Range Rage

This.
Again, this.

I dunno what it is about you old timers and constantly blaming "Young Hooligans" and their darn "Vidiya Games!"

That's why, despite some of the "inconveniences" associated with it, I like the Game and Fish Commission's local, staffed range. Accidents happen (shot target holders, minor trash), but don't expect to stay long if you're acting like a thug.

Is that the range on West Charleston? I haven't been there for quite a while.

The BLM asked our group to move to a safer place to shoot years ago, called the hubcap turn off. It is further west of Las Vegas and safer all around for handguns to machineguns. Sometimes the local shooters set a time to clean the junk the southern imports leave there, as there is no charge for dumping and it can't be seen from the freeway. Also had a couple of eagle scouts organize range clean ups in the mountains that have kept the areas open for shooting.

I've seen very poor people collecting 22LR cases to turn in for recycle money. They aren't there to clean the range, but it does help some.

I don't take targets with me. The idiots always leave stuff to shoot. But I do put some stuff in the truck bed before leaving, just cause. And I do pick up my brass and any other I might reload.

Here come the safety nazis.....

I saw that a outdoor range near me(about 70min away) spent some tax $$$ to rehab a county parks gun range.
I read over the new website safety rules & they are strict.
I'm thinking someone's mother runs out & gripes about sunscreen or starts yelling about the loud noises.
I might give the site a try. The pics look good & it's $10.00 for a all day pass.
It's a supervised(range safety officer) type place so I don't think any hoodlums will be lurking there.
I don't mind the "pick up your trash" rules but the "no holsters" "no rapid fire" "no cleaning or inspections" etc places are a tad too much.

Rusty

[QUOTE-loose noose] Well some idiots decided to shoot up the barriers, left old computer screens, and shot up TV's, couches, old batteries, and knocked over the barriers, and shot up the sand bags and just literally trashed what was a decent looking range. I wonder just how much longer they are going to allow anyone to shoot out there.[/QUOTE]

Wow. The range I use only allows paper targets. I got bored of shooting paper one day, and I ran out of paper targets. So I decided to put out 3 plastic water bottles to finish sighting in one of my rifles. Shooting those water bottles made me feel really guilty and was worried I would get kicked off the range.

This is why I love private, low membership ranges...

There used to be 3 or 4 abandoned gravel pits where I used to shoot. They were on State land and you could drive to them. They were far enough away from any private residential property that shooting even HP rifles was safe. This spring I made a trip to all of them looking for a place to shoot. They were all gated and locked with concrete barriers on each sides of the road. I called the DNR and ask why they had essentially locked the public out of public land used for recreation. Their response was we had too many people dumping at those sites and had to lock them up. We decided we would clean them up and allow access by walk in only. A few of them would require one to hike a mile or more to access the pit. All this because people can't seem to respect their own rec property.

A gun club that I know was formed by some people who used one of these pits. They made a deal with DNR to have vehicle access to the pit and in return they would keep it clean when they used it and have a clean up day once a year to clean up after anyone else who left garbage. So far it's been working but they still have to keep it locked up so people don't drive in there and dump garbage.

This is why I am thankful every day for having enough land to shoot on my own property. No yahoos to deal with, it's always clean (well except for when my puppy steals my targets), and I can practice the way I want to. I have been visited by a few Copperheads on occasion but they came out on the short end of the stick. No human snakes though.

People have not changed--we just have more of them today.
35 or so years ago--I was taking the kids to the NRA safety program ( kids have to go to get a hunting license) Someone blew up one of the 2 bridges going to the state range.
Just another anti-gunner I guess. Maybe he stole the wood

Having a club be more selective and difficult to become a memeber of helps quite a bit. One club I belong to is in excellent condition and I have never seen anyone abuse the rules and it's always clean and self-policed.

Another "club" I just joined that's closer to home was just a road cut into the woods with a couple of cutouts bulldozed into berms. I heard just before I joined it was like you guys described with tv's and crap lying around all shot up. Apparently there was a group conscience or something and now we have tables bolted to concrete slabs and folks are only shooting paper targets or metal hanging gong privately owned.

The problem was/is that often there's no one around - (no elctric anywhere for cameras). Many times when I'm there shooting alone a car will pull in, pause, and pull back out. My suspicion is that there were (are) non-members using the place who don't care.

