Is Annealing 22 Hornet Brass Worthwhile?

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JDinFbg

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Anyone who has reloaded 22 Hornet brass knows it is thin and has a short case life. Although I've had my share of neck splits, I think I've tossed most of my 22 Hornet brass due to enlarged primer pockets. I've done a fair number of web searches on the subject of annealing 22 Hornet brass, but haven't seemed to come up with a clear consensus of whether most folks anneal the brass and whether it really gives that much longer service life. So, I'd like to know what the community's opinion is on whether to anneal or not and whether the effort really gives that much longer service life.
 
The cheapest way to handle a hornet brass issue is NOT to go out and buy a bunch of annealing gear. Take your gun to a good gunsmith and have him ream your chamber out to 22 K hornet. If you are not familiar, the K hornet has a straight body and a short neck instead of the standard hornet's taper and long neck. Basically, K hornet is an improved version of the standard hornet.

To make K hornet brass, all you do is shoot standard hornet ammo in your improved chamber. My apology for the poor picture. Not my best effort.

View attachment 1041169
 
Annealing should reduce neck splits, but will do nothing to reduce primer pocket expansion. I don't shoot the Hornet a great deal, but case life does seem less than with many other rounds. Finding a load that developes a little less pressure is probably the best way to extend case life. I'm happy with the case life I get with starting to midrange loads.
 
I neck size my 22 Hornet cases and it extends the case life a few reloadings. My cases never fail due to neck splits. Case head separations are the most frequent mode of failure.

The slender taper just allows the brass to stretch down the chamber on each firing.

Reaming the gun to fire the K-Hornet round would stop alot of that. I just have not gotten around getting my gun re-chambered.
 
I started annealing my brass 20+yrs ago.
It works! Not hard either.
I only do it every 10 or so loadings.

My rifle wants the cases partially completely sized. Letting the case “lie” in the chamber consistently.
Every rifle is a rule unto itself in my experience.
 
GooseGestapo said:
I started annealing my brass 20+yrs ago.
It works! Not hard either.
I only do it every 10 or so loadings.

My rifle wants the cases partially completely sized. Letting the case “lie” in the chamber consistently.
Every rifle is a rule unto itself in my experience.
Click to expand...
Are you talking specifically about annealing 22 Hornet brass, or all brass in general? I do anneal brass for larger cartridges about every 5 loadings and get long service life. But, my 22 Hornet brass seems to go south after 5-6 loadings and usually fails due to lose primer pockets, with just a few neck splits.
 
cfullgraf said:
I neck size my 22 Hornet cases and it extends the case life a few reloadings. My cases never fail due to neck splits. Case head separations are the most frequent mode of failure.
Click to expand...
I only neck size my 22 Hornet brass, also, and have few neck splits. I don't recall ever having a head separation in my 22 Hornet (have had in other cartridges). My 22 Hornet brass usually fails due to enlarged primer pockets. I've been using the same load for decades (9.5 gr. of 2400 driving a 40 gr. bullet) which was well within specs of older reloading manuals, but appears to be over max based on more current reloading manuals. I'm looking to switch to Lil' Gun to see if that will reduce pressure and solve the primer pocket enlargement issue. So if I solve that problem, will I start running into neck split issues, and will annealing really extend my 22 Hornet case life?
 
HowieG said:
The cheapest way to handle a hornet brass issue is NOT to go out and buy a bunch of annealing gear. Take your gun to a good gunsmith and have him ream your chamber out to 22 K hornet. If you are not familiar, the K hornet has a straight body and a short neck instead of the standard hornet's taper and long neck. Basically, K hornet is an improved version of the standard hornet.

To make K hornet brass, all you do is shoot standard hornet ammo in your improved chamber. My apology for the poor picture. Not my best effort.

View attachment 1041169
Click to expand...
I have not heard of that. Thanks for a great piece of info. Completely makes sense!
 
Walkalong said:
I'm generally not a fan of neck sizing anymore, but my Hornet likes it. I don't anneal them.
Click to expand...
I've done and tried both types of sizing methodologies, but for most cartridges I 'optimally size' with a FL sizing die. Meaning, I run the case into the FL sizing die just far enough to set the shoulder back a very small amount for my particular rifle. For the 22 Hornet, that means it just sizes the part of the neck needed to hold the bullet and really does not touch the shoulder.
 
