Trail/Camping gun decisions

[MCgunner]

If you want easy on the ears, load that .45 colt up with FFFG. Of course, if you fire it, you'll need to clean it pretty soon. I shoot .357 afield occasionally. Doesn't bother me, but I do NOT like ported guns like the Trackers. I shoot a standard 4" barrel'd .357 medium frame gun. My outdoor loads are 14.5 grains 2400 behind a 165 grain (158 Lee mold) as loaded gas checked SWC. My .38 is usually 2.7 grains B'eye behind a 148 grain Lee wadcutter. Very accurate for small game.

David the .38 SPl even at +P pressures it is esay on the ears. At +P pressures those 158gr SWC over 5.4gr of Unique are going about 950fps from the 4" tube.

I split the difference on the 4.6-5.4 grains, 5.0 grains Unique and a 158 SWC. It's milely +P, but I've fired lots of 'em in the little Rossi with no ill affects. I also have a 4" heavy barrel M10 Smith and a little 2" Taurus 85 that's a deep concealment CCW, but I do carry when afield sometimes when I don't wanna carry a belt gun, like when I'm fishing. I've dispatched 4' black tip sharks with it before boating 'em.

Really, except for the fact that my property has hogs on it that I'd want something adequate for if I get a shot at one, which happened once and my .357 did the job, .38 is plenty around here. We don't have bear nor cats bigger than bobcat.

One thing I do, I've kinda gotten into kayaking. I like to carry when I'm in the bayous around here, lots of gators. I usually take the little stainless .38 snubby because it's stainless and compact. I carry it in a fanny pack. When I'm wade fishing off the kayak, I just clip my mini revolver to the collar of my shirt. I have a dry box in the yak, but I just got into this stuff and really haven't worked that one out, yet, very well. Wade fishing is done in salt water, though, so the only reason to carry is defense against humans, no gators to worry about. The mini revolver ain't much, but it beats nothing.

 

[amd6547]

In my years of backpacking, my main concern has also been humans. I have carried everything from a six inch 44mag (too heavy) to a 22mag mini revolver (too light). A 38snub fit the bill for quite a few trips...it was light enough to not be a burden on a multi-day pack trip, and I was satisfied with it's performance, and my ability to make hits at 25yds.
One of my favorite trail guns is the Tokarev pistol...it is flat, compact, and the 7.62x25mm offers impressive penetration, and is flat shooting out to 100yds. A plus is the low cost of both pistol and ammo...I don't mind subjecting it to trail abuse. Mine has never jammed, and is a blast to shoot long-range with. The ability to take a 100yd shot could come in handy.
I recently got an SP101 3" 357, and it is just crying out to go backpacking.
There have been occaisions where I was glad to be armed, though I have never needed to show a weapon. The most dangerous places are trailheads, and any place close enough to them to easily carry a 12 pack of brew.

 

[mjb]

I hike in the appalacian mountains and I always carry my Colt Delta Elite
10mm loaded with double tap. I am more concerned with idiots boobytrapping their pot fields then black bears.

 

[David E]

Autos tossing brass into the countryside is not a concern in the least.

The reason I'm carrying the gun is for protection, not for plinking, so any brass tossed won't matter to me at all.

I'm thinking more and more that a hicap poly-framed gun would be hard to beat for general woods walking.

 

[MCgunner]

I'm thinking more and more that a hicap poly-framed gun would be hard to beat for general woods walking.

I prefer revolvers. Most autos cannot match the average revolver for power and accuracy. I value both in an outdoor gun. I figure there's less chance of a shootout in the field and more chance that one would be at extended range if it DID happen. I hit with regularity past 100 yards with my revolvers and the .357 will still get through a torso at that range and then some. I've killed deer to 50 yards with it.

 

[David E]

One reason I'm thinking about the poly gun is for the abuse factor.

I doubt I'll ever leave my Model 29 or 25-5 in the safe for good, I like them too much!

 

[bad_aim_billy]

I hunt and camp in grizzly/black/wolf/cougar/moose territory. Been very close to moose, seen black bear, grizzly tracks. Never seen cougar or wolves. Carry bear spray and sometimes a .22 pistol for plinking. More concerned with the weather and injuries(hypothermia, lightning, broken ankle, etc...) than wildlife...

 

[techmike]

Backpacker- Great post. Thanks for sharing you experience! Nice to hear from someone who can back up his opinions with actual time in the woods.

 

[RKRCPA]

I carry a 44 Spl, either my Flattop Blackhawk or my 696, depends on my mood. I don't think I'm likely to get into a protracted firefight while wandering in the woods.

 

[carbuncle]

This is a very informative thread, thanks to the OP for posing the question and everyone's thoughtful replies.

I'm trying to get my wife into backpacking, and she has expressed some interest in doing short trips but has made it clear that she would like me to be armed if we are that far out from civilization. No problem there.