Sorry young fellas but my eyes and ears are open and functioning well and I have a feeling this guy is right:

Sad...there have always been dirtbags but I think there are just a lot more per capita than there were when I was growing up. These younger generations have not been taught to respect themselves or others much less private/public property. Everyone is more concerned with hurting feelings than they are in raising a child up in the way they should go...

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Too much evidence of this "ME" generation abounds.

I agree Field tester. I was mowing a picnic area attached to one of our Hydro facilities. There was a new Cadillac with what looked like a retired couple sitting in the car. The gent got out and took a short walk, and as I was mowing I saw movement, looked at the car and the lady rolled the window down and she took their McDonald's trash and dropped it outside of the car.
Very graceful, big bag, two cups and the cardboard cup holder. Must be they felt the servants would take care of it. Which we did.
I am responsible for four picnic areas and see it all. Rubbers, paper towels (clean up), beer/soda bottles, tires, shingles, dog poop, human poop, bags of trash, once the packaging for a HUGE *****! Go figure. We (people) are our worst enemies.

True story!....

It's a bit off topic but in 2000, I was working at a low end apt complex in a medium size city. A guy came in for a job interview with the property owner/manager for a maintaince position. He stumbled out of beat up old car in the parking lot & threw a few bags of fast food trash on the ground.
I went into the manager's office & told him what took place. The property manager threw the guy's job application in the trash.

I am a member of a private club, and if anything the rules are a little too strict. But if you see something say something. I don't like being some one else's mom when it comes to things. But most if the time the don't know they are breaking a rule, so they are happier to hear it from me than a range official. But there are still idiots who purposely do things that could hurt the club. 10% of people seem to care 70% are some what indifferent and the 20% who are malevolent in their actions ruin it fir us all

A few year ago I was a member and eventually voted president of a R/C club. The land is PRIME real estate that had a 600 ft runway, plus a completely area for R/C Cars and Trucks. The gentleman that owned the property never made any comments about trash or maintenance but the majority of us didn't want to let things go and them be out. One Sunday morning I arrived early and trash was unbelievable, every thing from drink containers, cans and fuel cans. After a few others showed up I announce the plan for the day, then around 11:00 I walked over to the frequency board and shut down the flight line. Then I walked from one end of flight line to the other passing out trash bags. I had a bunch of Newer member gripe but no one refused to clean up. After that we had no more issues. To bad you can't do something like that for your shooting area, but when you deal with dead heads what can you expect.

Pick your spots.....

Doing police & security work, I know all about rules/regulations/laws/by-laws/etc.
In some ways though, you have to pick your spots.
In the mid 2000s, I did a security detail for a apartment complex that was turning condo. Basically they gave the residents who had lived there 0-25 years to either "buy" the unit or be evicted. Many chose the later & were being phased out.
My security company was told to enforce the property's "rules & regulations" but it's hard to say; "don't park on the grass" or "don't leave your trash cans out" to tenants who are already under eviction or have given notice to vacate.
Leaving cigarette butts or trash/food wrappers laying around is bad I grant you but when you get nit-picky or go over-board(like a few other forum members posted) then it gets to be excessive.

Rusty

Field Tester said:

I dunno what it is about you old timers and constantly blaming "Young Hooligans" and their darn "Vidiya Games!"

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No kidding. An older person couldn't possibly be to blame for this. After all, the '60s and '70s were decades of such civility and refinement, when accountability and responsibility were embraced by everyone.

Don't get me wrong, there's no shortage of irresponsible youth these days; but to pretend everyone over 40 is a model citizen is just... pathetically shallow. A lack of respect for others isn't something you just magically grow out of. You either respect others, or you don't - whether you're 15 or 50.

ANYWAY...

I don't think I've ever been to a free, public, unofficial shooting location that couldn't be described by the shot-up TVs, refrigerators, broken glass bottles littering the area, etc, etc.

loose noose said:

Went to my local range early this morning. The last time was about a month ago, and to say the least I was totally outraged. The last couple of months, the County put up signs to pickup your empty casings, as well as your targets. They even went so far as to put up shooting barriers, with sand bags, and dragged the dirt near the berm.

Well some idiots decided to shoot up the barriers, left old computer screens, and shot up TV's, couches, old batteries, and knocked over the barriers, and shot up the sand bags and just literally trashed what was a decent looking range. I wonder just how much longer they are going to allow anyone to shoot out there.

