Camping compromise gun, animal vs. people

As a "modern cave dweller" (i.e. I'm not quite an agorophobe, but I rarely leave the house unless I have to and rarely do things outside if I can help it), I don't have to worry about this.

If I did, penetration is the most important thing after placement, so I'd want to go with something that has the extra penetration for animals if needed. It will work better on humans than the personal defense rounds will on big animals.

Anything that works on bears will absolutely work on two legged predators as well. Black bear, .357 magnum or 10 mm and up. For Grizzly/brown bear, .44 magnum and up.

Now if you are running into pot growers run by illegals, take your AR-15 or AK-47 of choice and a bunch of friends armed likewise. Buffalo attack, better be a high powered rifle of your choice.

Not sure that there is a perfect one gun solution for every type of woods encounter in the continental US. For me, my go to woods gun here in Northern Idaho is of course, my Ruger SRH .44 magnum with +P+ 340 gr hardcast.

Since most of my hiking is in north Idaho as well (land of cougars, occasional drug trade, small bears) and since one of my favorite guns anyways is my 65-3 .357, that's usually the first choice. Bears are my least concern; I admit that the 65 is not the first choice even for very small black bears, but it beats a sharp stick. For fast reaction to something out of nowhere right on top of me (cougars, bipeds, and especially feral dogs-probably the most likely) I'm just as happy with the old wheelie. I've been shooting it a long time, and I know where POI is. Of course, if I thought any shooting was even remotely likely, I'd either not go, or go very carefully with a lot of rifle. I'm pretty sure that my track record of not having to shoot at anything while enjoying nature perfection will continue unabated, so the .357 is essentially a "just in case" fallback-a task for which these guns have been well suited for over 75 years.

sidheshooter said:

Since most of my hiking is in north Idaho as well (land of cougars, occasional drug trade, small bears) and since one of my favorite guns anyways is my 65-3 .357, that's usually the first choice. Bears are my least concern; I admit that the 65 is not the first choice even for very small black bears, but it beats a sharp stick. For fast reaction to something out of nowhere right on top of me (cougars, bipeds, and especially feral dogs-probably the most likely) I'm just as happy with the old wheelie. I've been shooting it a long time, and I know where POI is. Of course, if I thought any shooting was even remotely likely, I'd either not go, or go very carefully with a lot of rifle. I'm pretty sure that my track record of not having to shoot at anything while enjoying nature perfection will continue unabated, so the .357 is essentially a "just in case" fallback-a task for which these guns have been well suited for over 75 years.

Click to expand...

Great statement. Don't go or carry a big rifle. So very true. The only trouble for me is that I am still out of state for hunting in Idaho and I have been told carrying a rifle without a hunting license could get me into an inquiry about poaching. Can't win for lose. For me, I would much rather just shoulder my .444 Marlin.

Simple:
East of the Mississippi a Ruger SP101 with handloads of 158 gr. JHP at 1200 fps.

West of the Mississippi a Ruger GP100 with handloads of 125 gr. TMJ at 1600 fps.

I did a ~12 mile hike with a 7000' elevation gain/loss from Ten Mile Shelter to Marmot Pass via the Big Quilcene River Trail this weekend for my 49th Bday. It's a very long hike and every ounce is important. I brought along my G20SF with a ten round magazine. Guess what? I lived! Without the hand cannon, without the full 15 rounds the gun can hold, without the rifle....



Put these coordinates into Bing Maps, click Birds Eye View. Scroll left (east) down the valley to where you see the FS road. That's where you start.


Didn't attack:


Pistol is a WHOLE 20' away!


Every ounce matters:

I don't want a big hiking gun, an airweight revolver in a caliber I can get snake loads is fine. I love my kit gun. You guy's can keep those boat ancors.

beag_nut said:

Simple:
East of the Mississippi a Ruger SP101 with handloads of 158 gr. JHP at 1200 fps.

West of the Mississippi a Ruger GP100 with handloads of 125 gr. TMJ at 1600 fps.

Click to expand...

