Colorado to introduce Assault Weapons ban including semi-auto pistols & shotguns

Steel Horse Rider said:
Once again the Democrats want the citizen to prove their innocence rather than the state proving their guilt. They have tried this in a number of areas in the past which illustrates plainly that Democrat politicians neither understand nor respect constitutional principles.
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The prima facie case would be made if you were caught with a defined "assault weapon." Thereafter, it would be up to you to prove that you came under an exception (such as showing that you owned it prior to the enactment of the law). This fits within the framework of the criminal law. As a general proposition, there is nothing unconstitutional about it.

The whole law, however, might be declared unconstitutional under the 2nd Amendment. That would be up to the Supreme Court.
 
AlexanderA said:
This would be very expensive for the gun owners (transfer fees), and would be a windfall for the FFL's. I'll bet most people would just sit on their pre-existing guns, and hope that they can find a receipt if LE comes snooping.
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I'm not sure how many prosecutors would want to spend tax payers money and their resources to prosecute someone for the single crime of owning a restricted weapon. Maybe with some other charges but this is bordering on ridiculous. Most people can remember where they purchased a rifle. A search of the FFL records would reveal the transfer. The FFL I deal with has software that captures every transaction and is searchable by name and date. If the FFL is out of business that might be a problem.
 
CoalTrain49 said:
Most people can remember where they purchased a rifle. A search of the FFL records would reveal the transfer. The FFL I deal with has software that captures every transaction and is searchable by name and date. If the FFL is out of business that might be a problem.
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Remember that FFL's could dispose of records after 20 years. And many transactions took place before computerization. I bought my first AR in 1968 from Oshman's Sporting Goods in Austin, Texas. Oshman's is long since out of business. Of course I got a receipt, but I have no idea where I put it. Paradoxically, full-automatic guns are well documented. Hardly anybody is going to lose their approved Form 4.
 
Here's what we're up against. The article is from Colorado's largest newspaper and it has a classic Handgun Control Inc bias:
https://www.denverpost.com/2023/01/10/colorado-Democrats-gun-control-bills-lawsuit-threats/

Colorado voters delivered the party historic majorities in the state Senate and House of Representatives this past November, with some key races being run on explicitly pro-gun control promises. A poll commissioned by Giffords, a gun control advocacy organization, likewise indicated gun violence was top of mind for many voters as they cast their ballots — and that was before the horror of the latest mass shooting in the state.

No legislation has been formally introduced, but members have been pitching general ideas: strengthening the extreme risk protection order law; wait times on purchases; age limits; outright bans on certain types of firearms. They’ve also formed a gun violence prevention caucus with more than 20 members.

In 2021 alone, more than 1,000 Coloradans died from gun violence, Senate President Steve Fenberg, a Democrat from Boulder, said Monday in remarks acknowledging the start of the legislative session.
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You could write up a statement with a list of your firearms, including Serial #’s, sign and swear to it before a notary, who would then seal it, with the date.

You could attach sheets with photo’s of each serial # if you really want to get wild and crazy.

Mail a copy certified mail to yourself, don’t open it.
 
Speedo66 said:
You could write up a statement with a list of your firearms, including Serial #’s, sign and swear to it before a notary, who would then seal it, with the date.

You could attach sheets with photo’s of each serial # if you really want to get wild and crazy.

Mail a copy certified mail to yourself, don’t open it.
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And no "fiat registration", and no one knows what you have unless/until necessary by court of law, to prove ones innocence. But it should be on the prosecution to have to prove you didn't own them before the law enacted, I wouldn't submit them until I absolutely had to.

The fact that we are having this discussion in remembering the sacrifice and memory of those who gave their lives to establish our constitution, bill of rights and other founding documents; is disheartening/sickening to say the least. And for all those citizens in countries stripped of their firearm rights that had a boot on their face under tyranny would be shaking their heads as how willingly our countries citizens are to give up rights and provide even greater power to a government that was only established to serve "we the People."
 
CoalTrain49 said:
I'm not an attorney but I'm thinking the burden to prove you didn't own the firearm before the law goes into effect would be on the prosecutor. How exactly are they going to do that when in fact you did own it before the law goes into effect. Our magazine restrictions went into effect last summer and I don't see many people worried about that. Nobody keeps records on their magazine purchases.

The law will stop the sales in the future and that's about it.
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For the next couple of years the enforcement can be lax. Once you get 10 or 20 years out it'll be easier to start harassing people. I didn't buy my first handgun until about 15 years ago. How many people on the forum have kids that are not into guns today but might decide to go buy a Glock next week and want to start getting into shooting. Many of the people on this forum probably have all their bases covered when it comes to owning a variety of guns but every single generation going forward will be getting screwed.
 
reddog81 said:
For the next couple of years the enforcement can be lax. Once you get 10 or 20 years out it'll be easier to start harassing people. I didn't buy my first handgun until about 15 years ago. How many people on the forum have kids that are not into guns today but might decide to go buy a Glock next week and want to start getting into shooting. Many of the people on this forum probably have all their bases covered when it comes to owning a variety of guns but every single generation going forward will be getting screwed.
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Agreed, even those of us that have purchased legislative "hot ticket" items for future gifting to kids and family could also find themselves not able to do so with some of the legislation that is being pushed.
 
Yeah we have already seen bills that would make lever guns illegal. Say a pcc or 22lr lever gun that holds 14 shots, the bill says "magazine capacity greater than 12 rounds" and they conveniently forget to leave off the part about semi autos and "detachable magazines" so it's everything.
Even a 30-30 that holds 8, next awb they do will make the mag limit 7 and get all those 94AEs used in drive by shootings.
 
