly and knowingly" possess a stolen firearm. Remember guys, the last Sheriff and Chief Investigator of this county are serving ten year prison sentences now.
I believe everything you have said. Thank you for sharing this.
 
<Kind of inwardly cringing about letting myself get sucked into this thread>

but...
i was arrested and charged for knowingly and willingly possessing a stolen firearm, cuffed way too tightly to the point my shoulders were hurt and arms bruised badly and then placed in the back of a patrol car for an hour. I might add the tow fee for a 8 mile rollback tow for the bike was $450.
So you spent an hour, in wrist restraints, in the back of a patrol car. Did you sue the county for your injuries? Were you reimbursed the $450 (?) for the motorcycle tow? Yet, no charges were ever filed, and you didn't have to retain an attorney? What county (and dates)?

I believe everything you have said.
Ever heard the phrase, "Trust, but verify?" Guy joins an internet forum, first post relates this horrible story...

Bottom line here for me is, even should the OP's entire account be verifiable truth, it's such an unlikely and uncommon sequence of events that it's simply not something that any of us should ever have to lose sleep over.

I'm kinda remembering that movie from the '70s, Macon County Line...

As to the actual thread-starting statement: If one purchases an (as presented to them in a retail store) new firearm through an FFL and uses this firearm as one's concealed carry handgun, should one feel compelled to have the serial number of the gun checked to ensure it's not been reported as stolen? (Four pages and almost a hundred posts on this topic later)
 
Keep your mouth shut, don't answer any questions. The only thing you should maybe say give is a statement "I have owned that gun for x years and I did not steal it, if you have any further questions talk to my lawyer".
If you don't have a lawyer on retainer you are wrong. It's hard to find a lawyer when they cuf you. If you can afford a gun or a case of ammo or a case of primers you can put a retainer on a lawyer.

"A retainer fee can be any denomination that the attorney requests. It may be as low as $500 or as high as $5,000 or more. " I suspect the better lawyers are going to be at the higher end of the scale.
https://www.hg.org/legal-articles/what-is-a-retainer-fee-33898
 
I'm fairly libertarian and agree that most of these kinds of "checkpoints" are unconstitutional. And yes, refusing to answer <edit> "some" </edit> LEO questions also is a constitutional right. But what do you think is going to happen if you go through a checkpoint and refuse to speak? No cop is going to say "Oh, he's a 'sovereign citizen'. Let's just let him through." So yes, if you really want to stand on principle and believe that resistance will result in change, then go for it. Plan on being detained at best, and arrest is likely. You then can plan on months if not years of legal headaches, and good luck getting your gun back. I'm sure it will get me labeled as "sheeple" by a certain kind of gun owner, but my method is to be mild, pleasant, and cooperative, even in the face of the occasional obnoxious LEO. That doesn't mean I spill my life story, of course, but "Yes sir, what can I do for you?" has so far kept me out of all legal trouble.

I agree completely with you and project the exact same attitude and have never had a problem. If you hassle the cops and are uncooperative, you're engaging in adolescent and self-defeating behavior, in my opinion.
 
Sorry guys but i was jailed and charged with "knowingly and willingly" possessing a stolen firearm, a felony. The weapon was bought new from a dealer at a gun show. I too could have never believed something like this could happen to me. I had an initial consultation with an attorney, showed him the documentation i had gathered and he stated i didn't need his services and they would dismiss it. My neighbor the judge also said they would dismiss it. The ATF agent who looked into this said they should dismiss it. I had overwhelming evidence i did not know it was stolen and should not have been arrested in the first place and it was dismissed at my pre-trial hearing. It was a rural county in Mississippi and i'm not going to mention the county. Most of the other law enforcement and the judge seemed to be decent people. The Sheriff not so much as i tried to explain to him when i was charged and he just ignored what i said. It seems to be a money grabber situation. I probably should file a lawsuit against the county but i was not out too much money so i am not going to pursue that. As far as the first post, you gotta start somewhere. Four pages? Well it's been a lively discussion. Ain't that what internet forums are for?
 