With all due respect, I am not sure I agree with those recommendations. Some of the largest black bears on record have come from the east coast. Some were nearly 900 pounds in the wild. Every year, they harvest 500, 600 and 700 pound black bears that rival the size of the average grizzly in PA and other eastern states.

In such, I couldn't ever recommend hollow points for woods guns where you could encounter black bears possibly as large as that. Nor do I believe I would want a .357 in 125 gr's either. I use BB .357 180 gr bullets when walking around the edges of town in some of the parks that border the woods in our area. The largest bullets and hard cast to improve penetration is what most folks consider with a dedicated woods gun. I believe that applies throughout the entire country, east and west of the big river.

I could legally open carry my .44 magnum, but the risk of bear in those areas is fortunately still very rare, unlike Anchorage where bears are tolerated in the middle of the city. In the woods, it is my .44 magnum, or my .444 Marlin over my shoulder.

Mainsail said:

I did a ~12 mile hike with a 7000' elevation gain/loss from Ten Mile Shelter to Marmot Pass via the Big Quilcene River Trail this weekend for my 49th Bday. It's a very long hike and every ounce is important. I brought along my G20SF with a ten round magazine. Guess what? I lived! Without the hand cannon, without the full 15 rounds the gun can hold, without the rifle....

Put these coordinates into Bing Maps, click Birds Eye View. Scroll left (east) down the valley to where you see the FS road. That's where you start.

Didn't attack:

Pistol is a WHOLE 20' away!

Every ounce matters:

Click to expand...

Are you going to climb Everest on your 50th? Great pictures and happy birthday.

An advantage (and there are many) of a revolver is that one can carry it loaded with different rounds in each chamber of the cylinder. Thus, when I am in VA I carry the first two loaded with snake shot, the next two with blanks, and the final two with 158 gr. solids. The blanks are to (hopefully) scare non-cub accompanying bears. Mom bears with cubs are special, in every respect.
Magic markers make great identifying marks on the case rims. Also carry a speed loader or two loaded with heavier stuff. Of course, that's when I have the GP100. The SP101 has one fewer round capacity.

Being in Ky I can see no need for anything bigger than my .41 mag Redhawk loaded with hardcast bullets and a couple or 3 speedloaders.

Blanks??? 1/3 to 40% of your capacity is committed to blanks??

If you're in the woods, a safe backstop is easy to find in case you simply want to make noise with real ammo. The difference here is, you can shoot a bullet into a tree and make noise, but you can't shoot a threat with a blank.

For me, it's my EDC which is comfortable to carry while hiking or backpacking for most of the day: my Ruger SP101 3" .357. I think it is an excellent compromise for weight/size/power. I train with it frequently and shoot it well. When I travel via air in CONUS, and plan on hitting the outdoors I usually take my 9MM Ruger SR9C because I care about it less than my .357s ... I think the likelihood of an attack by man or beast in a remote area is well, remote. But I follow the Boy scout motto of "be prepared." I think the threat of exposure or dehydration are much more likely.

twinny said:

oh, baloney. there's no grizzlies in PA, or anywhere but Alaska, yellowstone and MT, man. The biggest black bears are 600 lbs, and that's VERY rare, being a huge male, fattened up for hibernation. Most black bears, being juvenile or female, most of the year, are 200 lbs or so. They don't require any more penetration than a big, fat biker on speed.

Click to expand...

twinny, that is perhaps the funniest perspective I've ever read, Gotta file that one away for reference!

If I were going any place where I had serious qualms about a good .45acp, I would not be thinking about another pistol.

When the world was younger, and I did quite a few trips to Alaska/Yukon/British Columbia, I carried a rifle. Usually a 45-70 lever action.

I switched over from a 9mm or 45 to carrying my new SR22 this summer. Our first hunt out this year we had a bear come in on us. No real sweat it run off when I made it aware we were there, but the first thing I thought was....22LR now we've went and done it. I switched over to get a little more distance and accuracy for coyotes.

twinny said:

oh, baloney. there's no grizzlies in PA, or anywhere but Alaska, yellowstone and MT, man. The biggest black bears are 600 lbs, and that's VERY rare, being a huge male, fattened up for hibernation. Most black bears, being juvenile or female, most of the year, are 200 lbs or so. They don't require any more penetration than a big, fat biker on speed.