Not sure about the annealing, but you can sometimes get an extra load or two out of loose primer pockets by using S&B primers (assuming that such a thing still exists).
 
As I related in another thread, I’ve got .22Hornet brass dating to the 1970’s.
IMO, if you are expanding primer pockets, you’re running way-way higher pressures than I am.
My go-to high velocity load is 12.5gr of Lil’Gun under a Sierra 40gr Varminter hollow point.
Gets 3,000fps from my Ruger .22Hornet KBZ (heavy barrel stainless, laminated stock).
I’ve had 5/other Hornets. It is the only “keeper”...
I’ve had one case head separation.
Most other cases fail due to split necks. A few to incipient head separation.
Never failed one due to loose primer pockets...
But for last 25+ years, I’ve predominantly used cast bullets.
 
I'm running a 40 Gr V-Max at just over 2400 FPS, so mild, but it shoots great in my finicky Ruger 77/22. When I tried Lil' Gun I was running 2950ish.

GooseGestapo said:
I’ve had 5/other Hornets. It is the only “keeper”...
Click to expand...
I should have kept the old Savage 23D. *Sigh*, or the Sako .22 Hornet I had. I'm such a dunce sometimes.
 
Ruger 77/22 Hornet action. Shilen Select Match barrel chambered in 22 K hornet. Ruger laminated stock. Spec Tech trigger. Barrel chambered and installed by Score High gunsmithing in Albuquerque, NM.

I usually use Winchester brass although I have some Hornady and Privi Partisan brass also. Preferred powders are Lil' Gun, AA 1680, and W680 (obsolete). I use (or did use) Winchester WSR primers. One favorite load uses a 35 grain Vmax in front of a decent amount of Lil' Gun for 3136 fps. Another favorite load for heavier game (coyote) is the 40 grain Nosler Varmageddon or Barnes HP in front of AA 1680 for 2819 fps.

I tend to load down just a bit. Though I have seen velocities as high as 3400 fps with the 35 grain bullet, accuracy is not the best up there at that level, and velocities tend to be erratic.

The chamber and headspace are both match tight and with that straight, sharp shouldered, K hornet cartridge, brass lasts a long time. I full length resize my brass.

View attachment 1041528
 
Swampman said:
Not sure about the annealing, but you can sometimes get an extra load or two out of loose primer pockets by using S&B primers (assuming that such a thing still exists).
Click to expand...

I am sure we can find S&B primers about as well as we can find all the other brands at the moment.:(
 
Kaldor said:
I have not heard of that. Thanks for a great piece of info. Completely makes sense!
Click to expand...

The 22 K hornet was developed by Lysle Kilbourn in 1940, so it's been around for a while. Similar, but slightly larger, is the 218 Mashburn Bee, also developed in 1940. Must have been a good year. If you want a smaller bullet, P.O. Ackely came out with the 17 Ackley hornet in the early 1950's.
 
HowieG said:
Ruger 77/22 Hornet action. Shilen Select Match barrel
Click to expand...
That's gotta be a really proud little action. Mine is box stock, and was very finicky finding a good load. :)
 

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GooseGestapo said:
IMO, if you are expanding primer pockets, you’re running way-way higher pressures than I am.
My go-to high velocity load is 12.5gr of Lil’Gun under a Sierra 40gr Varminter hollow point.
Click to expand...
I suspect you are correct on the primer pocket issue. As I noted in Post #7, for decades I have been using 9.5 gr. of Hercules 2400 (yes, I still have an old supply, but it's about to run out) driving Sierra 40 gr. Hornet bullets and have gotten very good results. That was a mid-range load based on reloading manuals from the 1970's, but is over max based on newer reloading manuals and online data. I suspect that as testing and measuring techniques have improved, testers have identified that 2400 loaded to the old levels was a little excessive. I am embarking on trying Lil'Gun and was looking at 12.5 gr. for several 40 gr. bullets I have available to test. Your post confirms my thinking as to using that load, but I'd like to know if that load produced the smallest groups for you or just high velocity? Based on current loading sources I have looked at, min/max loads for Lil'Gun in the 22 Hornet seem to be all over the map, so it is unclear as to what might provided the best precision. Hodgdon and Speer list 12.0-13.0, Nosler lists 9.0-11.0, Sierra list 9.2-10.6, and Hornady 10.5-13.6, so that blurs the decision. Based on tests of filling several cases to the brim with Lil'Gun and dumping them in the powder scale, my W-W cases max out at about 12.8 grains, so that leaves me wondering how Hornady could have ever come up with a max of 13.6 grains. I've read several posts on the web where folks have commented that you cannot stuff enough Lil'Gun in a 22 Hornet case to produce over-pressure. With my single-shot rifle, I have the luxury to seat bullets out to almost touch the lands, so would not have much, if any, powder compression with 12.5 grains. I guess I have some testing ahead of me. I hope I don't shoot out my barrel before I find the optimal load of Lil'Gun.
 