The citizens are the ones voting in the city councils, the county commissions, the state reps and senators, no? If you want to change the style of policing in your area, your representatives in office are the ones to be communicating with... and if your cops aren't being "cooperative" with you, you certainly have numerous avenues of redress.

Apparently, some here haven't figured out that when the nice man standing next to your window asks where you're going, it's not because he (or she) is actually interested or has the need to know where you're going, nor is it some government plot to infringe on your Constitutional rights.

Asking simple questions is a really effective way to (1) gauge someone's compliance level, (2) get an initial indication of whether an individual is under the influence of a controlled substance and/or alcohol, and most importantly (3) get a read on someone's demeanor and possible threat level. Are they visibly nervous? Fidgety? Appear to be concealing something? Should go without saying that if it's 0230 in the morning and you're out in an industrial area that isn't on the way to anywhere and there's no residences or open businesses in the area, you might get asked where you're headed... Do you have a constitutional right to be there? Absolutely. Should you be there? Especially if you're in an area known for drug trafficking or prostitution, you betcha you'll get asked. Is the cop profiling? Heck yeah, but not because the color of your skin or your sexual preference. Is this legal? Yep.

Not sure what a "DL checkpoint" is because we don't have those up here. I've worked in states with agricultural inspection stations and immigration checkpoints but we don't even do DUI checkpoints here anymore. Guarantee you ask anyone who's worked in any aspect of law enforcement for more'n a minute, none would be in favor of any kind of checkpoints or tell you they wanna work 'em.

A checkpoint where:
Not buying it.

The OP was asked in his first thread what probable cause the deputy had for "running the serial number" on his firearm and unless I missed something, never really explained how this transpired. Dismissed without having to even get an attorney? There's gotta be more to this story.
I agree. Which is why I do vote that way. Change, un/fortunately takes time. If voting doesn't work I'm stuck with the status quo, which means policing doesn't/didn't change.
 
Sorry guys but i was jailed and charged with "knowingly and willingly" possessing a stolen firearm, a felony. The weapon was bought new from a dealer at a gun show. I too could have never believed something like this could happen to me. I had an initial consultation with an attorney, showed him the documentation i had gathered and he stated i didn't need his services and they would dismiss it. My neighbor the judge also said they would dismiss it. The ATF agent who looked into this said they should dismiss it. I had overwhelming evidence i did not know it was stolen and should not have been arrested in the first place and it was dismissed at my pre-trial hearing. It was a rural county in Mississippi and i'm not going to mention the county. Most of the other law enforcement and the judge seemed to be decent people. The Sheriff not so much as i tried to explain to him when i was charged and he just ignored what i said. It seems to be a money grabber situation. I probably should file a lawsuit against the county but i was not out too much money so i am not going to pursue that. As far as the first post, you gotta start somewhere. Four pages? Well it's been a lively discussion. Ain't that what internet forums are for?

Sounds to me like due process was properly applied. The cops arrested you with a legitimate suspicion that you possessed a stolen firearm. Upon investigation and due process, that turned out not to be the case. You were released unharmed, the police and courts properly discharged their duties, and an innocent citizen did not get wrongfully convicted. God Bless the USA. And quit being a Karen. Sometimes life involves inconvenience and it's not very manly to whine about it. Cowboy up, dude.
 
Apparently, some here haven't figured out that when the nice man standing next to your window asks where you're going, it's not because he (or she) is actually interested or has the need to know where you're going, nor is it some government plot to infringe on your Constitutional rights.

Asking simple questions is a really effective way to (1) gauge someone's compliance level, (2) get an initial indication of whether an individual is under the influence of a controlled substance and/or alcohol, and most importantly (3) get a read on someone's demeanor and possible threat level. Are they visibly nervous? Fidgety? Appear to be concealing something?
I can attest to this from personal experience. The police might ask extraneous questions, not because they want to know the answers, but because it's a way to verify that you have your wits about you. Once, when I called the police to my house late at night, one of the first things they asked me for was my Social Security number. It's not that they needed that information for any reason, but it was a way of establishing my bona fides. Anyone would normally know their Social Security number by heart.

If you balk at giving such information, the encounter will not go well for you.
 
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