Click to expand...

Hey, you forgot IDAHO. We have a bunch of grizzly and even more packs of wild wolves. PA does actually produce huge black bears for some reason. One was nearly 900 pounds a couple of years ago:

The heaviest black bear ever recorded in Pennsylvania was shot and killed by a bow hunter just north of Fernwood Resort in Pike County on Monday.

The Pennsylvania Game Commission confirmed that David Price of Barrett Township killed the 17-year-old bruin, which had an estimated live weight of 879 pounds. The bear had a field-dressed weight of 744 pounds.

Commission says record-breaking bear kill was OK
Price's bear was 15 pounds heavier than the state's previous record holder, a 864-pound bear killed by Doug Kristiansen of Dingman Township in 2003. That bear was also shot in Pike County.

Click to expand...

http://www.poconorecord.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20101119/NEWS/11190341/-1/NEWS01

That was not a fluke, they routinely harvest 500 pound and larger bears in PA very frequently.

“Pennsylvania has become one of America’s top black bear hunting states, both for the incredible size some of our black bears attain and for their increasing availability here. Today, bears are taken in 50 or more counties annually,” said Vern Ross, executive director of the PGC.

Although other states have produced large bears, none have done so as consistently as Pennsylvania. The 700- and 800-pound bruins shot in the past three seasons are truly exceptional, yet they consistently show up at bear check stations each season. We couldn’t even include the 500- and 600-pound class for lack of space!

Click to expand...

Read more: http://www.gameandfishmag.com/2010/10/05/hunting_big-game-hunting_pa_1005_02/#ixzz28xF3Z279

That is bigger than the average grizzly.

The corn there must be like crack.. Winnie crack corn and I don't care.. sing it!

What I carried today works for me. Ruger 4 5/8 inch Super Blackhawk 44 Magnum carried in a Simply Rugged Cattleman holster. A good holster combined with a thick leather belt make all the difference in the world as far as carry comfort goes. Plus the Cattleman is designed for quick access. I like to load the first 2 rounds with 300 grain XTP's or 320 grain LBT's followed by 4 305 grain CorBon Penetrators. The gun is super accurate with the XTP as well as the 320's. But for the last 4 shots I prefer those Penetrators. They are one super tough bullet. In the middle of winter any of my Glocks or 357's may get carried. I usually carry 2 expanding bullets [ XTP's or Gold Dots or Speer Unicore SP] followed by hard cast or flat point FMJ's. One exception is that on Fathers day I always go for a hike and carry my fathers 6 inch Colt Python loaded with 200 grain CorBon hard cast loads. I carry it in a Kramer pancake holster.

No big bears in my neck of the woods.
So, the XD45 will do just fine....

Why compromise? Granted, a person might be able (practically or legally) to carry only a handgun, but there could be times when big hunks of lead at rifle velocities are the ticket.

In my region, I'd go with a .357 Magnum revolver and, if I'm gonna be out there a while, I'll find a way to pack a .357 rifle. Both with full house 180-gr flatnose rounds. Where critters are bigger and tougher, a .44 Magnum revolver with 240gr flatnose and a 45-70 rifle with 405gr flatnose.

I really can't see going into the wild for any length of time without a rifle.

A passable alternate for the rifles would be the same 12ga one uses for HD, but loaded with a couple 00 buck followed by a slug or two.

Im live in the great north and my "one handgun to do it all" is a 4' 629 with 240 grain JHPs or 255-265 grain Kieth bullets. Fine for most animals and fine for anti-personel use. If I am fishing in brown bear habitat, I pack the .500, but for almost every other use the .44 is my constant companion.

The gun has enough weight to make even heavy 320 grain loads fairly easy to control. The gun is stock except for a set of Pachmeyr grips and a Belt Mountain locking base pin. It is a very nice packing gun. Heavy enough to help with the recoil of heavy loads but light enough for easy packing.