"Skipping" cases under the ejector star

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D.B. Cooper

D.B. Cooper

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In the past month or so, I have noticed 2-3 times now that my Ruger Redhawk 44 has been "skipping" one case on extraction. The ejector star seems to just jump over a case leaving it stuck in the chamber.

I have also noticed that this seems to only happen with the case is the 4 o'clock position, close to the grip. About 4 months ago, I installed a Pachmyr Presentation grip. I'm aware of issues on some revovlers requiring trimming of the grip to get certain speedloaders to work/fir properly. I have never had an issue with speedloaders (HKS and Safariland Comp I) getting past the grip. Has anyone ever heard of Presentation grips causing extraction issues?

Is it possible I have developed a new habit that is inducing this? What user error would cause this? (Especially or it to only happen in one particular position.)
 
First of all make sure the gun is upside down & hit the ejector rod with the palm of your hand like you mean it. Everything should be out of the gun if you do this. If it doesn't then you have a problem.
 
Is it all the same brand of brass? Sounds like it might be a brass issue. Ive run ito that in the past myself.

Im thinking it must just be coincidence that youre seeing it a 4 o'clock, as thats constantly changing. The only way to no for sure, is to number the charge holes.

I doubt the grips are an issue, unless they arent letting the round past them, which doesnt sound like its the case here.

Unless somehow the case is being extracted, and hitting the grip and being knocked out of line enough for the star to let it slip by and drop back into the chamber. Probably not likely, but, stranger things have happened.

I agree with 351 Winchester, you should be dumping the empties with the muzzle vertical, and with authority and let them drop free. If youre empting the gun muzzle down, youre just leaving yourself open for other trouble down the road. Thats how junk gets under the star, and can cause the gun to not close or lock up properly, and the cylinder to bind when you try to stroke the trigger.
 
351 WINCHESTER said:
First of all make sure the gun is upside down & hit the ejector rod with the palm of your hand like you mean it. Everything should be out of the gun if you do this. If it doesn't then you have a problem.
Click to expand...

Well, I'm hitting the rod forcefully with my right (dominant) hand. (Stress-fire reload). But to put the barrel vertical (muzzle up or down) in the league I shoot, is a disqualifying action, so the barrel is enerally somewhere between 45˚ and not 90˚. That's just the way it has to be.

AK103K said:
Is it all the same brand of brass?
Click to expand...

Yep. Starline.

AK103K said:
I'm thinking it must just be coincidence that youre seeing it a 4 o'clock, as thats constantly changing. The only way to no for sure, is to number the charge holes.
Click to expand...

I don't think it's a particular chamber; I think it's whatever chamber happens to end up at 4 o'clock, which is closes to the grip.

AK103K said:
IsUnless somehow the case is being extracted, and hitting the grip and being knocked out of line enough for the star to let it slip by and drop back into the chamber. Probably not likely, but, stranger things have happened.
Click to expand...

That's exactly what I think might be happening.
 
So the cylinder is in your left hand? The barrel pointed away from you and up at about 45 degrees? And the frame is below the cylinder, or to the right side? Is the cylinder swung completely out, or maybe not quite?
 
D.B. Cooper said:
Well, I'm hitting the rod forcefully with my right (dominant) hand. (Stress-fire reload). But to put the barrel vertical (muzzle up or down) in the league I shoot, is a disqualifying action, so the barrel is enerally somewhere between 45˚ and not 90˚. That's just the way it has to be.
Click to expand...
When I said vertical, I meant muzzle to the sky. You want the empties to go right for the ground.

Ive followed some of Ayoobs ideas over the years as to how to get a revolver reloaded. The method I use, which I believe is the "Stressfire" reload, the gun stays in my right hand, and when you open the cylinder, your right thumb forceably holds the cylinder open as you smack the ejector with your left hand.

Here, I found a video on YouTube so you can see what Im saying better.....




Once you get used to it, its very fast and natural, and works very well.
 
AK103K said:
When I said vertical, I meant muzzle to the sky. You want the empties to go right for the ground.

Ive followed some of Ayoobs ideas over the years as to how to get a revolver reloaded. The method I use, which I believe is the "Stressfire" reload, the gun stays in my right hand, and when you open the cylinder, your right thumb forceably holds the cylinder open as you smack the ejector with your left hand.

Here, I found a video on YouTube so you can see what Im saying better.....




Once you get used to it, its very fast and natural, and works very well.
Click to expand...


That very video is exactly where I learned to reload. (I think I described it wrong in my earlier post, so I removed it.)

But yeah, I was just watching that as you were posting it.
 