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Here's the proposed definition of an assault rifle:
  • A semiautomatic rifle that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine, or that may be readily modified to accept a detachable magazine, and has one or more of the following characteristics:
    • A pistol grip.
    • Any feature capable of functioning as a protruding grip that can be held by the non-trigger hand.
    • A folding, telescoping, thumbhole, or detachable stock that is otherwise foldable or adjustable in a manner that operates to reduce the length, size, or any other dimension, or otherwise enhances the ability to conceal the weapon.
    • A flash suppressor.
    • A functional grenade launcher.
    • A shroud attached to the barrel, or that partially or completely encircles the barrel, allowing the bearer to hold the firearm with the non-trigger hand without being burned, but excluding a slide that encloses the barrel.
    • A threaded barrel.
  • A semiautomatic rifle that has a fixed large-capacity magazine.
  • A .50 caliber rifle.
  • A semiautomatic pistol that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine, or that may be readily modified to accept a detachable magazine, if the semiautomatic pistol meets another set of circumstances (found here).
  • A semiautomatic shotgun that meets another set of circumstances (found here).
  • A semiautomatic firearm that has the capacity to accept a belt ammunition feeding device.
  • A semiautomatic firearm that has been modified to be operable as an assault weapon as defined.
  • Any part or combination of parts designed or intended to covert a firearm into an assault weapon as defined.
 
Speedo66 said:
You could write up a statement with a list of your firearms, including Serial #’s, sign and swear to it before a notary, who would then seal it, with the date.

You could attach sheets with photo’s of each serial # if you really want to get wild and crazy.

Mail a copy certified mail to yourself, don’t open it.
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If you do this, do it separately for each individual gun. If you use a consolidated envelope containing proof for multiple guns, and the authorities open the envelope to clear you for one gun, and return the envelope to you, it won't help you for the rest of the guns (because the contents of the envelope could be altered).
 
AlexanderA said:
If you do this, do it separately for each individual gun. If you use a consolidated envelope containing proof for multiple guns, and the authorities open the envelope to clear you for one gun, and return the envelope to you, it won't help you for the rest of the guns (because the contents of the envelope could be altered).
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I was going to suggest the same thing, but didn't want to muddy my previous post. My angle was more specific to not giving them all the information at once but only to the firearm pertained to the case. But your point is of greater concern over the tampering of the contents.
 
Assault rifle: “A semi auto rifle that has a fixed large capacity magazine.”

What do they consider large capacity? Will SKS’s be legal? Or will there be a run on 5 round SKS fixed mags?
 
BreechFace said:
I was going to suggest the same thing, but didn't want to muddy my previous post. My angle was more specific to not giving them all the information at once but only to the firearm pertained to the case. But your point is of greater concern over the tampering of the contents.
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All my guns are on my homeowner's insurance. That should be acceptable as proof.
 
Night Rider said:
All my guns are on my homeowner's insurance. That should be acceptable as proof.
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I generally send my insurance company a list of what I own every year or two. I date it and print the email for my records. I also have a spread sheet that has fields for serial numbers, purchase dates, who transferred the firearm (FFL) and who I purchased it from. There was a time in this state when private sales without a FFL transfer were legal. I fail to see how a person could be prosecuted in a situation where there wasn't a UBC and private sales were legal. In a situation like that there was no requirement to keep records. I'm sure just cash changing hands and no bill of sale were common. The state is moving the goal posts but there's only so far you can move them.
 
Based on the vague method of proving ownership prior to the cut-off in the proposed law, I wonder if this new ban will be enforced in the same manner as the over-15 round magazine ban. For those than aren't residents, while Colorado has a 15 round mag limit, every LGS has mags exceeding 15 rounds in for sale plain sight. 20/30 round AR mags, 17-33 round Glock mags, 50/100 drums are widely available. I was at a gun show last April and the ATF had a table with 3 agents along with ~50 tables selling high capacity mags in plain sight.

Last time I checked, in Colorado there have been zero convictions for large capacity mags a two indictments where the charges were stack up. The law limiting mag capacity is 10 years old....
 
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P89DCSS said:
Based on the vague method of proving ownership prior to the cut-off in the proposed law, I wonder if this new ban will be enforced in the same manner as the over-15 round magazine ban. For those than aren't residents, while Colorado has a 15 round mag limit, every LGS has mags exceeding 15 rounds in for sale plain sight. 20/30 round AR mags, 17-33 round Glock mags, 50/100 drums are widely available. I was at a gun show last April and the ATF had a table with 3 agents along with ~50 tables selling high capacity mags in plain sight.

Last time I checked, in Colorado there have been zero convictions for large capacity mags a two indictments where the charges were stack up. The law limiting mag capacity is 10 years old....
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The ATF would have nothing to do with enforcing Colorado law as they are federal enforcement, so not surprising. Now if one was smoking a joint (legal in Colorado, not federally) and possessing a firearm, those ATF agents might get friendly with that person.

I'm betting much of the Sheriff's in the state will refuse to enforce as well as they are bound to the constitution. It would be the police force hired and maintained by a liberal mayor that one would have to worry about.
 
P89DCSS said:
I was at a gun show last April and the ATF had a table with 3 agents along with ~50 tables selling high capacity mags in plain sight.
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The ATF is charged with enforcing federal law. The mag limits are state law. Presumably, the ATF will not involve itself with Colorado's new "assault weapon" ban. And also, many sheriffs outside Denver / Boulder will take a "hands off" attitude.

ETA: Sorry. I wrote this before I saw BreechFace's comment.
 
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