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Lil’Gun is some strange stuff!
12.5 gives best accuracy, but also excellent velocitys. Likewise same charges in my .218Bee.
I’ve gone as high as 13.5 in some older Winchester brass, but accuracy falls off. Also, above 13.2, velocity began falling likewise.

This is a noted characteristic of Lil’Gun!
When it first came out, max loads were warned about with the .357mag. Max was, and is 18.0gr with a 158gr JACKETED bullet. Going above 18.0 nets LOWER velocities and pressures. A compressed load somehow interferes with flame propagation and attenuates velocities
I see best velocities and accuracy in the .357Mag at 17.8gr. With a 20”bbl Win M1894, I get over 2,100fps.
A well known reloader/writer frequently lists somewhat heavier charges and often somewhat lower velocities. I don’t think he was active when Lil’Gun came out so may have missed the details.

H110 is my #2 powder. Was #1 before Lil’Gun came out.
I use #2400 in my cast bullet loads. 6.2gr with a 50-55gr bullet. 2,000-2,100fps.

Added: It’s essentially impossible to shoot-out a Hornet barrel due to erosion. There is just not enough of a slow enough powder to shoot it out.
Dollars to donuts, any allegedly “shot out” Hornet barrel, is just heavily copper fouled!
Which can be fixed with a good proper cleaning.
 
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12.2 Grs of Lil' Gun gave me 2730 @ 82 degrees, 17.7 Grs gave me 2700 @ 90 degrees a week or so apart. My notes said to try 12.5, but I didn't do it, figuring I was done with Lil' Gun, and I started looking at other powders, 12.2 & 12.7 got three stars in my log, which is a good load, four is very good, and the rare five is great. I went as high as 12.9, but my notes said it was erratic, not to use, and received zero stars.
 
Walkalong said:
That's gotta be a really proud little action. Mine is box stock, and was very finicky finding a good load. :)
Click to expand...

I only shot the factory barrel on this action for a short time. Headspace was a bit long and the barrel was nothing to write home about. I then had the factory barrel reamed a bit to a K Hornet, but that didn't work out well, so then I went all in with the Shilen and had it done right by a shop that knows what it's doing. Changing out the trigger wasn't a bad move either, although the factory Ruger trigger wasn't horrible.
 
One thing I probably should mention about the Hornet is that I noted right off that the rim thickness on the brass is variable. Reminds me of rimfire brass. I measured the rims on a batch of brass and they varied by a small amount. My memory tells me it was a couple of thousandths of an inch between the thickest and thinnest. If you have a picky rifle, or one with loose headspace, you could sort your brass into thick or thin piles and run the thick rims through your gun.

As far as velocities and such, this isn't a long range cartridge to begin with. The fast bullets are the 35 grain jobs and they are blunt little bastards, so they dump velocity pretty quick. The 40 and 45 grainers are a bit better, but if you really stuff the powder behind them, your brass life WILL suffer. I have noted that many people mess around with what I consider are overloads. What saves the day in that case is this is a tiny cartridge so the force applied to the rifle isn't that bad. Such loads will definitely chew up your brass though. That is where those loose primer pockets come from.

I try to keep in mind that the Hornet, or K Hornet, isn't a dragon slayer. If I think I need extra power, I don't stomp on my K Hornet loads. I go get a bigger rifle.
 
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