The Night Rider
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I suspect that this is how things were at warnerwh's range and things got slack over time.
Gun range safety opinions please
- Thread starter warnerwh
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I suspect that this is how things were at warnerwh's range and things got slack over time.
Hugger-4641
Member
Every range I've been to, the bare minimum was bolt open and hands off before anyone goes downrange. The club I'm in now requires a flag in the action also.
You are not overreacting, your range is unsafe, period.
If it's not fixed , it's a matter of "when", not "if" an accident is going to happen.
You are not overreacting, your range is unsafe, period.
If it's not fixed , it's a matter of "when", not "if" an accident is going to happen.
Zerodefect
member
Our pistol range has seat benches behind the range.
You chain your lane closed with a plastic chain hanging on the post. Step behind the yellow line, and sit down.
When everyone does the same everyone says clear, and services their targets. Returns to the bench. When everyone is off the range it goes back to hot.
Anyone caught at a lane with people down range is warned, or dismissed. The rifle range requires open action, the pistol range does not. Hands off lanes and gear only.
It's not rocket science. But if someone wants to turn on a light and walk down range while I'm shooting at them, I can live with that. Weird setup for sure.
You chain your lane closed with a plastic chain hanging on the post. Step behind the yellow line, and sit down.
When everyone does the same everyone says clear, and services their targets. Returns to the bench. When everyone is off the range it goes back to hot.
Anyone caught at a lane with people down range is warned, or dismissed. The rifle range requires open action, the pistol range does not. Hands off lanes and gear only.
It's not rocket science. But if someone wants to turn on a light and walk down range while I'm shooting at them, I can live with that. Weird setup for sure.
Sistema1927
Member
Our outside range has multiple berms and ranges. Each separate range is handled independently. The first member to arrive is the RO for their particular area, and shooters must follow their instructions if they use that portion of the range.
Anyone can call a ceasefire, and at that time all weapons are to be unloaded and grounded with actions open. The RO then confirms this with all shooters, and then gives permission to go down range. No firearms handling is permitted while the range is cold. Only the RO can call the range hot again. Upon leaving, the RO asks for someone else to take over that duty. Seems to work well. Of course, all members had to attend a safety briefing and complete a safety quiz each year upon membership renewal. There is no toleration for breaking the rules, and violators will lose their membership.
Anyone can call a ceasefire, and at that time all weapons are to be unloaded and grounded with actions open. The RO then confirms this with all shooters, and then gives permission to go down range. No firearms handling is permitted while the range is cold. Only the RO can call the range hot again. Upon leaving, the RO asks for someone else to take over that duty. Seems to work well. Of course, all members had to attend a safety briefing and complete a safety quiz each year upon membership renewal. There is no toleration for breaking the rules, and violators will lose their membership.
Hangingrock
Member
I am a land share owner in one shooting association. Since I no longer participate in rifle match shooting thus I do not frequent that venue. That said when I did you as an individual were responsible for your safety and the safety of others. On my property I have a very basic hand gun range thus I'm responsible for my safety. During Deer Season we have have hunters on the property those invited and others whom wonder on to the property. In the interest of safety we regulate the number of individual hunters on the property.
BRatigan
Member
At the Daytona Strickland Range its clear your weapon, actions open and stand behind the yellow line until all actions are inspected and clear and then you get the "all clear" from the RO and you can then take your targets downrange providing you don't cross the yellow safety line until the range is hot again. They have three RO's working the line. It's very well run.
twarr1
Member
The outdoor range I’m a member of has no RO. Each of our 300 members has a key. Probably 70% of the time me and my party are the only ones there. The other 30%, usually the other shooter(s) are friendly and safe. But occasionally we get the ‘strong’ but silent Rambo who doesn’t want to talk. He’ll wait until you’re finished with a string then take off walking down range. Or if you try to coordinate with him and request to go down range he just grunts and carries on fiddling with his sights or whatever he was doing.
In those cases I just leave. The range is 10 minutes from my house and I know next time I go I’ll more than likely have the place to myself.
Last year we got a lot of new shooters. Some of which are frighteningly ignorant. But at least they’re usually cooperative and willing to learn safe range procedures.
In those cases I just leave. The range is 10 minutes from my house and I know next time I go I’ll more than likely have the place to myself.
Last year we got a lot of new shooters. Some of which are frighteningly ignorant. But at least they’re usually cooperative and willing to learn safe range procedures.
Never go there again.