My stomping grounds are in Washington State, where one is likely to encounter elk, black bear (I hear there are Grizzlies up by the Canadian border, but I don't know anyone who's seen one), cougar and a variety of two-legged predators. Since the black bear are generally quick to spook and avoid people, my considerations are really the other three. I've seen more than my share of sketchy people and backwoods residences on the trails in Washington, and one of my friends survived a cougar attack on the Olympic Peninsula so these are the two I'm focused on.

I am thinking that I will pick up a 4" barrel .357 revolver in the springtime, as I think that a hot .357 load will discourage any two-legged predator and hopefully give a cougar a hard time (if I can get to the gun, cougars are very efficient predators: if you see one it's only because they aren't hungry and don't care about you). My wife can do some regular practice with .38 loads to get familiar with the weapon, and the 4" barrel is practical for carry and concealment.

For reference, back when I started shooting in the '90s one of my first acquisitions was a Dan Wesson .357 with a 6" barrel. Great gun, wish now that I hadn't sold it, but the 6" barrel was kind of unwieldy in the field since I wasn't using it for hunting. It came with a shoulder holster and I have to say that that is easily my least favorite method of carry, particularly with a pack.

 

[MCgunner]

For reference, back when I started shooting in the '90s one of my first acquisitions was a Dan Wesson .357 with a 6" barrel. Great gun, wish now that I hadn't sold it, but the 6" barrel was kind of unwieldy in the field since I wasn't using it for hunting. It came with a shoulder holster and I have to say that that is easily my least favorite method of carry, particularly with a pack.

Well, with a DW, barrel length is optional. A few minutes with the barrel nut tool and you can have a 2" concealed carry or a 4" hiking gun. All you need is the extra barrels and shrouds. Those DW pistol packs always interested me.

 

[Guillermo]

Carbuncle

When hiking I use a Galco "dual action" holster. It can be worn crossdraw style or strong side. After a few hours it is sometimes nice to have the option of moving it.

The main thing that you need is a good belt. I love my 9:11 Instructors reinforced belt although many make them. A reinforced belt will change your "carry life".

 

[carbuncle]

Thanks for the tip on the holster, I like Galco products so I will look into that one!

MCgunner: don't rub it in, I really regret selling the DW. It was a great gun, very accurate and the recoil was downright pleasant. Note that I didn't specify a brand of revolver, DW is still very much on the list if I can find a good one. I saw a 6" barrel version in a local shop a couple of weeks ago and was sorely tempted...

 

[336A]

Really, except for the fact that my property has hogs on it that I'd want something adequate for if I get a shot at one, which happened once and my .357 did the job, .38 is plenty around here. We don't have bear nor cats bigger than bobcat.

Yup the .38 SPL is more useful than a lot of folks think. Over on another forum there was quite a big buzz about using 200gr bullets in the .38 SPL. One member gave a first hand report on how he used his snubby loaded with the Lyman 358439 200gr bullet on a deer. The doe walked under his tree stand only 7ft below him. That big ol' hunk of lead was only going about 650fps from his snubby. Anyway the slug hit the spine, continued to travel through the chest cavity liquifying the heart and lungs, veered of into the front foreleg shattering it, then driving deeply into the frozen earth upon exiting The doe dropped instantly, so much for the .38 SPL being a weakling unable to handle woods chores.

The other reason I wanted to post that story is because some of the uniniated need to understand that a handgun at most times will be used at short range. Since we are talking trail guns that means all will be sporting facory sights. For that reason most folks myself included should keep shots to 25yd or less to ensure a good effective hit. Anything past that and I'm using my Marlin .44 1894SS.

When camping or hiking where bears or even big cats may be prevelent, as long as good trash discipline is followed most folks will never be bothered. Which reminds me of a incident that happened a few years back. My wife and I were camping in a very popular state park which is heavily populated with black bears. It is so bad that they turn an electric fence on at night that surrounds the dumpsters. My wife and I always made sure to pack up all of the food and put it and the coolers inside our truck, this is also park policy there. The family that was camping next to us were having some sort of shin-dig and sat up all night getting tanked. They left their cooler setting and coleman stove out only to be wakened to a bear destryoing it about 4:30 that morning.
SO always practice good trash and food discipline when camping or hiking always, or you may end up paying a big price.
For holsters I prerfer those made by Simply Rugged.

 

[MCgunner]

I bought this Russian Makarov service flap holster once, just threw it in on an order of other stuff I wanted because it was cheap. The thing is padded with a thick material and a speed strip of wadcutters fits in the spare mag pouch, kinda cool. My Rossi 3" .38 fits great! It has these little rings front and back that I hang it from my hiking belt (has pouches with stuff like snake bite kit, multitool, mag light, water treatment tablets and canteen, etc, sort of a survival kit in a belt) on those cheap carbiners. Works great for quick on and off since I wear this thing sometimes while hunting where I cant have the revolver along. I could also hang it from a backpack belt strap, but my day pack I'm usually carrying rides high enough not to interfere with a gun belt. A chunk of coat hanger hung from the carbiners and I can tote any of my holsters, but that cheap Mak holster is just way cool LOL I have another cheap flap holster for my 4" .357 and an Uncle Mike for my .45 Colt Blackhawk. It works for me. I need it to be quick removable and this idea came to my feeble mind. You might call it "redneck engineering".

