Question about cast bullets 243

The sizes are cheap at 7 ish dollars. I'd get the one at .244 and .245. The body is like 50 bucks. While your ordering get the nose punch for that specific bullet and the collar so it can be used in a seating die.

savagelover said:

any thoughts-Bore rider

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My thoughts, no experence.

243 win Rifle bore is .237" to .239" by the SAAMI drawing. To reduce the as cast bullet nose diameter, use an alloy of pure lead & tin. NO antimony. 10 to 1 would be harder then WW.

Or size the nose, better? A different alloy will change the bullets body diameter. May not be good?

I think the bullet nose should engage the lands? Closing the bolt action should require some effect, i think?

243winxb said:

My thoughts, no experence.

243 win Rifle bore is .237" to .239" by the SAAMI drawing. To reduce the as cast bullet nose diameter, use an alloy of pure lead & tin. NO antimony. 10 to 1 would be harder then WW.

Or size the nose, better? A different alloy will change the bullets body diameter. May not be good?

I think the bullet nose should engage the lands? Closing the bolt action should require some effect, i think?

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10:1 has a bhn of around 12. I love that hardness but per volume tin has 1/3 the ability to increase harness as antimony. What's that going to cost to make a pot of alloy. One pound is 30 dollars at rotometals. Wheel weights have always claimed to be almost identical to Lyman #2 about bhn 16. It seems to me that a different mold would be a much cheaper option.

savagelover said:

note

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0r Noe mold?

What alloy is your mould regulated with?

I size/lube any time, with air cooled bullets.

https://noebulletmolds.com/site/pro...oading/sizing-tools/bushings/243cal-bushings/
Bushings to size bullet nose or body. I dont see a die to hold the bushing or info on the process.

AJC1 said:

different mold would be a much cheaper option.

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Buying jacketed bullets would be easier. But where's the fun in that.

Different alloys spring back to different diameters, after sizing. Softer alloy, more pure lead, smaller diameters.

243winxb said:

Buying jacketed bullets would be easier. But where's the fun in that.

Different alloys spring back to different diameters, after sizing. Softer alloy, more pure lead, smaller diameters.

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I'm kinda on the same journey, and I know tin has some important impacts on cast bullets, but I'm looking for the parts beyond fill out. Quantifying malluability is not a thing I see discussed. If casting hollowpoints I'm sure tin is a factor in making a nice mushroom and not just fragging of pieces. There are also density changes which I observe in my molds where for the same bhn my bullets are lighter than a comprobly hard bullet of Lyman #2. With this deeper understanding I can know which batches need tin and which batches don't have value added by the greater expense. When punching paper with pistol bullets I seem to be just fine. I don't know where I stand with rifle because I haven shot enough for any honest evaluation. After rifle target then either hollowpoints or using rifle bullets on critters is the next off ramp. As always I ask to understand not argue.

Youtube has a Noe sizing set up. Starts at 16 minutes in. The nose sizing starts around 23 minutes.

I used to shoot Lyman cast in a 30-06, 1903 Springfield. No bore rider.

You may be overthinking it!

Lube entire bullet with Lee liquid alox.
Size to .244 or .245. lube groves with either a NRA 50/50 lube or SPG (what I use) and gascheck.

If the bore riding section won’t chamber in the lead (throat), THEN, you’ll need to size the bore riding section.
Be sure you’re seating the bullet deep enough. .


(I know the difference between THEN and THAN. I wish others did. ).

243winxb said:

Youtube has a Noe sizing set up. Starts at 16 minutes in. The nose sizing starts around 23 minutes.

I used to shoot Lyman cast in a 30-06, 1903 Springfield. No bore rider.

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It appears pc is out for that design and maybe HTC is a better solution for that style. I've not used bore rider designs yet but do have an HTC mold from noe that I'm pcing.

By using a tapered nose die......

You can adjust OAL independent of "jam". It's not a whole lot different from a no-taper,or "straight" nose sizer.....

On either,you don't simply ram the bullet in,looking "just" to get the bore ride section up in there. Well,you could but that's leaving a whole lot on the table. Instead,you take culls/rejects and find the point,on the nose where to stop sizing....

So,if you only size say half the length of the nose,the overall loaded cartridge length is example- 2.850 OAL. Compared to sizing the nose .020" less,then your OAL length to jam is going to reflect that. Here's a quick pic....and you're gonna have to sorta trust me on this,but tapered nose die is going to self-align.... right much better.

Here's a hand drawn "print" of a match winning Eagan mould. Some moulds already have tapers built in for all this. Which is just dandy. But,real world sees making a tapered die and getting on with it.

On the far left,that .700,and .550 are what you adjust when you taper size them yourself. Imagine that being say .020" different as mentioned in post above. Hopefully you see how this changes jam point with respect to,OAL.

The,not so obvious; as you move the taper and jam length.... the height of the bullet's base changes over powder column. This is the unfair advantage you get from the tune standpoint. All fun stuff,that can have you grinning from ear to ear seeing bug hole groups.

GooseGestapo said:

If the bore riding section won’t chamber in the lead (throat), THEN, you’ll need to size the bore riding section.
Be sure you’re seating the bullet deep enough. .


(I know the difference between THEN and THAN. I wish others did. ).

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But, do you know the difference betwixt 'leade' and 'lead' ?


Okay, I'm poking fun at you: no harm intended.

BWS said:

Here's a hand drawn "print" of a match winning Eagan mould. Some moulds already have tapers built in for all this. Which is just dandy. But,real world sees making a tapered die and getting on with it.

On the far left,that .700,and .550 are what you adjust when you taper size them yourself. Imagine that being say .020" different as mentioned in post above. Hopefully you see how this changes jam point with respect to,OAL.

The,not so obvious; as you move the taper and jam length.... the height of the bullet's base changes over powder column. This is the unfair advantage you get from the tune standpoint. All fun stuff,that can have you grinning from ear to ear seeing bug hole groups.



View attachment 1130369

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I need to buy a twelve pack of your favorite and sit in your garage while you just tell me how to cast and load ast boolits. Your depth of knowledge in this area is greatly appreciated....

Tomatoe; Tomato

I suppose a leader can lead from behind!
But lead makes a better sinker!

But yeah, you’re right!

They say the guy who invented “spell check” died last week!
The funnel is tomato!

savagelover said:

Ok here's where I'm at now. I told you that my NOE mold is sized using wheel weights that will not chamber. Nor size down with the nose bushings. So I braved the cold and made some from softer alloy of about 8-9 bhn.Low and behold they chamber prefix. Now I wonder if they will lead the bore. I am going to gas check them and lube. What charge of red dot or unique do you suggest?. I want to shoot this rascal..I might be able to powder coat a few and see if they still chamber. Thanks. John

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Most molds are calibrated to wheel weights or Lyman #2 which is bhn 16 with a large part of that hardness coming from antimony which crystal structure results in less contraction from cooling netting larger bullets. The gas check helps protect your base when using lower bhn mixes, but there is a reasonable lower limit. For 35kpsi pistol bhn12 has not let me down with a plain base and I used a simular mix with a gas check in 30-30 in testing that I'm still working on. 243 being such an overbore with 50% more pressure might not tolerate soft bullets so well. If your not coating them, regular lube and adding alox might limit your scrubbing.

savagelover said:

What charge of red dot or unique do you suggest?

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I could look at my very old Lyman manual, but better if someone can post modern data. Never cast for 243.

I ended up using IMR 4895 for my 30-06 loads.

What weight is your 243 bullet?