Mark_Mark
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my old club was dependent on the RO or members their. Some RO wants the action open, sone could care less, as long as nobody was in the lane. I personally didn’t care if the action was open.
Might the club consider slightly modifying the requirement to "or verified completion of the NC required Concealed Carry permit course?"
Teaching a class on Constitutional Carry vs. CC License? I see folks who are adamant about not being on a government list as a gun owner. As a result my advice is to take the class from any independent CHCL instructor to learn both safety and state laws, and simply not apply for the CHCL.
bangswitch
Member
What's the difference? If you've completed the course, you have the permit, which is verification you completed it. Right now, NC is not a Constitutional Carry state, although the bill has been brought to the Legislature. Since it is a private club, they do not have to inform the government of its membership (names, addresses, etc.) If you are a member of this club, you ARE a gun owner (why join otherwise?), and you know you'll at least be on the list of club members.
CC instructors in NC are state regulated, you can only be certified as an instructor by taking the state's CC instructor course from their training centers. I have completed this course, and taught Concealed Carry classes for 6 years, until I decided to stop for personal reasons.
I imagine, if NC passes Constitutional Carry, the club may have to modify their rule, which is mainly to require members to have safety training. They could just as easily require the NRA's Basic Pistol, Rifle, and/or Shotgun courses (of which I am also certified as an instructor), or some other firearms safety course.
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Mark_Mark
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I grow up in North Carolina and I don’t like the CCW and pistol permit regulations there.
Even here in Liberal Washington State, we don’t have to take classes for a CCW (CPP here) just a finger print and a $55 fee for 5 years. Our pistol purchases is a small weight period.
KahrDriving
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I have belonged to a gun club for around 15 yrs, and the rules are the same- no one ahead of firing line until all guns are unloaded and actions open and laying on bench- but, some people don’t pay attention to the rules! If I’m there I will gladly remind them of the rules- whether they like it or not.
I cannot speak to NC, but in the two states I have had permits, Virginia and Arkansas, the required course is not run by the state nor does it result in immediate permit. You must take the course independently, then provide proof of completion when you submit your application for the permit or license. Thus, for VA and AR there is a distinct difference.
Your question caused me to look at the NC page at HandGunLaw.us. Based on the process description,
It appears that the required approved course is separate from the permit process, and thus it is similar to VA and AR.
When you taught the NC course as an approved instructor, di d you automatically send course completion information to the state, or was it up to the students to submit the course completion certificate with their application?
Our club is okay on that subject, although I prefer that everybody NOT TOUCH the firearm(s)/ mags/ ammo at their station- when the range is cold.
One public range near us has concrete with a wide yellow line painted behind. First drop the mag or unload cylinder, then cylinder swings open, or slide locks back for inspection with ejection port skyward, and STEP behind the yellow line to staple a target on the range, or wait behind the painted line.
One public range near us has concrete with a wide yellow line painted behind. First drop the mag or unload cylinder, then cylinder swings open, or slide locks back for inspection with ejection port skyward, and STEP behind the yellow line to staple a target on the range, or wait behind the painted line.
gila_dog1
Member
That's how they do it at the city of Albuquerque shooting range. This is a city park with city employees running things. Everything is under strict control and the range safety officers are very serious about the rules. You mess with a gun during a cease fire, while people are down range, and you may get one stern warning. Do it again and you're out. To my knowledge, in the 25 yrs + that the shooting range park has been operating there has never been a safety incident. They've probably had to kick some people out for disobeying the rules or being jerks, but it's sure kept things safe.
Jim Watson
Member
The only outdoor lane rental range I have shot on had the yellow line plan.
I have been on a range with the flashing light system but it was for a match run in timed relays, so there was no independent action.
I have been on a range with the flashing light system but it was for a match run in timed relays, so there was no independent action.
Jim Watson
Member
Yeah, many ranges will not rent a gun to a solo customer who does not bring one of his own.
Range here got some bad ink after a disgruntled professor practiced there and then shot up a faculty meeting.
Range here got some bad ink after a disgruntled professor practiced there and then shot up a faculty meeting.
bangswitch
Member
In NC, once you have a CWP, as the state calls it, it serves as your background check and permit to purchase. You still have to fill out the ATF Form 4473, but there is no waiting period and you take the gun with you at purchase. NC's CWP also goes 5 years between renewals, and you're only fingerprinted at the initial issue, unless you let the permit expire before renewing. Then it's the whole application process all over.