As I see it, even in black bear country, I don't need more than that little Rossi, but the K frame size .357 really isn't that much more weight for more power if I think I might need it.

 

[Mastifflover]

Great thread! It's nice to hear from folks that have actual woods experience rather than mall ninjas out for day trips.

Here in north central PA we are starting to get some mountain lions again and have the occasional black bear. I don't worry about either so I normally just take my edc which is now a Glock 26. I used to tote a 4" .357 but stopped because of the weight.

I'm comfortable enough with the Glock platform that I'm thinking a Glock 29 in 10mm might be my next gun purchase as it would fill the woods role nicely.

 

[leadcounsel]

This same thread comes up about once per week. "Search" is your friend.

Same advice... 2 legged predators are your biggest threat. Carry what you would normally carry. And add a $50 can of bear repellant OC spray. More humane way of dealing with bears and critters.

 

[Dr.Rob]

Camping/Hunting big game: .44 Mag Ruger Vaquero 7.5 inch full of 300gr soft points.

Hiking/Backpacking: Colt Magnum Carry with 158 gr Hydra shocks.

I've used my Vaquero to try and run off a pretty big (biggest I ever saw) black bear. Fired a round into the ground about 10 feet (10 feet between me and the bear) from the bear and he wasn't impressed. Me waving said shiny gun around in my underwear yelling "GET AWAY BEAR" and running at it made the bear move off a safer distance. Second shot had similar effect. Bear wasn't scared. Finally ran it off by chasing it acoss a field with some dime store firecrackers.

Our fault the bear showed up in camp, someone forgot to put away the coffee. Store your food properly you won't have issues.

Cougars are another matter, if you're being stalked theres a really good chance you'll never see it. If you see one, you're likely not in danger. But any pistol is better than none 'around camp' if you take the time to practice with it.

 

[David E]

There is a difference between simply asking "What's a good Trail gun" and "what thoughts do YOU go thru when selecting yours?"

As many have posted, the answer depends on a plethora of variables. What makes sense for one outing may not make any sense on the next.

These are the thought processes I was hoping to elicit.

 

[Tamlin]

I'm a camper/hiker, and not a die-hard backpacker. Meaning, I don't mind a gun with a little more weight. My default trail/camping gun is a 4" Ruger GP100 .357. It's perfect for me, because I can load .38's for plinking or rabbit hunting, or .357's for self-defense against practically anything. I also pack a Rossi .357 carbine levergun (16" bbl) for extra plinking/SD options. Sometimes, though, I'll forego the GP100 in favor of my S&W 4" 629 .44 Mag. For no other reason than Just Because! I haven't ever needed to draw my weapon against anything, but there have been a couple of times when I was glad I had it with me.

 

[MillCreek]

Carbuncle, I live and hike in the same area as you. I have been backpacking, xc skiing, mountain biking and snowshoeing in this area for about 40 years now. For reasons of weight and compactness, my typical outdoor rec carry gun is now a 2.25" .357 stainless SP-101. My 2.75" stainless Security Six used to be my primary, but as I get older and want to reduce the load, the SP-101 took over. Although I do sometimes carry one of my stainless Taurus 650s in .357 since it is a very snag-free profile.

 

[9MMare]

As another western Washingtonian....

Seeing a cougar up close (30') is the thrill of a lifetime. And you spend alot of time looking back over your shoulder when hiking out

 

[dmazur]

I've seen cougars three times on the Olympic peninsula, twice fairly close. I believe they are increasing in numbers here.

I hike alone quite often, and I do worry about my "six".

Considering their habits, I doubt if I could shoot one to prevent an attack. Not a very comforting thought, but I might have to shoot one to get it off my back...

 

[MillCreek]

It is a source of no little irritation to me that as much time I have spent in the mountains of Washington state, I have pretty much seen bupkis in the way of large wildlife. I saw a black bear from about 100 yards away north of Lake Chelan, but that was it. Lots of small wildlife, up to the size of deer/elk, but nothing in the way of large predators.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

If you want to see bears, leave food lying around your camp.

A few years ago, a fellow who liked peanut butter was camping along the Ozark Highland Trail. Apparently he had been eating peanut butter sandwiches before climbing into his sleeping bag. A bear came by that night, looking for a snack, and being unable to figure out how to get into the tent, dragged the tent (camper inside) off. After about a hundred yards, he decided he had something he didn't want, so he dropped tent and camper and wandered off.