30.06 cast bullet load suggestions

[archeryrob]

Ok, so I ordered the 311-184-FN-J5 from NOE and the plan is to use it in both 30-30 and 30.06. I already have a plan with IMR 3031 for for the 30-30. I was considering using 4198 for the 06 when looking for the Lyman mold, and would still like to use it but I only have Gordons reloading software as I am on Linux and it is not in the database.

I plan on making ladder charges for both rounds to determine the loads I like for each based on various distance of targets. Can anyone recommend a charge range for 4198 for a ladder loading. or a different powder I should try for cast bullets in 30.06. I have the lyman cast bullet book but I am second guessing everything without being able to run it through the loading software.

Gas checking, probably WW alloy and maybe powder coating. Although not against pan lubing as I do it for 45 colt now.

 

[Charlie98]

I use IMR4198 with cast bullets in both .30-30 and .308... it works like a charm. Given the larger case volume with the .30-06 cases, I would try IMR3031 there, or something like H4895, where you are allowed to reduce to 60% without problems for lighter loads. Yes, IMR3031 is fine for cast in .30-30, but your velocity might be a bit much, depending on your bullet; I use IMR3031 with jacketed bullets in .30-30.

 

[AJC1]

How about some pistol powders... 2400 20-27 grains will get er done.

 

[PapaG]

For my 1952 M70, 30-06, Lyman 311291, Hornady gas check, heat treated after sizing to .308. (javilina) alox,/beeswax lube. 24 grains 4198, a tuft of kapok over the powder, seat to touch the lands. Sub MOA at 100 yards.

 

[P Flados]

I had good results at near full power with a 170 Lee in 14" contender 30-30. I used shake & bake PC.

If you are not using PC, the 4198 might be better for both guns.

Quickload does have 4198, so I ran some stuff for you.

Cartridge          : .30-30 Win. (SAAMI)
Bullet             : .308, 180, LYM LFN GC 311407
Useable Case Capaci: 34.410 grain H2O = 2.234 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.550 inch = 64.77 mm
Barrel Length      : 22.0 inch = 558.8 mm
Powder             : Hodgdon H4198

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-52.6   30     9.00    833     282    4704   1163     57.1    3.632
-47.4   34    10.00    909     336    5592   1376     61.1    3.361
-42.1   37    11.00    986     395    6603   1601     65.1    3.122
-36.8   40    12.00   1064     460    7743   1835     68.9    2.910
-31.6   44    13.00   1141     529    9026   2075     72.5    2.720
-26.3   47    14.00   1219     604   10461   2319     75.9    2.549
-21.1   50    15.00   1296     682   12061   2565     79.2    2.393
-15.8   54    16.00   1372     765   13839   2810     82.2    2.240
-10.5   57    17.00   1448     852   15809   3052     85.0    2.103
-05.3   60    18.00   1523     942   17958   3289     87.5    1.980
+00.0   64    19.00   1597    1036   20324   3519     89.8    1.869
+05.3   67    20.00   1670    1133   22926   3741     91.9    1.768
+10.5   71    21.00   1742    1233   25784   3951     93.7    1.676
+15.8   74    22.00   1813    1336   28919   4149     95.3    1.592
+21.1   77    23.00   1883    1441   32357   4334     96.6    1.515
+26.3   81    24.00   1952    1549   36126   4502     97.7    1.445  ! Near Maximum !

Cartridge          : .30-06 Spring.  (SAAMI)
Bullet             : .308, 180, LYM LFN GC 311407
Useable Case Capaci: 64.919 grain H2O = 4.215 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.340 inch = 84.84 mm
Barrel Length      : 25.0 inch = 635.0 mm
Powder             : Hodgdon H4198

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms
-35.7   32    18.00   1287     673    8300   2826     78.6    2.934
-32.1   34    19.00   1347     737    9147   3055     80.9    2.817
-28.6   36    20.00   1406     803   10054   3284     83.1    2.710
-25.0   37    21.00   1465     872   11022   3513     85.2    2.618
-21.4   39    22.00   1524     943   12051   3741     87.1    2.512
-17.9   41    23.00   1581    1016   13145   3965     88.9    2.407
-14.3   43    24.00   1639    1091   14303   4186     90.5    2.307
-10.7   44    25.00   1695    1168   15528   4403     92.0    2.216
-07.1   46    26.00   1751    1246   16821   4614     93.4    2.130
-03.6   48    27.00   1806    1326   18185   4820     94.7    2.051
+00.0   50    28.00   1861    1407   19622   5018     95.8    1.977
+03.6   52    29.00   1914    1489   21134   5209     96.7    1.907
+07.1   53    30.00   1967    1572   22722   5391     97.6    1.842
+10.7   55    31.00   2019    1656   24391   5565     98.3    1.782
+14.3   57    32.00   2070    1741   26142   5728     98.9    1.725
+17.9   59    33.00   2120    1826   27979   5882     99.3    1.671

 

[archeryrob]

Thanks P Flados, this will be very helpful.