When I taught the course for a CWP, it required a minimum of 8 hours of instruction on the legal aspects of concealed carry; this included the NC laws pertinent to carrying a concealed handgun, where you could and could not carry, and the violations from improper behavior when carrying, such as alcohol consumption,(zero tolerance), brandishing, etc. The remainder of the class dealt with firearm safety and operation, plus a qualification course at 7 and 15 yards; I forget the score you had to turn in, but if you could hit body mass with 80% of your shots, more or less, you passed. I taught the course of instruction over two days: one for legal, one for gun safety and qualification. I filled out the certificates of completion, which were numbered forms provided to me from the state, which the applicant took to the sheriff's dept along with their application, to get their permit. When I was teaching, it took about 4-6 weeks for the paperwork to get processed and then the applicant was notified to pick up the permit. It got a lot longer after 2019, due to the pandemic. I had quit instructing the course by then, but it was almost 3 months to get my own permit renewed back in 2021. I was told, however, that once I had applied for renewal, I could continue to carry if my current permit expired before I received my renewal. That was a change from when I was instructing, and on all my prior renewals. I've renewed by CWP 4 times since I got it.
As an aside, while I was teaching the course, there were several instructors in the state who had filled out the forms for people, without putting them through the course. When the state found out about it, they not only had their instructor's permit revoked, they were prosecuted for falsifying the forms, which are official state documents. The fee for teaching the course was up to the individual instructor, no state mandated amount. I wasn't trying to make a living from it, I only charged $50 per individual. The instructors had a fair amount of latitude regarding whether the student passed or failed the safety portion of the course, based on how they performed when handling handguns during classroom time. I used a "two strike" rule; if, during any portion of classroom work when handling a handgun, they muzzle flashed another student, their class was over and they were excused, no refund.
Mark_Mark
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we had the CCW as a instant purchase as of 3 years ago, Now we have a 10 round mag buy ban. SUCKS
One day I’ll move back to North Carolina, Just here for the money
Electrod47
Member
Simply put, No Range Officer "Means no Rules".
Since there are rules and some type of verbal supervision from range owners and operators at most places, there is an expected type of shared safety protection for users of said range. Not just the casual bond from fellow shooters. Say, ( Not unthinkable) a wrongful death should ensue from some flagrant act by a range user. What happens? I don't know. But, I'd hate to be the owner of said range when the dude that fired the errant round tells the lawyer for the family " Gee. I didn't know I was suppose to....
Since there are rules and some type of verbal supervision from range owners and operators at most places, there is an expected type of shared safety protection for users of said range. Not just the casual bond from fellow shooters. Say, ( Not unthinkable) a wrongful death should ensue from some flagrant act by a range user. What happens? I don't know. But, I'd hate to be the owner of said range when the dude that fired the errant round tells the lawyer for the family " Gee. I didn't know I was suppose to....
bangswitch
Member
Sure, the shooters are supposed to self-govern, and call out those that aren't being safe. Regardless of having a RO on the range, any range has a board posted with the range rules, however basic they may be. It certainly won't absolve the range from responsibility if someone is injured or killed, but it does go a long way to preventing someone from denying their responsibilities if they do the injury. Besides, there would be subpoenas galore for any witnesses, so the truth would be out once it got to court.
I have no problem facing someone and calling them out when I see a flagrant disregard of the range rules, nor will I hesitate to try to educate them if it is due to a lack of knowledge. In either case, the information goes to the BOD of the club to allow them to decide what to do about it. I follow the rules while on the range, and I expect anyone there while I'm there to do the same, both for my own safety as well as theirs. I can't imagine why anyone else wouldn't do the same.
230RN
2A was "political" when it was first adopted.
Action open, down on the bench, all step back N paces from the firing point.
For some guns, "empty" can be awkward, eg tubular magazines.
To me, one of the most undisciplined rascals you'll ever meet, firing line discipline should be very rigid, if for nothing else, to impress newbies with its importance.
I would be nervous on your "red light" range, but if that's the way the range members voted on it, I guess that's it. I'd be saying a Hail Mary as I went down to the targets. But that's what Hail Maries are for.
Terry, 230RN
For some guns, "empty" can be awkward, eg tubular magazines.
To me, one of the most undisciplined rascals you'll ever meet, firing line discipline should be very rigid, if for nothing else, to impress newbies with its importance.
I would be nervous on your "red light" range, but if that's the way the range members voted on it, I guess that's it. I'd be saying a Hail Mary as I went down to the targets. But that's what Hail Maries are for.
Terry, 230RN
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