On top of all that, my mini-14 with the newly adapted bi-pod didn't shoot for a darn, basically cause I forgot my reading glasses, and could not remember, how to adjust the cheap red dot. I figured it was shooting high at 100 yards, but was unable to get it to shoot lower, and to the right.

Note the range is an old abandoned Metro range, from many years ago, and it doesn't cost anyone to use it. Too bad we've got so many people out here that just have to abuse it. I would dearly love to catch some slob doing the damage to this piece of property, I would definitely get a picture or two, as well as there license plate. Dang that makes me mad.

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Change the dates and locations and this story works at almost every public (unsupervised) range I've ever found in this country. It's truly sad, and pathetic. Shooters are their own worst enemies. We involve ourselves in activities that require a significant amount of maturity and accountability, and most of us are very good about doing what we're supposed to do. But, a few magnificently moronic individuals seem to be drawn to EVERY publicly accessible shooting area, and they all eventually end up being trashed and later closed (or over regulated).

Here in Colorado I can think of at least 6 such locations right off the top of my head, all of which have been force-closed in the past ten years (if I really think hard about it, I could probably name ten of these kinds of locations). In my previous state of residence I can think of a few more places just like these.

I even went to one local range to find that someone had poached a deer right at the berm, then left its carcass there without taking any meat… just shot it to shoot it, since it was on the range. That place was later closed after some mental midget shot his friend accidentally while screwing around. It's ridiculous.

Field Tester said:

This.
Again, this.

I dunno what it is about you old timers and constantly blaming "Young Hooligans" and their darn "Vidiya Games!"

Click to expand...

I hate to say this because I'm not that old of a guy but that is 90% of the problem in my area. I belong to a private club with a gated drive. All members have keys. At least once a year we end up with people sneaking in and damaging things. We catch them sometimes. The last time it was two kids with an AK. Shot up our clubhouse and the transformer on our power pole.

Sounds more like a "good old boy" range. Next somebody will bring in an old school bus to blast away at.

Unfortunatley I think this happens alot with people leavign crap all over. I haven't found a decent place to shoot around me so I joined a club about an hour away, the range is nice and all clean up is done by members once a month. I've only been a memeber since the beginning fo the year but every work Saturday it seems only the same 10 - 15 folks show up for clean up. It never fails though although we have a large sign that says range closed for maintenance peole stil show up and start to unload their gear until we point out it's a clean up day, then back in the car they go and we generally see them show up about noon once we finsh. It ticks me off that they don't even offer to help but at least I know I'm doing my fair share.

Chiltech500 - any nice ranges around you that are takign memebers? I'm already driving to Easton so another 15 - 20 minutes won't bother me.

Some peoples don't know how good they have it. A free range to shoot at and they won't even help keep it clean. That is a shame.

It isn't just at gun ranges.....dirtballs mark their territory every where they go.

Our city put in two new soccer field for kids across the road from my house. Some folks in the adjoining sub-division see it as the new spot to walk their dogs and allow them to defecate on the nicely groomed fields without cleaning up behind them. I assume they don't have kids that play soccer.

The local park has trashcans by the playground so the picnickers have someplace to throw their trash. Sign above them reads....."no fish cleanings". Still on most hot summer days, the smell of rotting fish guts fills the park. I assume the guts are coming from the nearby boat landing so the fishermen don't have to dispose of them when they get home. There used to be trash cans at the boat landing, but between the smell of fish guts, dead bait and the critters they attracted, the city took them away.

The list goes on and on. Selfish, self-serving dirtballs are not just a problem on gun ranges, they are all over. What I see more and more is that those individuals are not the lowest lowlifes of society, but folks with brains and monies that just don't care. They aren't just kids, or the local redneck drunk, but folks with nice houses and new cars with the "me" attitude. With the availability on the rise and the cost of video monitoring equipment going down, I hope that someday soon, folks that think they can get away with this crap because no one else is around, will have to answer to their dirty deeds.

The drawback to constant monitoring is the big brother aspect, and the potential for abuse there. Sucks either way. But unless you can teach scumbags not to be scumbags - the rest of us have to surrender certain things to take care of them.

Of course if I had a working method where I could teach scumbags not to be scumbags - I wouldn't have time to offer thoughts on a forum

I'd be so busy cleaning up the world that I'd make mother Teresa look like a piker, lol.