 

[Fatelvis]

36 grains of H4895 under any 180-200grain cast boolit w/check makes for a nice light, accurate load that will operate your Garand action reliably.

 

[Charlie98]

a nice light, accurate load that will operate your Garand action reliably.

OP didn't mention the firearms he's loading for... something tells me it's not a Garand. 36grn H4895 will cycle a Garand? My standard load was always 47grn of H or IMR4895...

 

[Fatelvis]

OP didn't mention the firearms he's loading for... something tells me it's not a Garand. 36grn H4895 will cycle a Garand? My standard load was always 47grn of H or IMR4895...

Yes, it’s just enough to operate the gas system, but not too much to deform the cast boolit. It seems the lighter the load, the more accurate it is. Any less than 36 grains, it may not operate the action.

 

[Charlie98]

Just curious... I've never gone down that far on charge weight.

 

[DocRock]

22 grains IMR4227. Derived from CE Harris’ renowned “Cast Loads for Military Surplus Rifles” article. Solid 250 yard target round.

For H4198, 25-26 grains will be your sweet spot.

 

[Fatelvis]

Just curious... I've never gone down that far on charge weight.

A lot of experimentation was done with cast Garand loads by a great member of the Cast Boolit website named Bruce B (RIP). He really did a lot of the legwork for those of us playing with light recoiling Garand loads:
https://castboolits.gunloads.com/archive/index.php/t-4389.html

 

[PapaG]

4198, 5444, even 3031. Go back years to Ed Yards articles in the American Rifleman on "Power and Accuracy with cast bullets". Helped me to become "moderately" successful

 

[Charlie98]

4198, 5444, even 3031.

That's Accurate 5744. Not nitpicking, but the OP may not be familiar with 5744 and how good it is with cast.

 

[PapaG]

That's Accurate 5744. Not nitpicking, but the OP may not be familiar with 5744 and how good it is with cast.

Right. Thanks.

 

[CoalCrackerAl]

I run 13 grains of red dot in my 30.06 and 10 grains in my 30/30 for 158 grain coated cast. They shoot pretty well.

 

[archeryrob]

22 grains IMR4227. Derived from CE Harris’ renowned “Cast Loads for Military Surplus Rifles” article. Solid 250 yard target round.

I think I settled on this when I can find it. I am using a bolt Rem 700

 

[Charlie98]

I think I settled on this when I can find it. I am using a bolt Rem 700

Just be aware, IMR4227 is really a slow pistol powder, similar to Alliant 2400. I've used it for cast rifle with decent results, mostly just exploring alternates to the IMR4198/AA5744 powders, given the current market. It works, certainly, but be very careful... it has a very quick and high pressure peak when used in rifle cartridges. I had a friend run the numbers through QuickLoad for me before I used it in the .348, just so I didn't get into trouble with it.

I still think the answer to your question is IMR4198, but I will acknowledge it, or H4198, can be hard to find right now.

Good luck, and let us know how it turns out!

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

I run 13 grains of red dot in my 30.06 and 10 grains in my 30/30 for 158 grain coated cast. They shoot pretty well.

That's Ed Harris' "The Load." 13gr. of Red Dot works in any 30-caliber service rifle round; 10gr. in hunting rifle rounds like .30WCF and .35Rem. where case capacities are smaller. Mr. Harris did also say NOT to use "The Load" in .30-40Krag (.30US).

 

[Swampman]

A lot of experimentation was done with cast Garand loads by a great member of the Cast Boolit website named Bruce B (RIP). He really did a lot of the legwork for those of us playing with light recoiling Garand loads:
https://castboolits.gunloads.com/archive/index.php/t-4389.html

I thought his M1A loads with 200+ grain cast bullets and 4831 were insane until I tried 'em.

There's a lot to be said for "soft launching" CAST bullets with slow powders.

 

[archeryrob]

I still think the answer to your question is IMR4198, but I will acknowledge it, or H4198, can be hard to find right now.

Good luck, and let us know how it turns out!

IMR 4198 was on the top of my list but I can only use Gordons Reloading software with my computer being on Linux. They do not have any load data for IMR 4198 or H4198. I was told buy someone to get to 29 grains and it should get me 2000FPS, but I would like to see the data.

The layman cast bullet book has a 180 grain starting at 24.3 @1747 and ending at 37 @ 2417 so that is probably correct.

I tried using the Equivalent powders chart that ADI put out to match thier powder to others. I see a wide area of change. Norma 200 needs 32 grains to get near 2000 and N130 throws low burn rate warnings until I get it up to 35 grains.
http://www.adi-powders.com.au/powder-equivalents/

I guess that just leaves it to ladder rounds as cast bullets are cheap.

 

[Charlie98]

IMR 4198 was on the top of my list but I can only use Gordons Reloading software with my computer being on Linux. They do not have any load data for IMR 4198 or H4198. I was told buy someone to get to 29 grains and it should get me 2000FPS, but I would like to see the data.

I have actual physical data from my firearms... I consider IMR4198 one of the more forgiving powders out there, and a natural match for cast. PM me if you have specific questions.