D.B. Cooper said:
"skipping" one case on extraction. The ejector star seems to just jump over a case leaving it stuck in the chamber.
Click to expand...
Are you saying that the rim of the case is under the ejector star? If that is the case, it isn't the grip causing the case to to be extracted. If it was the grip stopping ejection, the rim would still be engaged with the star.

Usually when I've seen the star jump over the case...I've seen it a number of time...it has to do with the mouth of the case clearing the chamber and then falling underneath the star before it returns from the end of it's travel. This is usually the result of the gun not being held vertically to allow the case to fall free

Is it possible I have developed a new habit that is inducing this? What user error would cause this? (Especially or it to only happen in one particular position.)
Click to expand...
Given the limitations of the range you are using, there are two things that come to mind:

1. The cylinder might not be fully open during your ejection stroke. Since at 45 degrees, the cylinder would have to be atop the frame it would be easy for the 4 o'clock casing to bounce against the frame and back under the star.

2. The Stressfire technique is built around the muzzle being pointed straight up. If you're restricted from going "muzzle up", you should change to a technique where you're activating the ejection rod with your support hand and driving the casings over your shoulder. Sometimes you just need to utilize a different technique when your favored one is no longer optimal
 
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I'm a stickler for muzzle control rules, but if the range rules won't allow you to do a proper revolver reload even with the cylinder open, that's messed up.

This is coming from someone who teaches people to reload semi-autos with muzzles downrange because when the slide is dropped at the end of the reload (or if it drops prematurely when the mag is inserted), there's a chance of an unintentional discharge at that point. But there's no chance AT ALL that a revolver with its cylinder open is going to discharge. As long as the muzzle comes back down well before the cylinder is swung back into the frame, there shouldn't be a problem.

Safety is extremely important--in fact, it can't be overstated. But IMO, not allowing people to reload a revolver properly in the name of muzzle control makes no sense at all. It's not making anyone safer--it's just causing problems.

There is only one guaranteed way to keep rims from slipping the star in a revolver if you're not allowed to use proper technique. Moon clips.
 
JohnKSa said:
I'm a stickler for muzzle control rules, but if the range rules won't allow you to do a proper revolver reload even with the cylinder open, that's messed up.

This is coming from someone who teaches people to reload semi-autos with muzzles downrange because when the slide is dropped at the end of the reload (or if it drops prematurely when the mag is inserted), there's a chance of an unintentional discharge at that point. But there's no chance AT ALL that a revolver with its cylinder open is going to discharge. As long as the muzzle comes back down well before the cylinder is swung back into the frame, there shouldn't be a problem.

Safety is extremely important--in fact, it can't be overstated. But IMO, not allowing people to reload a revolver properly in the name of muzzle control makes no sense at all. It's not making anyone safer--it's just causing problems.

There is only one guaranteed way to keep rims from slipping the star in a revolver if you're not allowed to use proper technique. Moon clips.
Click to expand...

I agree with you. There are a handful of stupid rules at that range. That said, I prefer the stupid rules over the other range's "free for all" where people point guns at me and walk in front of me while I'm still shooting. So, it's a trade-off.
 
I guess one other option is to reload your own ammo using much shorter brass. The sooner it clears the chamber, the less likely it is to get under the extractor star.
 
D.B. Cooper said:
I agree with you. There are a handful of stupid rules at that range. That said, I prefer the stupid rules over the other range's "free for all" where people point guns at me and walk in front of me while I'm still shooting. So, it's a trade-off.
Click to expand...
ICORE match rules also require what you're having to do. It's really dumb. If I ever have to reload a revolver in some sort of bad situation, I'll be doing it the stupid way because it'll be ingrained in my habits.
 
Does this revolver shoot 44 specials as well as 44 magnum cartridges? If it shoots both does the problem only happen with the shorter 44 specials?
 
Iron Sight said:
Does this revolver shoot 44 specials as well as 44 magnum cartridges? If it shoots both does the problem only happen with the shorter 44 specials?
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I shoot magnums so infrequently that I have no basis for comparison. I have shot probably 3-4k rounds of specials through it, and probably less than 100 magnums.
 
It's the grip!

So I had it out this evening shooting steel in an untimed, non-competitive environment where I could pay close attention to the extraction process. The case coming out of the chamber at the 4 o'clock position is hitting the grip and deflecting every time.

Because I'm not seeing cases under the star every time, I think it's safe to assume there is some other factor in play here, but the grip is definitely interfering with the case coming out of the cylinder. I'm going to swap grips and see if the problem improves. (I never had this problem with the Pachmayr Decelerator grip, but I didn't like the finger grooves.)
 
Could be a little slop in your ejector rod allowing the whole thing to lean to the 10 o'clock position when the case contacts the grip thereby dropping the case at 4 o'clock.
 
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